Does the starters matter?

[cathouse]

What's Reed's record as a starter?

This is a strawman argument that needs to go away.

The games Reed started DJ, along with Adou and some of the big guys were unavailable to play.

EVERY game that DJ has started, Reed has been available to play meaningful minutes and has contributed in a big way.

You are not comparing apples to apples when you and others keep repeating this false negative about Reed starting games.

 

[Thats An Awful Idea]

This is a strawman argument that needs to go away.

The games Reed started DJ, along with Adou and some of the big guys were unavailable to play.

EVERY game that DJ has started, Reed has been available to play meaningful minutes and has contributed in a big way.

You are not comparing apples to apples when you and others keep repeating this false negative about Reed starting games.

Lol, which ones specifically?

DJ is the better starter. Reed is the better bench player. There has been someone in every game DJ started as well, yet he didn't go 1-4.

 

[cathouse]

I voted no because every coach I ever played for said that who finishes the game on the floor is exponentially more important than who is on the floor to start it.

That's just coach speak BS.

There is not a top player worth his salt that doesn't want to start.

Go listen to Rob tell the media how difficult it was for him to accept the fact that he wouldn't be starting. And it still eats at him.

 

[cathouse]

Lol, which ones specifically?

DJ is the better starter. Reed is the better bench player. There has been someone in every game DJ started as well, yet he didn't go 1-4.

What are you talking about? DJ WASN'T available to play in the games Reed started.

Reed played in every game DJ has started. Which one??? Lol.

 

[UK90]

This is akin to asking if the first few minutes of each half matters. Yes, of course they do. So why handicap yourself with slow starts if you know how to fix it?

 

[bucsrule8872]

From a statistical perspective, you assume scoring is uniformly distributed, so yes it does still mean an extra 0.5 possessions, but that extra 1/2 possession comes at the end of the game, not the start of it. But actually I think we often lose the tip.

I guess you missed the LOL at the end of my little quip.

 

[Thats An Awful Idea]

What are you talking about? DJ WASN'T available to play in the games Reed started.

Reed played in every game DJ has started. Which one??? Lol.

Lol, not having DJ is the excuse for losing to UNCw now. If Reed is so dependent on having DJ, maybe it's best DJ starts. I've never heard him complain about not having certain players.

 

[Thats An Awful Idea]

What are you talking about? DJ WASN'T available to play in the games Reed started.

Reed played in every game DJ has started. Which one??? Lol.

Also, Reed started against Zaga. DJ came off the bench. We still lost.

 

[UK90]

This is the dumbest argument used by the “starters don’t matter” crowd.

It’s not really a “crowd”, instead it’s just one dope who keeps making that argument under many different names. The weirdo has started countless different accounts here.

This newest “awful” name is just the one he’s using today, he’ll probably be using a different handle tomorrow.

 

[cathouse]

Also, Reed started against Zaga. DJ came off the bench. We still lost.

That loss certainly wasn't Reed's fault. And DJ was nowhere near a 100%.

The real truth is we NEED both of them if this team is going to make it very far in the tournament.

 

[reggis1]

This is the dumbest argument used by the “starters don’t matter” crowd.

When you have a team like uk it doesn't matter who starts or not especially this year

 

[fatguy87]

Say Mitchell is still recovering and/or laud him for his team commitment and then slide him to the bench. Start Edwards at the 4 and bring in Shep/Dilly to the starting lineup.

Cal could have his cake and eat it to with that decision.

 

[Big Foot 275]

It’s not really a “crowd”, instead it’s just one dope who keeps making that argument under many different names. The weirdo has started countless different accounts here.

This newest “awful” name is just the one he’s using today, he’ll probably be using a different handle tomorrow.

It’s not really a “crowd”, instead it’s just one dope who keeps making that argument under many different names. The weirdo has started countless different accounts here.

This newest “awful” name is just the one he’s using today, he’ll probably be using a different handle tomorrow.

It's way past time for the mods to get rid of the dope.

 

[fatguy87]

Regarding starting, the constituency of the lineup matters the most. We don't want to play a slug of a lineup for a few minutes. That's just shooting ourselves in the foot.

Otherwise, the choice is between Reed, for example, playing 16-17 minutes straight to end the half vs. playing 8-10 and then getting a break halfway through, and then closing the half. If he plays more "tired" minutes with the former than the latter, the latter would be optimal.

 

[Thats An Awful Idea]

That loss certainly wasn't Reed's fault. And DJ was nowhere near a 100%.

The real truth is we NEED both of them if this team is going to make it very far in the tournament.

I agree we need both, but we need Reed coming off the bench. DJ should be starting. It just works better.

