Kentucky basketball is being disrespected by the national media
The 2024-25 college basketball season is going to be an interesting one as there was a lot of shake-up head coaching-wise, especially in the SEC. John Calipariwww.si.com
Disrespect.
- Thread starter Elliott Tim
- Start date
As someone who doesn't think there's much difference in skill level in college hoops, I think UK will do fine with the kinds of players Pope has assembled. At BYU, Pope had to choose from a fairly eccentric, restricted pool of players -- those willing to abide by the demands of a tight, religious code of conduct. They might associate with the angels in the afterlife, but in this one, their numbers are vastly smaller.
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I love this roster & I think we’ll be a ranked team all season. We’re definitely good enough to challenge for the SEC Championship & make a deep NCAAT run. Whether or not that happens, we have that kind of potential.
Ppl shouldn’t lower expectations just bc we don’t have Calipari type talent. Look at some of the teams that have made deep runs to the E8 & FF over the last 10-15 years. Lots of mid-majors & middle of the pack type teams have played deep into March. Hell, NC St this year is a good example.
IMO, what this team lacks in individual talent will be more than compensated by having 12 guys who perfectly fit the style we want to play. We are overloaded with knockdown shooters & good passers in an offense that is built around perimeter shooting & ball movement. We also have lockdown defenders at every level & should be pretty good on that end, too.
My main concern is cohesion. As long as these guys can gel by January I think the sky is the limit. They could be a machine if it all comes together like I think it can, on paper. And, having 7 SRs (6 5th year SRs) gives me hope that they’ll figure it out.
Ppl shouldn’t lower expectations just bc we don’t have Calipari type talent. Look at some of the teams that have made deep runs to the E8 & FF over the last 10-15 years. Lots of mid-majors & middle of the pack type teams have played deep into March. Hell, NC St this year is a good example.
IMO, what this team lacks in individual talent will be more than compensated by having 12 guys who perfectly fit the style we want to play. We are overloaded with knockdown shooters & good passers in an offense that is built around perimeter shooting & ball movement. We also have lockdown defenders at every level & should be pretty good on that end, too.
My main concern is cohesion. As long as these guys can gel by January I think the sky is the limit. They could be a machine if it all comes together like I think it can, on paper. And, having 7 SRs (6 5th year SRs) gives me hope that they’ll figure it out.
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He knows the mission and the BBN expectations and he is on the clock now. I think he would get a pass this year if he has a learning curve, but deep down we all want to see big wins this year and I’m cautiously optimistic he has the roster to
do it.
do it.
What do you mean by well? I see the as maybe a 22-12 team heading into the tournament.
That seems to me to be a reasonable expectation, Phun. I, too, will be disappointed if the 'Cats don't win a game in the NCAA Tournament in 2025.
Go 'Cats !
Or maybe they’ve witnessed the last decade, and are tempering expectations. Like I said, if we’re better that’s a good thing.
New players and new coach, what does the last 10 years have to with anything? Also out last 10 years are far better than many teams getting respect in preseason top 25 rankings.
All of our players and coaches are new to the program. There's no past record to temper expectations with. (for? from? of?) The one link with the past is between Pope and Robinson, and making a prediction from that would be like invoking a coach wearing only his lucky brown suit. The only honest thing would be for writers to say, "I need copy to publish. I don't have a clue but I have to say something."
I think we all need to step back take a deep breath and let this season play out we have alot of potential but to get these young men to play together in one year is a tall order considering the different teams and conferences they have come from but I strongly believe THE POPE will get it done and make us all proud again to be a fan of the greatest program ever
I’m talking the whole picture. Stronger conference, portal, NIL etc. 12-13 losses is possible. Anything better would be great
I don't think that's it at all, I think it's probably the opposite. People trying to temper expectations to get ahead of criticism of Pope if the season doesn't go great. I think it's more people protecting Pope than it is trashing him.
I’m just so happy the conman is gone I really don’t even care yet.
Anybody who thought the negativity left with Cal hasn't been paying attention. There will be constant negativity, and it'll come from the usual suspects.
Haters with a bullhorn gonna hate loudly
Possibly that is their agenda. But I think part of it is how little Cal was able to produce with a roster of 5 stars every year. So now they see a bunch of 3 & 4 star older transfers and simply can't conceive that we could go further with lesser talent and possibly better coaching. It's just a normalcy bias and mindset that has solidified into minds from 15 years of ineptitude. On top of that, there are a lot of younger fans who haven't known any other coach not named Calipari. They just see less star talent and think that is the only way to win. This is a mental paradigm shift for many that will take time and show results for them to fully embrace it.
