Booker best shooter?
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since when ? a few people went off in that direction but the OP talked about best shooter and made no mention of 3 pt stats.
And talking best shooters, I'm not about to eliminate the vast majority of former UK players just because there was no 3-point line when they played.
Nobody has made the claim you are asserting , it's sounds more like a hissy fit because you are not getting your way . "Because I say so" is your preferred tactic , you want your word to be proof enough which is narcissistic . Human memory is also the least reliable factor in determining this debate , you have brought nothing but your opinion and that's fine so long as you don't erroneously try to pass it off as fact . That the older generation gets hell bent on having one of their contemporaries be the best in every debate is the real homerism .
A
anon_q409idbs5m40a
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And it's laughable to think that ABA stats can be related to who's been the best shooter at UK. Some on this board simply like to argue for the sake of having something to do.
Dampier doesn't have 3 pt stats at UK , the only known facts are from the ABA but some don't like that because the numbers don't support their assertion . I will use them because that's all we have and to think they don't give us an indication to compare is the laughable part . There was a thread awhile back about best player at UK and those desperately trying to champion Issel over a more accomplished A.Davis were throwing out Dans ABA accomplishment as proof . Now it's all the sudden out of bounds to do that , I guess black and white tv was superior also .
That's very interesting. Dampier ranks as the 4th most accurate three point shooter in ABA history - but when you combine ABA + NBA, he's only number 199 on the list.
as others have said, "best shooter" doesn't necessarily mean the same thing as "best career 3 point percentage shooter", and ABA stats don't necessarily have a lot to do with performance at UK. Having said all that, I think some here are engaging in or giving way to nostalgia when it comes to Louie. I say that as something of an old timer myself.
I've said it before: who knows how long Booker will be here, or what his stats will be, relative to other UK greats. All I know is he has the best looking shot of any player I've seen at UK. We've had some great shooters, I think he very well might be the best....
again, for the slow of mind... He never limited his question to, or even alluded to 3 pointers. He said best shooter at UK, not the ABA.
And yes, contrary to your Professor Belichick rant, some can look at & watch enough UK games, to give an educated opinion.
oh, and by the way, the 3 point line in the ABA was 25 feet...apples to oranges & not even close to the NCAA line...despite your hilarious solution of "giving him 5%." and all the while your admonishing anyone who doesn't deal in what you call facts.....lol
There is no out of bounds here , I can use whatever stats I want . I know your stupid and have a hard time grasping that but let's try again . I can use ft % , to which I already did in this thread and Louie is behind other shooters who were also the better three point shooters . I think 3% is the best indicator of who is the best and I'll use whatever stats are available . Just like the morons who used Issels ABA stats in a who's best at UK thread , maybe you know one of them .
Apparently three point shooting is not valid because the op clearly stated 2 point % , oh wait , no he didn't . Well then he must have meant ft shooting because it was in the titl... oh wait he didn't say that either . Revelation , you can use any or all of those to make a case because he set no parameters . So if some don't like the ABA angle then there are eight players who were better shooters from about the free throw line , so I submit that as proof positive that Louie Dampier was not the best shooter at Kentucky .
i'm gonna go out on a limb & say most on this board, well, most basketball fans period, have a pretty good idea what someone means when they ask who is the best shooter.
because most have & use common sense...
but, yeah...you keep running with that "ambiguous" angle...
lol
because most have & use common sense...
but, yeah...you keep running with that "ambiguous" angle...
lol
And I said cal doesn't recruit enough shooters when the season started. Haha.
And yea defense wins championships. Our team right now doesn't score well. We are undefeated. It's all the proof the uneducated "offense only" typical "fan" needs.
And Mike Dantoni still has no championship.
This post was edited on 1/27 12:51 AM by .S&C.
And yea defense wins championships. Our team right now doesn't score well. We are undefeated. It's all the proof the uneducated "offense only" typical "fan" needs.
And Mike Dantoni still has no championship.
This post was edited on 1/27 12:51 AM by .S&C.
So you are going to hold Dampier to ABA statistics, what is the distance from the ABA line. This happens every year, this kid or that kid is the best ever. Booker is one of the best but I have seen others that were pretty good in their own rights play for UK, so I will not diminish their talents either.
I always enjoy when posters hate stats or facts because it gets in the way of pretendy land . Either you don't want to get it or can't , I fully explained everything I used to build a case . The ones who got mad brought absolutely nothing but "I said so" , if you don't like mine then bring yours or stfu .
I've been watching the Cats since 1974, and in my humble opinion you can choose from 3. Booker, Lamb and Mills. Those are the only 3 that surprised me when they missed.
50% is ridiculous. Booker is elite, but that's a hard number to keep for an entire season. He's not even halfway into it.
