Debate Thread?

[Nightwish84]

Great discussion today.

Any future debates will end in similar fashion as last night which is why Harris wants more of them. For too long, Dems painted Trump as a supervillain who's hard to figure out and defeat, which was a mistake. He's won one election and most of his handpicked candidates have lost over the years. He's an old guy with a passionate following who complains about the world. He wants power and attention and a political party gave it to him. Harris knows this and knows how to needle his vanity. He wants her to say things like "I'm black and he's racist" when he bizarrely questioned her race and she didn't go there. She literally smiled at the time and said "say it to my face", which made her look strong and confident and him odd and out of touch. He'll always get in a few solid talking points before taking all the bait handed to him like a fish.

The playbook is out on Trump. We know if Putin kisses his ass, Trump will say nice things about him and Russia while bashing our allies all at once. We know no matter what, Trump is going to play victim, whether it's because of moderators (he now wants ABC shut down because he's a child) or election results that involve him. And he says shit in public that would embarrass all of us if he were our uncle or grandfather. Guy got the pet story "on the tv." That's like a concerned grandparent saying they heard kids were using litter boxes in classrooms because they saw it "on the facebook." IMO Harris will win the next debate as well if it happens.

 

[TCurtis75]

I wonder how governors and legislators get into office. If we only knew THAT, we may be able to finally do the will of the people!!!

But that still isn't getting the issue into the hands of the voters. That is putting it into the hands of a select few people most of which were in office before RvW was overturned. Allowing the measure on the actual ballots is putting it into the hands of the people otherwise those elected officials could say anything (they already do) to get elected and then just not care about the will of the people. You are the one who said that the people will get to decide the issue at the state level and if DeSantis and others have their way that simply is false.

 

[RunninRichie]

Debate is a joke. Same parties.

 

[RunninRichie]

He’s not a conservative and never has been. It’s wild to me the GOP basically threw away their party for this guy. He’s self serving and being a Republican is just a mean to an end for him. He’ll do things the heritage foundation tells him to, like appoint their judges, but he doesn’t have any conservative principles himself.

His opinion on any one topic will be whatever the last person he spoke to convinced him of. Remember “we’ll take the guns first, due process second”?

He’s been beating the immigrant drum since 2016 and that’s all he’s got. His health care answer was pathetic. “Concepts of a plan” after almost a decade? He’s got nothing.

Trump's a new york democrat.

 

[The-Hack]

To act like a Democratic President of the United States, who has very little real power to actually influence the economy or to make economic policy, is going to plunge the US into marxist hell hole is just fear mongering.

Look, we’ve battled through successive Marxist Hell Holes since Roosevelt, being subjected to such socialist schemes as Social Security, Medicare, Fmha and Veteran’s loans . . . only to be rescued by conservative presidents who follow and do absolutely nothing to change what the Marxists got passed.

We’ve been lucky!!

 

[The-Hack]

Guy got the pet story "on the tv."

There’s not a damned thing wrong with getting your information from
TV or the Net.

How the Hell else would I know the Moon Landings were fake, Kennedy survived Dallas, and that injected bleach can cure desease?

Outlaw imaginative reporting and only outlaws will have imaginative reporting.

Seriously, Trump gets piled on for his ability to “think outside the box.” And just because the “box” he has escaped is lined with padded material for his own protection is no cause for shame!!

 

[The-Hack]

Trump's a new york democrat.

Ummmm yep!

 

[Caveman Catfan]

But that still isn't getting the issue into the hands of the voters. That is putting it into the hands of a select few people most of which were in office before RvW was overturned. Allowing the measure on the actual ballots is putting it into the hands of the people otherwise those elected officials could say anything (they already do) to get elected and then just not care about the will of the people. You are the one who said that the people will get to decide the issue at the state level and if DeSantis and others have their way that simply is false.

Other than Vermont and N.H., the term for governor is 4 years. The term for state legislators is between 2 and 4 years (mostly 2) with Florida being a state with term limits. Elections for the Florida House are this year. People will vote. Your fears are baseless.

 

[ukcatz12]

Trump's a new york democrat.

Another thing that's been wild to me for the last decade. He's a slick talking (or at least was, he just rambles now) coastal elite billionaire who went to an Ivy League school and he's now the poster boy of the party who dislikes slick talking coastal elites from Ivy League schools?

 

[The-Hack]

Debate is a joke. Same parties.

