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Frank Vogel

Kyhoward

Blue Chip Prospect
Feb 3, 2018
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Poster bthaunert asked in another thread, What excites you about Frank Vogel being the next coach. This has got to stop. Here you go:

Vogels’ Background:

Started playing college ball at Div III Juniata College, but later transferred to the University of Kentucky so he could under Rick Pitino. He became a team manager and later played on the JV team with Nazr Muhammed. His role, in part, was to drive Pitino to speeches which became a perfect setting to pick Pitino’s brain and absorb everything that he said.

What others have said about Vogel

  • He is comfortable and considerate in media settings and has an egoless nature.
  • He will do whatever the Lakers need in terms of community relations and pushing the brand.
  • Has a sharp defensive mind whose teams have led the NBA in deficiency efficiency 3 times
  • He wants to force turnovers and opponents into the worst shot available.
  • He does not allow for doubt to seep in and pushes a togetherness mentality
  • Paul George – “one of the most influential men in my life.”
  • David West – “unwavering optimism and belief” “Really close to his players. We have his back 100%and I think that everybody in this locker room in willing to do whatever for Frank. We are ready to go to war for him.”
From Rick Pitino
  • So proud of my UK player and assistant Frank Vogel. Frank has it all; brilliant, humble, hard working and all about Team!
  • Student managers at Kentucky “aren’t just people who carry towels and give players water. Vogel did those things. But he did more. Like all of Kentucky’s managers, he ran drills in practice. He worked with players on individual skill development.”
  • If the Celtics were preparing for Michael Jordan’s Bulls, Pitino wanted Vogel’s input. He pitched specific scenarios and asked Vogel if he thought a particular defensive strategy would work.
  • “We just relied on his opinion so much, we trusted his judgment, we trusted his opinion, we knew he wasn’t just watching one film. You could ask him anything, and he was on it.”
  • - Vogel, Pitino said, asked not what the Kentucky program could do for him. He was focused on giving. “We never had to ask him to do more,” Pitino said. “He just did it. He was a self-starter.”
 
I'll respond since I'm the one you quoted. Here are 2 major reasons I do not get the fascination with this guy:

1. He has been in coaching for 24 years, none if it at the college level. That has not been a recipe for success.

2. Since 2014, he has done the following:

2015 - missed playoffs
2016 - lost in first round
2017 - missed playoffs
2018 - missed playoffs
2019 - didn't coach
2020 - won the NBA title in the bubble with 2 first team All NBA guys
2021 - lost in first round
2022 - missed playoffs
2023 - didn't coach
2024 - 31-22 with one of the most talented teams in the NBA

So, again, I'll ask...outside of him being a student at UK in the mid 90's, what about that is exciting?
 
I'll respond since I'm the one you quoted. Here are 2 major reasons I do not get the fascination with this guy:

1. He has been in coaching for 24 years, none if it at the college level. That has not been a recipe for success.

2. Since 2014, he has done the following:

2015 - missed playoffs
2016 - lost in first round
2017 - missed playoffs
2018 - missed playoffs
2019 - didn't coach
2020 - won the NBA title in the bubble with 2 first team All NBA guys
2021 - lost in first round
2022 - missed playoffs
2023 - didn't coach
2024 - 31-22 with one of the most talented teams in the NBA

So, again, I'll ask...outside of him being a student at UK in the mid 90's, what about that is exciting?
This. He's not a college guy. He wouldn't even know the first thing about recruiting in this new transfer portal environment.
 
I'll respond since I'm the one you quoted. Here are 2 major reasons I do not get the fascination with this guy:

1. He has been in coaching for 24 years, none if it at the college level. That has not been a recipe for success.

2. Since 2014, he has done the following:

2015 - missed playoffs
2016 - lost in first round
2017 - missed playoffs
2018 - missed playoffs
2019 - didn't coach
2020 - won the NBA title in the bubble with 2 first team All NBA guys
2021 - lost in first round
2022 - missed playoffs
2023 - didn't coach
2024 - 31-22 with one of the most talented teams in the NBA

So, again, I'll ask...outside of him being a student at UK in the mid 90's, what about that is exciting?
Vogel previously being at UK has EVERYTHING to do with some posters' fascination with him being the next coach, whenver that might be
 
Poster bthaunert asked in another thread, What excites you about Frank Vogel being the next coach. This has got to stop. Here you go:

Vogels’ Background:

Started playing college ball at Div III Juniata College, but later transferred to the University of Kentucky so he could under Rick Pitino. He became a team manager and later played on the JV team with Nazr Muhammed. His role, in part, was to drive Pitino to speeches which became a perfect setting to pick Pitino’s brain and absorb everything that he said.