 

[cats2010]

Also, Reed started against Zaga. DJ came off the bench. We still lost.

I’m one that has stated I’m fine with DJ starting but Reed needs to start alongside him. DJ plays better in a 3 guard set anyway. Reed/DJ/Reeves/edwards/Ugo would be a better starting lineup. While I prefer Z I’d be happy with him and Dillingham coming in at the 17:00 mark for Ugo and wagner.

what cal needs to stop doing is sticking with the same 5 starting the 2nd half that also starts the game regardless of performance. It’s almost an unwritten rule with him and completely stupid. LSU 9 point lead cut to 2 in the blink of an eye and that was after the starters pushed the lead from 9-15 with back to back 3’s.

In the end I just don’t trust cal to ever make a smart decision.

 

[ck-2]

When you have a team like uk it doesn't matter who starts or not especially this year

A team like UK? You talk like this is the 2015 version. This team just barely beat a sub .500 Arkansas team.

 

[reggis1]

This also makes no sense. Why didn’t Cal just bring Wall and Cousins off the bench?
The saying “ don’t argue with an idiot, because they’ll just drag you down to their level and beat you with experience “ sure applies to anyone who says starting lineups don’t matter and the best players don’t need to start.
Cal knows who the best players on this team are because “most” lead in mins played. He just doesn’t start them out of loyalties, promises, or some agenda. He can’t stand to be questioned or proven wrong. So the minute the media and analysts started pointing out his starting five was one of if not his worst lineup I knew he’d dig his heels in. Putting Rob and Reed in at the 17-18 min mark just proves he knows.
What’s worse is morons on this board defending him.

 

[kywildcatsfannumber1]

It most definitely matters having your best players on the floor to get off to a good start. I never buy into the narrative that it only matters who gets the most minutes in the game as if we draw names out of a cap to determine the starting 5 like Billy Martin would do with the Yankees. If you are good enough to get the majority of playing time, then you are good enough to start. All it takes is for a couple of cheap fouls and a bad start in the NCAA Tournament to end your season.

That said, it is late in the season though to be shaking things up with the starting lineup and potentially screw with the chemistry of some players. Have a quick trigger to pull someone early before the game gets too out of hand. Some players have off nights, so the 5 that finish may vary based on the outcome of the game.

 

[HagginHall1999]

The starting 5 matters. If we started Canada, Watkins, Darbyshire, Horn and Hart we'd certainly see a difference.

In all seriousness I've seen arguments (statistically) in small sets for both pro/con what Cal has chosen to do.

However, I haven't see it in bulk. Cal generally subs at 16:00-17:00. I'd love to see the score of all the games in a +/- format from starting to sub vs. +/- for same 3-4 minutes after sub.

I'd like to see another guard at 3 spot. No problem with DJ starting. I'd make a change between Edwards/Adou...it is either or for me, not both. Rob is a sparkplug and is ideal coming off the bench IMHO. Reed is a steady hand and the best floor spacer on the team...good candidate to start.

 

[Thats An Awful Idea]

I’m one that has stated I’m fine with DJ starting but Reed needs to start alongside him. DJ plays better in a 3 guard set anyway. Reed/DJ/Reeves/edwards/Ugo would be a better starting lineup. While I prefer Z I’d be happy with him and Dillingham coming in at the 17:00 mark for Ugo and wagner.

what cal needs to stop doing is sticking with the same 5 starting the 2nd half that also starts the game regardless of performance. It’s almost an unwritten rule with him and completely stupid. LSU 9 point lead cut to 2 in the blink of an eye and that was after the starters pushed the lead from 9-15 with back to back 3’s.

In the end I just don’t trust cal to ever make a smart decision.

Nope, Reed needs to come off the bench. He is 1-4 starting. 20-4 off the bench.

Cal needs to keep doing what has worked for us the majority of the season. He needs to not listen to ignorant fans who are just trying to push their favorite player.

He doesn't need or require your trust. You're just a meaningless fan on a message board!

 

[Runnin'Ramel]

What's Reed's record as a starter?

You can't count UNCW against Reed. It was his first game taking the PG duties. Wagner was out - even if he shouldn't start, you need him off the bench to provide help. Ugo was out. Z was out. Bradshaw's first game back (13 minutes, took 1 shot). UK had 6 guys to play, essentially. In other words, the team was a MESS.

But yeah, go ahead and say Reed shouldn't start because UK lost to UNCW early in the season with a patchwork roster of unhealthy guys. LOL.

Oh, and Edwards was 4/14 from the field and shot UK out of the game.

Reed was 9/17 for 25 points and had to play 39 minutes.