High level talent and scoring. The roster is full of “B” and “C” type talent but there’s possibly only one “A” type talent.
I’d compare it to the Mavs if they didn’t have Luka and Kyrie or the Celtics without Tatum and Brown. It’s missing the one or two top end guys that a team needs if it’s going to be great.
Some of you were hung up on him getting the job because he had not won an ncaa tournament game. Don’t know when that became the yardstick someone is measured by. Sure isn’t in my book. Cal won just 1 in the last 5 years? And yet there were some on here that had no problem with that. If he doesn’t win a tournament game this year it won’t be because he is a bad coach. Whole lot involved here. You worry warts just sit back and enjoy this season because things are only going to get better from here on. Look for the positives and you will be pleasantly surprised.
Lack of a star.
Not that having a star helped us in 2010 (Wall/Boogie), 2016 (Murray/Ulis), 2018 (SGA), or 2019 (PJ).
We have as deep a ten man rotation as we've ever had. Our bench can hurt opponents as much as the starting five.
I think we go something like 25-8 with a win or two in the NCAA tournament.
Obviously W/L is important, but I can look over losses if they play hard, play together, play smart , with passion and no egos.
I wasn’t hung up on it when he was hired. But I do think he needs it to end this season. Do you not agree?
Don’t agree with the first sentence.
Butler- played for a title.
Robinson- played for a tourney team. Winning team in the Big 12.
Brea- won a tourney game this season.
Almonor- won two tourney games in ‘23, including a win over 1 seed Purdue.
Kriisa- was on a 1 seed while at Zona.
So five of the nine transfers were part of winning programs and played in the tourney. Three of those five have won games in the tourney.
Just wanted to point that out.
That's cool and all, but none of those other than Butler really count for winning much of anything.
68 teams make the tournament every year. That's not a major accomplishment. What did the teams do once they were in the tournament? What about conference tourneys?
BYU winning games in their first season in the Big 12 (best conference in the nation) counts for nothing?
FDU as a 16 seed beating 1 seed Purdue isn’t big time winning basketball?
Dayton won in the tourney this season.
Kriisa has won a lot of games in his career as well, especially when he was with Zona.
Besides who else in the SEC besides Bama has played in more tourney games than our guys? (This doesn’t require that you go through every roster to prove me wrong, I’m just saying we have as much or more tourney experience as most other teams in the SEC.)
We’ve got plenty of winners on our roster. More than we have had in several years.
And as you mentioned, Butler’s success is by far better than the rest and that is why he will be counted on to lead the way for this team.
But it’s not like he is leading a bunch of losers who have never won at a high level or played in meaningful games.
This isn’t a roster like UConn’s when it comes to winning, but it ain’t a team full of former Vanderbilt Commodores either.
Lulz, was BYU not supposed to win any games in the big 12 or something? What did BYU accomplish for the season though? And the Big 12 was good, but they had 0 F4 teams. So not sure they were the best.
FDU beating an overrated Purdue team in a shocker for the first Rd isn't evidence of FDU playing high level wininng basketball.
Wow....Dayton won a tourney game!!!! Holy shit, that's big time! Only half the teams are able to do that. I mean, we should be a tourney favorite with someone that accomplished on our team!
What all did Zona win while he was there? Why would he transfer from Zona to WVU?
I would say TN, AU, Bama, FL, SC, TX AM, TX, OK will all have as experienced if not more so in terms of post season contributions.
You're reaching for things like so and so played in a tournament team to try to argue that these guys have real winning experience. Aside from Butler, not a one of them actually do.
While I am not penciling in double digit losses myself, in a tough league they can happen even without a glaring weakness at all.
Sometimes the cake just takes time to bake and it doesn't come together right away so an few extra lumps are taken.
We were a 3 seed just last year and were close to double digits on Selection Sunday.
Few as possible is tremendously desirable but you can have a very respectable winning percentage nowadays and be in that range.
Six losses is usually going to be #1 and #2 seed discussion and eight is still maybe a #2.
Pope could have easily put together a team with a bunch of guys who had been on teams that had never had a winning season in their careers. There were lots of those guys in the portal. Guys who put up gawdy numbers on poor teams.
But he didn’t, he got some guys that were use to winning.
If you don’t understand that, I don’t know what to tell you.
Will it translate to wins? Maybe or maybe not.
But you paint a picture of a bunch of losers (besides Butler) who will be happy to be on a .500 team because they have never won anything meaningful in their lives. I just don’t see that as being the case.