What others have said about Vogel

  • He is comfortable and considerate in media settings and has an egoless nature.
  • He will do whatever the Lakers need in terms of community relations and pushing the brand.
  • Has a sharp defensive mind whose teams have led the NBA in deficiency efficiency 3 times
  • He wants to force turnovers and opponents into the worst shot available.
  • He does not allow for doubt to seep in and pushes a togetherness mentality
  • Paul George – “one of the most influential men in my life.”
  • David West – “unwavering optimism and belief” “Really close to his players. We have his back 100%and I think that everybody in this locker room in willing to do whatever for Frank. We are ready to go to war for him.”
From Rick Pitino
  • So proud of my UK player and assistant Frank Vogel. Frank has it all; brilliant, humble, hard working and all about Team!
  • Student managers at Kentucky “aren’t just people who carry towels and give players water. Vogel did those things. But he did more. Like all of Kentucky’s managers, he ran drills in practice. He worked with players on individual skill development.”
  • If the Celtics were preparing for Michael Jordan’s Bulls, Pitino wanted Vogel’s input. He pitched specific scenarios and asked Vogel if he thought a particular defensive strategy would work.
  • “We just relied on his opinion so much, we trusted his judgment, we trusted his opinion, we knew he wasn’t just watching one film. You could ask him anything, and he was on it.”
  • - Vogel, Pitino said, asked not what the Kentucky program could do for him. He was focused on giving. “We never had to ask him to do more,” Pitino said. “He just did it. He was a self-starter.”
No Way Do Not Want GIF
 
Which I will never understand. You know how some programs go into the tank...they focus on getting someone "from the family" and make a bad hire.

And I wonder why OP underlined ego less. Pitino had and has a huge ego. Cal had and has a huge ego. They combined for 2 titles and 7 final fours in their tenured here. Egos are healthy when you are winning.

I agree with you on vogul. We see the same fascination with pope on here. It's odd.
 
He might work if he had the right assistants. Like several others mentioned, he'd be a long shot.
 
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Which I will never understand. You know how some programs go into the tank...they focus on getting someone "from the family" and make a bad hire.

I'll respond since I'm the one you quoted. Here are 2 major reasons I do not get the fascination with this guy:

1. He has been in coaching for 24 years, none if it at the college level. That has not been a recipe for success.

2. Since 2014, he has done the following:

2015 - missed playoffs
2016 - lost in first round
2017 - missed playoffs
2018 - missed playoffs
2019 - didn't coach
2020 - won the NBA title in the bubble with 2 first team All NBA guys
2021 - lost in first round
2022 - missed playoffs
2023 - didn't coach
2024 - 31-22 with one of the most talented teams in the NBA

So, again, I'll ask...outside of him being a student at UK in the mid 90's, what about that is exciting?
Major hurdles are no college coaching experience and has not recruited - I agree with you!!

Just think that he is an impressive individual who deserves some consideration and a 5-minute phone call. As far as his NBA record, he coached Indiana and Orlando when they had very little talent. There are great college coaches today who may not have stellar records as they are moribund programs where it is hard to recruit.

He is a Rick Pitino disciple and was involved as a player, team manager, and coach at UK. He has seen the pressure of the job up close for a few years. All of these are positives. I am not advocating that just because he has had some involvement with the program years ago, he should be hired, just considered! The next coach may or may not have a UK background and that is fine with me. Just want the best and most qualified!
 
I would take Mark Pope over Vogul at this point.
I think Pope, like Vogel, should be on the list. I am not demanding that the next head coach have a UK background. Neither should a UK background cause you to not be considered. I was just trying to provide some information on Vogel that most may not have seen before. Hoping that the scenario for needing a new coach occurs soon!
 