 

[Runnin'Ramel]

People saying Reed is 1-4 as a starter are the type of ignorant fools I cannot tolerate. That simply ignores so many factors in a TEAM sport. Good Lord.

I've reminded you how the UNCW game went above, with a depleted roster, Edwards taking 14 shots, etc. I don't have time to address the other 3 losses, but pinning those on Reed Sheppard is laughable.

 

[cathouse]

People saying Reed is 1-4 as a starter are the type of ignorant fools I cannot tolerate. That simply ignores so many factors in a TEAM sport. Good Lord.

I've reminded you how the UNCW game went above, with a depleted roster, Edwards taking 14 shots, etc. I don't have time to address the other 3 losses, but pinning those on Reed Sheppard is laughable.

Save your breath.

I finally figured out I was trying to convince a troll. Joined the board this past week.

New name. Old poster. Still trolling UK fans.

 

[cats2010]

Nope, Reed needs to come off the bench. He is 1-4 starting. 20-4 off the bench.

Cal needs to keep doing what has worked for us the majority of the season. He needs to not listen to ignorant fans who are just trying to push their favorite player.

He doesn't need or require your trust. You're just a meaningless fan on a message board!

What is our record with both DJ and Reed starting? I’d also like to point out, like me, your nothing more than a fan on a message board but I likely have something you don’t which is experience actually coaching basketball. Reed being a favorite player has zilch to do with anything, he is arguably our best player in terms of importance to the team. That player ALWAYS starts. Not sometimes, not when the coach has a gut feeling, not because there is an injury but ALWAYS!!!!!!! There probably isn’t a D1 school that would not have Reed starting except your idiot idol.

 

[KFuqua]

Save your breath.

I finally figured out I was trying to convince a troll. Joined the board this past week.

New name. Old poster. Still trolling UK fans.

Yeah, I put them on ignore yesterday afternoon.

 

[Thats An Awful Idea]

What is our record with both DJ and Reed starting? I’d also like to point out, like me, your nothing more than a fan on a message board but I likely have something you don’t which is experience actually coaching basketball. Reed being a favorite player has zilch to do with anything, he is arguably our best player in terms of importance to the team. That player ALWAYS starts. Not sometimes, not when the coach has a gut feeling, not because there is an injury but ALWAYS!!!!!!! There probably isn’t a D1 school that would not have Reed starting except your idiot idol.

Thank God we haven't done it. Reed starting is almost a guaranteed loss.

I have coached, and I know sometimes the most important player is the 6th man. Lamb was very similar. We needed his spark off the bench far more than him starting, even though he was our best guard.

Plenty of schools that wanted to win wouldn't start Reed. He is 1-4.

People saying Reed is 1-4 as a starter are the type of ignorant fools I cannot tolerate. That simply ignores so many factors in a TEAM sport. Good Lord.

I've reminded you how the UNCW game went above, with a depleted roster, Edwards taking 14 shots, etc. I don't have time to address the other 3 losses, but pinning those on Reed Sheppard is laughable.

What's Reed's record as a starter?

You can't count UNCW against Reed. It was his first game taking the PG duties. Wagner was out - even if he shouldn't start, you need him off the bench to provide help. Ugo was out. Z was out. Bradshaw's first game back (13 minutes, took 1 shot). UK had 6 guys to play, essentially. In other words, the team was a MESS.

But yeah, go ahead and say Reed shouldn't start because UK lost to UNCW early in the season with a patchwork roster of unhealthy guys. LOL.

Oh, and Edwards was 4/14 from the field and shot UK out of the game.

Reed was 9/17 for 25 points and had to play 39 minutes.

Lol, so we can't count the losses Reed started in? 🤣

Dude just isn't a starter. There is nothing wrong with that. In fact, there have been statements that Reed told Cal he was more comfortable coming off the bench, but our "fans" know best! 😂

 

[Creed Bratton]

I get the whole it's not who starts but finishes argument but if we are falling behind the first 4-5 minutes of each half then it's an issue. This team's defense struggles to string enough stops to come from behind so every advantage we gain by jumping out to a lead instead of playing out of a hole is huge IMO.

 

[BStockfan01]

Of course starters matter its literally how you start the game, common strategy suggest starting your best players as to outplay your opponent. The starters should be reed rob reeves tre Z/Ugo/AB its proven to be the best lineup

 

[Creed Bratton]

Nope, Reed needs to come off the bench. He is 1-4 starting. 20-4 off the bench.

Cal needs to keep doing what has worked for us the majority of the season. He needs to not listen to ignorant fans who are just trying to push their favorite player.