Lol, having winning seasons isn't the same as winning anything. If that's what matters, we should have just kept the last guy because we had all winning seasons except one. This is about post season success and wins, which you have already proven we have very little of.
Can teams without that experience still overcome it and win? Sure! But it's highly improbable given all the circumstances. If you can't see that, I don't know what to tell you.
Besides Butler, what have any of them won?
No one is painting pictures of losers, but many of us are being realistic about what we are on paper and our expectations. We aren't trying to act like we have some accomplished team by pointing out regular season wins and a surprise tournament upset.
the lack of elite scorers? Jaxxon Robinson is being expected to carry this team? That's objectively bad news?
I don’t expect to win a title this season, but I don’t think it’s as doom and gloom as you make it out.
I don’t have high expectations for the season because these guys have not played together before. Chemistry is a big deal.
But I do stand beside my point that these guys are winners. They aren’t a bunch of guys from sub .500 teams.
If all you look at is deep runs, then so be it.
And by the way, you are also totally off base by saying that these guys don’t have much starting experience. The nine players that are coming in from the portal have a collective 586 starts. Seven of the nine were starters last season.
I don’t know why you are down on this team before they even take the floor, but I think it may be because you don’t know much about the players coming in.
If 2 wins are 2 much for this group . Then what have we been doing being excited about this roster. Did we become Morehead St
Lol, please quote where I said it's doom and gloom? Why do you make up lies that people never said?
That's literally what I said in my post that you took issue with.
They're winners who have won nothing aside from Butler? Cool, got it!
Well, I am not sure how long you have been watching basketball, but you generally have to go on tournament runs to win them.
Lol, again where did I say we didn't have starting experience? Lol, damn dude! Try reading and comprehending at the same time.
I did say not all of them were the primary options on their team, and several of them weren't starters.
Being realistic in expectations is being down on the team?
I am starting to realize you're just a sunshine pumper who thinks anyone that doesn't write the most optimistic takes about this team is somehow trashing them in your view.
LOL!
I am realistic, but smart enough to know that you don’t have to make deep runs in the tourney to be considered a winner.
Your first post painted a picture of a team that we should not expect much from because they were not winners (except Butler). I disagreed with the winners part.
You said that some didn’t even start. They were all starters last year except for Brea, who averaged 30+ minutes a game and Robinson, who was the leading scorer on his team. Starting experience will not limit this team.
You aren’t changing my mind about my opinion of this team, so give it a rest.
I get it, you think you have to make deep runs in the tournament to be considered a winner. I disagree. The tournament is the most improtant measure, but it’s not the only measure for winning. Especially at programs lesser than UK (which is every other program in the country, IMHO). You can’t hold BYU to that same standard, but it doesn’t mean that BYU isn’t a winning program.
As for being a sunshine pumper, I have been accused of that. I have also been accused of being doom and gloom. I am somewhere in between. It’s called being realistic.
I call it like I see it, and I see this team as being a team made up of mostly winners that could come together and make some noise, if the chemistry is there and they jell.
They won’t win a title this season, probably won’t make a very deep run. It’s year one, that’s a big ask. But their shortcomings won’t be because they don’t know how to win or because some of them weren’t even starters or were all second and third options on teams.
That’s my opinion, and you won’t change it. So give it a rest or continue to argue. I don’t care.
I enjoyed the discussion with you, but it’s over, at least from my point of view. We’ve both said everything that needs to be said.
I am clear on your opinion. I have made my opinion clear. Let’s leave it at that.
Or you can continue to discuss this with someone else.
I’m out.
Have a great day and God bless.
And this we can surely agree on…
Go Cats!
Well, to be winners, you generally have to win things. Every team wins games, so by that logic, all teams are winning teams.
And we should have no expectations of them. They have never played together, for the coach (except one) nor for the school. You even stated you don't expect much from them. Not sure why me saying that is a problem.
Chandler, Noah nor Perry were starters for a college team. You just mentioned Robinson and Brea. So that's 5 of the 12. Several others only started some games and not all last year. So, again, what did I say that was wrong?
Lol, who is trying to change your mind? You're the one who took issue with my post...or do you not remember that?
You kind of have to win something more than just some regular season games to be a winner. Otherwise, most all college teams are winners applying your logic.
Considering we have seen teams similar to BYU level make deep runs, and BYU itself has, I am not sure why we can't expect that.
LOL, you literally share my view of the likely outcome for this team, but take issue with the fact I said it. Seems like the opposite of realistic, but you do you!
Youre whole argument comes across as someone upset about something they feel the same way about, and totally unsure of what you're even upset about to begin with. It's very strange.
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