I'll respond since I'm the one you quoted. Here are 2 major reasons I do not get the fascination with this guy:

1. He has been in coaching for 24 years, none if it at the college level. That has not been a recipe for success.

2. Since 2014, he has done the following:

2015 - missed playoffs
2016 - lost in first round
2017 - missed playoffs
2018 - missed playoffs
2019 - didn't coach
2020 - won the NBA title in the bubble with 2 first team All NBA guys
2021 - lost in first round
2022 - missed playoffs
2023 - didn't coach
2024 - 31-22 with one of the most talented teams in the NBA

So, again, I'll ask...outside of him being a student at UK in the mid 90's, what about that is exciting?
He would still win more then Cal is a start
 
And I wonder why OP underlined ego less. Pitino had and has a huge ego. Cal had and has a huge ego. They combined for 2 titles and 7 final fours in their tenured here. Egos are healthy when you are winning.

I agree with you on vogul. We see the same fascination with pope on here. It's odd.
you are correct 1987, Pitino had a huge ego too! I am just tired of the Cal ego at this point.
 
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Vogel previously being at UK has EVERYTHING to do with some posters' fascination with him being the next coach, whenver that might be

Same reason we keep seeing Mark Pope’s name thrown around.

If the BYU coach was named Mark Smith, didn’t play at UK and who hasn’t won an NCAA tournament game was mentioned as a candidate to coach at UK, that suggestion would be laughed off the internet.

Some people have this weird thing where they think it’s still 50 years ago and the coaches must have ties to the school. Sound like IU fans, TBH.
 
Major hurdles are no college coaching experience and has not recruited - I agree with you!!

Just think that he is an impressive individual who deserves some consideration and a 5-minute phone call. As far as his NBA record, he coached Indiana and Orlando when they had very little talent. There are great college coaches today who may not have stellar records as they are moribund programs where it is hard to recruit.

He is a Rick Pitino disciple and was involved as a player, team manager, and coach at UK. He has seen the pressure of the job up close for a few years. All of these are positives. I am not advocating that just because he has had some involvement with the program years ago, he should be hired, just considered! The next coach may or may not have a UK background and that is fine with me. Just want the best and most qualified!
For clarification...he was never a coach at UK. He was a manager.

You and I just disagree on if we think he's the best and most qualified.
 
This is an awful take. Pope has done nothing and if he didn’t go to UK everyone would laugh at this
I was just saying that at this point, I would take Pope over Vogul. Not that I want Pope over ANYONE ELSE.

Reading comprehension isn't your strong suit. Preconceived notions prevail for you I see.

Now who had the "awful take"??? Look in the mirror.
 
I think Pope, like Vogel, should be on the list. I am not demanding that the next head coach have a UK background. Neither should a UK background cause you to not be considered. I was just trying to provide some information on Vogel that most may not have seen before. Hoping that the scenario for needing a new coach occurs soon!
Oh, I agree totally.

Thanks for the synopsis on Vogul. He is another in a long line of great UK alums!!!
 
For clarification...he was never a coach at UK. He was a manager.

You and I just disagree on if we think he's the best and most qualified.
I did not say he was the best and most qualified!
I am sure the ones in charge of interviewing and eventually hiring the next head coach will have a long list of candidates to sort through. Vogel may not even be considered and he may not even be interested. The original post was to just give my $.02 worth, like it or not. What names would be on your list?. I will not judge who you may consider. Is not that the reason for this forum , to see other poster’s opinions?
 
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He is a Rick Pitino disciple and was involved as a player, team manager, and coach at UK.
LOL at “disciple”. The dude just spent one year here as a student manager and apparently playing on that bogus thing called the “JV team” that ole Rick made up. That’s a mighty low bar for achieving disciple status.

Vogel has no college coaching experience whatsoever. Not even as a GA or assistant. He’s never dealt with recruiting or any of the other unique little annoyances that come with a college job. And he’s already got a mighty cushy lucrative life in in the NBA world that he actually does know.

So what makes you think he would even be interested in the UK job?
 
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I’d take anyone mentioned on this whole thread instead of Calapari
I really do think he’s off his rocker
Just doing weird crap
 
LOL at calling him a Pitino “disciple”. He’s just a dude who spent one year here as a student manager and apparently playing on that bogus thing called the “JV team” that ole Rick just made up. That’s a mighty low bar for achieving “disciple” status.