These stats totally ignore the distance of the 3 point line, the NCAA three point was LESS than 20 feet 9 inches until the 2008-2009 season when it became officially 20' 9" . While the NBA started at 22 ft and is now 23' 9". The ABA line was always 23' 9" from day one, George Mikan set it up.
So any college guy is shooting at 20' 9" or a WHOLE 3' less than any time in the history of the ABA.
As others have stated Booker is shooting at a great pace but this is one half a season. Louie shot at 23' 9" his whole ABA career which was new. The NBA didn't have the 3 pt when Louie played in the NBA. He played 3 years and NO 3 point line.
If some folks would take a little time and look at real records first then a little less BS would be spread. All of these stats are available, look it up under ABA and NBA and history. Just Google.
^^ Sorry, "some of his shots were taken out to 32 feet or so" sounds like a gross exaggeration. I suspect his coach would have found a place for him on the bench if he'd done that very often - it would be stupid to take that shot, since you only get 2 points for it, same as an interior shot.
Another factor some aren't considering is the essential lack of perimeter defense in the college game prior to the 3 point shot. Go look at game video from the 1970s. Even the 16 foot shot isn't really contested, nothing like it is now. Why? because of what I mentioned above, if an outside shot counts the same as an inside shot, then the objective on D is easy enought to figure out, you want to encourage the outside shot. Google some video. It's sort of startling how passive the defense is.....
Another factor some aren't considering is the essential lack of perimeter defense in the college game prior to the 3 point shot. Go look at game video from the 1970s. Even the 16 foot shot isn't really contested, nothing like it is now. Why? because of what I mentioned above, if an outside shot counts the same as an inside shot, then the objective on D is easy enought to figure out, you want to encourage the outside shot. Google some video. It's sort of startling how passive the defense is.....
Just my 2 cents-
The conversation is boring and predictable if the only thing we use is 3P%. It also excludes several of the old timers (mentioned here) because that obviously wasn't a statistic.
All of the guys mentioned here are obviously good shooters. In order to really figure out who the best shooter is, though, you have to look at the context of the team around them. In example -
Devin Booker - Getting more open looks (so far) than any SG in Kentucky history. He's only averaging ~20 mpg, so he's always fresh, and he's surrounded by an enormously talented roster of post players an guards.
Jodie Meeks - Certainly shot a less 3P% than Booker, even in his junior year. Is it fair to say he's a "worse" shooter, then? I don't think so. He was a one-man backcourt. He had to play all the minutes. When the offense stymied (as it did often), he was usually creating a shot off the dribble late in the shot clock.
Travis Ford - A great example of both principles in play here. His junior year, when he had all-american Jamal Mashburn taking double teams around him, he shot 52% (!!!) from 3. His senior year, after Mashburn left and Dent got injured, Travis was forced to be "the man". He shot 38% from 3 that year. Did he just randomly become a worse shooter his senior year? No, but much more was expected of him, defenses keyed on him more, and thus all his shots became more difficult.
Ultimately, the "best" shooter discussion will be colored by everyone's own biases and memories. Personally, I think you have to give the nod to the great shooters, who also happened to make the biggest shots on the best teams. Doron Lamb and Tony Delk would be the top 2 in my lifetime. Devin Booker, clearly, has the opportunity to enter the discussion depending on how the season goes.
The conversation is boring and predictable if the only thing we use is 3P%. It also excludes several of the old timers (mentioned here) because that obviously wasn't a statistic.
All of the guys mentioned here are obviously good shooters. In order to really figure out who the best shooter is, though, you have to look at the context of the team around them. In example -
Devin Booker - Getting more open looks (so far) than any SG in Kentucky history. He's only averaging ~20 mpg, so he's always fresh, and he's surrounded by an enormously talented roster of post players an guards.
Jodie Meeks - Certainly shot a less 3P% than Booker, even in his junior year. Is it fair to say he's a "worse" shooter, then? I don't think so. He was a one-man backcourt. He had to play all the minutes. When the offense stymied (as it did often), he was usually creating a shot off the dribble late in the shot clock.
Travis Ford - A great example of both principles in play here. His junior year, when he had all-american Jamal Mashburn taking double teams around him, he shot 52% (!!!) from 3. His senior year, after Mashburn left and Dent got injured, Travis was forced to be "the man". He shot 38% from 3 that year. Did he just randomly become a worse shooter his senior year? No, but much more was expected of him, defenses keyed on him more, and thus all his shots became more difficult.
Ultimately, the "best" shooter discussion will be colored by everyone's own biases and memories. Personally, I think you have to give the nod to the great shooters, who also happened to make the biggest shots on the best teams. Doron Lamb and Tony Delk would be the top 2 in my lifetime. Devin Booker, clearly, has the opportunity to enter the discussion depending on how the season goes.
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