With all due respect, Sir, your observations, while truthful and accurate, do very little to serve the purposes of the “campaign industry” and worse, if adopted by others, could easily lead to less partisan division and a rational approach to our common problems.

In short, such thinking is unwelcome!!

 

[The-Hack]

Another thing that's been wild to me for the last decade. He's a slick talking (or at least was, he just rambles now) coastal elite billionaire who went to an Ivy League school and he's now the poster boy of the party who dislikes slick talking coastal elites from Ivy League schools?

Uh . . . .

The hair . . . !!

 

[Caveman Catfan]

Another thing that's been wild to me for the last decade. He's a slick talking (or at least was, he just rambles now) coastal elite billionaire who went to an Ivy League school and he's now the poster boy of the party who dislikes slick talking coastal elites from Ivy League schools?

And, Kamala the Kop was unanimously rejected in the primary of 2020 and did not even make it to the Iowa caucuses, having been crushed by Tulsi Gabbard after Harris accused Biden of enabling racist behavior.

And now she is the “I am with her” wonder girl of the Dem Party.

Yup. Graduate of Cal Hastings law who reportedly failed the Cali bar is the Dem candidate for president. The Cai bar is reportedly a tough bar exam and smart people fail for various reasons. So, there is that.

 

[cat_in_the_hat]

But on a policy point of view, to paint Harris as an extreme leftist is just not accurate. And guess what? We've heard the same exact things before about Obama, and Biden, and every other Democratic nominee and the world hasn't ended. The fear mongering gets old after a while. Trump called her a Marxist last night. I highly doubt he even knows what that means, but he knows his voters are scared of the word so he'll use it. Remember when the GOP said Obama is going to take your guns for 8 years? Did he actually do that? No. Remember calling Obama, Biden, and now Harris a socialist, a marxist, a communist? We still have the strongest capitalistic economy in the world. This country is literally run on capitalism. To act like a Democratic President of the United States, who has very little real power to actually influence the economy or to make economic policy, is going to plunge the US into marxist hell hole is just fear mongering.

I appreciate the effort you put into answering. I agree with some points. The Capital incident was embarrassing and I think denying the election results is also embarrassing. I'm not sure you can blame the Capital incident entirely on him though. As far as foreign leaders go, that's all Democratic talking points, so I don't put a lot of stock in that speculation. Trump made Europe pay up for their defense and that undoubtedly rubbed some leaders to wrong way. I would rather have someone who unabashedly pro USA and rubs some people the wrong way than someone who feels like they have to be friends with everyone.

That said, I want to address this paragraph. I may address other if I get time. I don't think anyone is going to plunge us into Marxism. I do think we have been moving in that direction since FDR. And most of that movement has come at the hand of Democratic policies. Whether you like it or not, the Affordable Health Care Act is a socialist concept. Practically all government programs are because they limit individual liberty. Harris as talked about price controls. Not only is that a socialist policy but it's show a complete lack of understanding of economics. Nixon (Republican) tried those with gasoline in 1970s to disastrous results. She openly talks about how government should judge who needs help more that other and direct resources their way. That concept doesn't exist in the Constitution because it is a Marxist concept. For an attorney, she doesn't understand the point of our Constitution, or doesn't agree with it. For example, paying off college loans, offering $25,000 to fist time home buyer, etc., are all examples of thinking with roots in Socialism/Marxism. A country like ours won't plunge into Socialism/Marxism. It will happen gradually. Once these programs are in place they never go away. They only expand.

 

[The-Hack]

Once these programs are in place they never go away. They only expand.

A well written/reasoned post.

While extreme economic positions are easiest to defend, philosophically, “on the ground,” and in reality, it gets real messy being so consistent.

For example, the RECC was a “socialistic” leaning development of the 1930’s-today, but it’s existence help lead to a massive gain in farming efficiency and rural capital development throughout its existence.

The simple development of governmental roads, rather than reliance upon private development, is also “socialist leaning,” but it would be hard to imagine our capitalistic society with only toll roads.

In fact, the outlawing of child labor, the 5 day workweek, workplace safety, and many things most conservatives now agree with sprang, largely, from the radical left of the 1880’s through 1910.

As to the slow decent into Marxism, with the inevitable changes coming in the next 25 years, as AI replaces (or can replace) all human manual and intellectual functions, I’m not certain it really matters.

Perhaps the radical philosophy of Thorsten Veblen is coming about in the next generation.