Vogel has no college coaching experience whatsoever. Not even as a GA or assistant. He’s never dealt with recruiting or any of the other unique little annoyances that come with a college job.

And he’s already got a mighty cushy lucrative life in in the NBA world that he actually does know. So what makes you think he would even be interested in the UK job?
I don’t know that he is interested and have stated that.
I also stated he had no recruiting experience and no head coaching on the college level
And he did work with Pitino at Boston in addition to UK
You must not have read all my posts
Sort of regret starting this thread since so many seem to want to argue rather then consider my points. Did not know it would be a waste of my time putting together the original post. Think I will read posts rather than participate from now on.
 
I don’t know that he is interested and have stated that.
I also stated he had no recruiting experience and no head coaching on the college level
And he did work with Pitino at Boston in addition to UK
You must not have read all my posts
Sort of regret starting this thread since so many seem to want to argue rather then consider my points. Did not know it would be a waste of my time putting together the original post. Think I will read posts rather than participate from now on.
I actually think it's a good topic. Vogel would be an intriguing choice. We see guys adapt to the NBA from college all the time. Donovan did it. So why wouldn't the reverse be true?

And to the point that some others brought up about Vogel's NBA resume (@bthaunert ) and how that might dissuade UK from hiring him - how's Billy Donovan's resume since he went to the NBA?

Four first round losses, two missed playoffs, one semi-finals appearance (in his first year).

Does that mean Donovan forgot how to coach or doesn't have what it takes to return to college? Of course not. Vogel is a professional, and he would make the adjustment to college just fine, just like college coaches who make the adjustment to the NBA.

I don't get the opposition to Vogel. He's just as risky as Scott Drew. The only guy who towers above all the names is Hurley, and up until about two or three years ago, none of our fans would have seriously considered him as a viable option.
 
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Sort of regret starting this thread since so many seem to want to argue rather then consider my points.
In the very first line of this thread you called out another poster by name and said his view “has got to stop.” You first set an argumentative tone from the very beginning, so don’t complain about others responding in kind.

and no head coaching on the college level

No need to keep using the “head” qualifier. He does not have ANY sort of college coaching experience. Not as as an assistant. Not even as a GA. Nothing.
 
I'll respond since I'm the one you quoted. Here are 2 major reasons I do not get the fascination with this guy:

1. He has been in coaching for 24 years, none if it at the college level. That has not been a recipe for success.

2. Since 2014, he has done the following:

2015 - missed playoffs
2016 - lost in first round
2017 - missed playoffs
2018 - missed playoffs
2019 - didn't coach
2020 - won the NBA title in the bubble with 2 first team All NBA guys
2021 - lost in first round
2022 - missed playoffs
2023 - didn't coach
2024 - 31-22 with one of the most talented teams in the NBA

So, again, I'll ask...outside of him being a student at UK in the mid 90's, what about that is exciting?
The NBA way more than college is about players/talent. If you don’t have it you won’t win!
 
You just claimed Donovan adapted to the NBA and trashed his NBA record all in 1 post.

Donovan has not been good in the NBA and is likely headed towards being fired from the Bulls. His first year was good, when he had Durant, Westbrook, and I believe Harden was on that team. They had like a 3-0 lead on the Warriors IIRC, then completely fell apart and gave the series and likely championship away. He has never been past the 1st rd of the playoffs since. However, Donovan had slipped a lot at FL his last several years. So he may just be burnt out.

Other than Larry Brown, has any coach ever had championship success at both levels?

NBA and college are 2 different animals. NBA coaches do little to 0 recruiting. They don't deal with much in terms of eligibility or academics. They don't really have to deal with handlers or parents and all that drama. They don't deal with NIL or deal with the budget constraints of college sports. They actually get most of their off-season off. College coaches still do a lot of recruiting and working during the off-season.

However, they travel a lot more, have much longer seasons, have players with massive egos and salaries. They don't have anywhere near as much control as college coaches. Their teams are often built for them and they have to coach what they have.

A coach is likely going to have the most success at the level he knows and is comfortable with. For Vogel, that is likely the NBA. For Donovan, it was clearly college.
I'm not reading this.

You're a complete tool.