He doesn't need or require your trust. You're just a meaningless fan on a message board!

Sadly I am starting to think that is the way he looks at fans. However, we are the reason he makes 10 million a year because without fans watching UK basketball those funds to pay him that kind of money wouldn't be there.

 

[cathouse]

I get the whole it's not who starts but finishes argument but if we are falling behind the first 4-5 minutes of each half then it's an issue. This team's defense struggles to string enough stops to come from behind so every advantage we gain by jumping out to a lead instead of playing out of a hole is huge IMO.

That's just the Benny in you talking now. Lol.

Lol at these people who think it is ok to keep falling behind at the start of every game and then blowing a lead in the first 5 minutes of the second half.

It matters.

 

[Thats An Awful Idea]

Sadly I am starting to think that is the way he looks at fans. However, we are the reason he makes 10 million a year because without fans watching UK basketball those funds to pay him that kind of money wouldn't be there.

He is paid that much because of media contracts, which are set currently whether fans watch or not. UK isn't going to change from being a draw because of some losers on a message board aren't satisfied.

Literally, all of UK looks at you like that, as do most all athletic departments around the country, or really any business. You all don't matter a fraction of what you think. Nor do I, but I am at least able to see that.

 

[Creed Bratton]

He is paid that much because of media contracts, which are set currently whether fans watch or not. UK isn't going to change from being a draw because of some losers on a message board aren't satisfied.

Literally, all of UK looks at you like that, as do most all athletic departments around the country, or really any business. You all don't matter a fraction of what you think. Nor do I, but I am at least able to see that.

Well genius if the fans quit watching, then the sponsors will quit paying the media sources to advertise because it is a waste of their advertising dollars. Just out of curiosity how do you know how all of UK and other athletic departments look at UK fans? I don't think you have any idea how they look at UK fans so it seems like you are either a liar or.....full of crap.

 

[Thats An Awful Idea]

Well genius if the fans quit watching, then the sponsors will quit paying the media sources to advertise because it is a waste of their advertising dollars. Just out of curiosity how do you know how all of UK and other athletic departments look at UK fans? I don't think you have any idea how they look at UK fans so it seems like you are either a liar or.....full of crap.

Not really. There are plenty of people that watch our games that aren't avid UK fans. A lot of people just enjoy basketball, sports or so forth. It's on in bars, restaurants and other establishments all-over the world. Fans really aren't as important as you think in today's age.

I've been around atheltics most of my life in some capacity. I interned in atheltic compliance in school.

Lol, wouldn't lying and being full of crap be the same thing?

 

[Creed Bratton]

Lol, wouldn't lying and being full of crap be the same thing?

You should know. Also if you want us to think any of the stuff you are spewing about being around athletics and interning in athletic compliance school then share proof of your real identity.

 

[Thats An Awful Idea]

You should know. Also if you want us to think any of the stuff you are spewing about being around athletics and interning in athletic compliance school then share proof of your real identity.

You're the one that said it, thoug. So, shouldn't you know? 🤔

You don't have to beleive me, bud. That's entirely up to you! It doesn't bother me one iota.

 

[Creed Bratton]

You're the one that said it, thoug. So, shouldn't you know? 🤔

You don't have to beleive me, bud. That's entirely up to you! It doesn't bother me one iota.

Meh it doesn't bother me either. I think you are a liar and listening to your arrogant drivel calling out fellow fans isn't my cup of tea so you are being cast into the lake of fire where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth also known as the Creed Bratton ignore list.

 

[Thats An Awful Idea]

Meh it doesn't bother me either. I think you are a liar and listening to your arrogant drivel calling out fellow fans isn't my cup of tea so you are being cast into the lake of fire where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth also known as the Creed Bratton ignore list.

Ohh, nooooo!

You seemed bothered enough to take issue with what I said, and now block me. So your claims don't really track. But you do you!

 

[king of cali]

I get the whole it's not who starts but finishes argument but if we are falling behind the first 4-5 minutes of each half then it's an issue. This team's defense struggles to string enough stops to come from behind so every advantage we gain by jumping out to a lead instead of playing out of a hole is huge IMO.

The evidence is there that the team doesn’t fall into these holes what Dillingham and Sheppard have to save them from.

It has happened, don’t get me wrong, but to act like it happens shame after game is a complete fabrication.

 

[Creed Bratton]

The evidence is there that the team doesn’t fall into these holes what Dillingham and Sheppard have to save them from.

It has happened, don’t get me wrong, but to act like it happens shame after game is a complete fabrication.

If it happens 1/3 of the time that we fall behind and come back when Rob and Reed come in isn't that too much? It is for me if it is avoidable.