But I appreciate the paragraphs you invested. Maybe someone will come along and read it someday.
 
In the very first line of this thread you called out another poster by name and said his view “has got to stop.” You first set an argumentative tone from the very beginning, so don’t complain about others responding in kind.



No need to keep using the “head” qualifier. He does not have ANY sort of college coaching experience. Not as as an assistant. Not even as a GA. Nothing.
Actually bthaunert stated that in his post and I just copied it there. I got you on ignore from now on so rant away!
 
I actually think it's a good topic. Vogel would be an intriguing choice. We see guys adapt to the NBA from college all the time. Donovan did it. So why wouldn't the reverse be true?

And to the point that some others brought up about Vogel's NBA resume (@bthaunert ) and how that might dissuade UK from hiring him - how's Billy Donovan's resume since he went to the NBA?

Four first round losses, two missed playoffs, one semi-finals appearance (in his first year).

Does that mean Donovan forgot how to coach or doesn't have what it takes to return to college? Of course not. Vogel is a professional, and he would make the adjustment to college just fine, just like college coaches who make the adjustment to the NBA.

I don't get the opposition to Vogel. He's just as risky as Scott Drew. The only guy who towers above all the names is Hurley, and up until about two or three years ago, none of our fans would have seriously considered him as a viable option.
HUGE difference between Donovan and Vogel. Donovan has 21 years of college coaching experience, including 2 titles, 1 runner up and an additional Final Four. He has proven that he can win at the highest level in college.
One of my biggest oppositions to Vogel is that he has no college experience. We have seen over and over again how that doesn't work with guys like Mike Woodson, Patrick Ewing, Mike Dunleavy, Avery Johnson, etc. The only guy I can think of that had any success moving to college for the first time after an extensive NBA career is Eric Musselman.
 
I think Pope, like Vogel, should be on the list. I am not demanding that the next head coach have a UK background. Neither should a UK background cause you to not be considered. I was just trying to provide some information on Vogel that most may not have seen before. Hoping that the scenario for needing a new coach occurs soon!
Don't want Pope but Pope has his dream job he's never leaving.
 
I did not say he was the best and most qualified!
I am sure the ones in charge of interviewing and eventually hiring the next head coach will have a long list of candidates to sort through. Vogel may not even be considered and he may not even be interested. The original post was to just give my $.02 worth, like it or not. What names would be on your list?. I will not judge who you may consider. Is not that the reason for this forum , to see other poster’s opinions?
Of course it's the reason for this forum. But people will always have opposing views, and as long as it's done without personally attacking the other person, name calling, etc., I have no problem with it. Again, you and I just disagree. We both state our points of view. I'm not attacking you and you're not attacking me. I enjoy a good debate.

As for my list, I would not "make people say no" like some on here say. IMO, there is no reason to go after a guy like Jay Wright and Brad Stevens. In fact, I think the deeper you get in a search and the more people that say no, the more people wonder what's wrong. This happened with the BCG hire.

I believe that Bruce Pearl would crush it here. At all 4 of his coaching stops, he's had the most successful season in that programs history. He's yet to win it all, so he is still hungry for the elusive national title. I believe he feels he still has something to prove and would do everything in his power to din it all here. The biggest issue is his age and I know Mitch would not consider him.
 
You just claimed Donovan adapted to the NBA and trashed his NBA record all in 1 post.

Donovan has not been good in the NBA and is likely headed towards being fired from the Bulls. His first year was good, when he had Durant, Westbrook, and I believe Harden was on that team. They had like a 3-0 lead on the Warriors IIRC, then completely fell apart and gave the series and likely championship away. He has never been past the 1st rd of the playoffs since. However, Donovan had slipped a lot at FL his last several years. So he may just be burnt out.
Donovan went Elite Eight, Elite Eight, Elite Eight, Final Four, missed the tournament in his final five seasons. I don't think he slipped a lot.
 
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We need a young guy in his 40s. One that understands the landscape and is hungry. Give him 3 years and maybe create our future coach that could be here for 15 years. These older guys may give you 5 years and then you’re back in the same boat.
 
Maybe if we hire Vogel, Bruce Pearl, Donovan, Wright, Oats and Musselman, everyone would be happy and we could put a winner on the court. Oh and Pitino
 
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