1990-1997 vs 2010-2017

[rodserling]

I had thought in this idle season, I would compare Cal vs Pitino in popularity during their most productive time at UK. I realize and hope Cal's time has much more to write about. However, I couldn't get away from the teams and their records from each era and which was the most successful. I think they are unbelievably similar.

I'm not going to search into minute details, because some here will. But I would imagine the similarites might be closer than one might think. Championships, final 4s and great players during both times under two innovative coaches. Think what you will, Pitino was just what we needed at a time we were at our lowest. Other than not putting a man on the ball, his time at UK was great. He lost his recruiting edge when recruits knew he longed for the big league. Then losing all class and credibility going to Louisville. That leaves a bad taste about him with the BBN.

Cal's success is still writing its legacy. His success in recruiting is without peer. Is his best days still ahead of him? I think so.

Both had to clean liquor bottles out of their office.

I just wondered what others think about the similar eras and coaches. How do you think they compare?

 

[docholiday51]

This could get interesting,there are so many levels and issues to be considered.

Wonder who had to clean out the highest quantity and quality of liquor bottles?

I hope there is some actual thought put into this topic it will be a good way to pass the time during the down season.

 

[Col. Angus]

 

[sambowieshin]

Cal is a better human being....period.

 

[MdWIldcat55]

To compare their legacies as basketball coaches would be open to debate: Pitino took the program from deeper in the hole to national prominence, won a championship and made three FFs, Cal rescued the program at a moment it was facing Indiana-like second rate status and returned it to the top, winning a championship and going to FOUR FFs. I'd give Cal the slight edge in terms of their legacy as Kentucky basketball coaches.

But it matters what kind of human being is handling the legacy of your university's sports crown jewel. I didn't know Cal before he came to Kentucky but it is clear to me with all he has done that he is a great role model for young men and a symbol of Kentucky basketball that can make us all proud.

As a human being, Pitino has always been second rate. We overlooked some of it when he was here, but in fairness he's one of those people whose character has been revealed by life's challenges and the true levels of his lack of decency emerged later in his life.

So, there really isn't a comparison.

 

[Blueaz]

To compare their legacies as basketball coaches would be open to debate: Pitino took the program from deeper in the hole to national prominence, won a championship and made three FFs, Cal rescued the program at a moment it was facing Indiana-like second rate status and returned it to the top, winning a championship and going to FOUR FFs. I'd give Cal the slight edge in terms of their legacy as Kentucky basketball coaches.

But it matters what kind of human being is handling the legacy of your university's sports crown jewel. I didn't know Cal before he came to Kentucky but it is clear to me with all he has done that he is a great role model for young men and a symbol of Kentucky basketball that can make us all proud.

As a human being, Pitino has always been second rate. We overlooked some of it when he was here, but in fairness he's one of those people whose character has been revealed by life's challenges and the true levels of his lack of decency emerged later in his life.

So, there really isn't a comparison.

this

 

[docholiday51]

I think there are many similarities in the two time periods.Both faced great challenges in rebuilding the program. Pitino's task was probably greater but he had the advantage of keeping the good/great players he could get for more than one year.I'm not sure he could have reloaded as Cal has done almost each and every year.

When it comes to accomplishments over the entire time span I think there is once again a great level of equality.The question is what happens now.Pitino could have stayed and built a legacy probably unmatched in the modern day but his ego led him to believe he could rebuild anything anywhere.If he had it to do over again I don't think there is any doubt he would have stayed

Cal is likely to stay,he has been to the NBA and has seen that what he does doesn't work as well there. The relationship between college and pro basketball will evolve and it remains to be seen how Cal's OAD model will work as the changes occur.

We know how Pitino's ego turned out to be a weakness or flaw that derailed what might have been at UK,it is possible that the OAD model will play out and either Cal will change or he will move on in some fashion

When Cal is done at UK it seems likely to me that (baring some scandal) that his tenure at UK will overshadow Pitino's.Cal is still in the process of writing his history with UK,there may be more championships to come

Both were good fits at UK,the program and the men both benefited from their time here.

 

[coolioo1]

It is a push at the moment, but the next 3 years or so will determine the long term legacy. Even if Cal leaves soon, how he handles himself professionally and personally will also matter. Pitino personal life has tainted his time at UK no matter if he was the current coach of our most hated rival...

 

[Cychologist]

We knew when Pitino was at UK he was full of BS, building every next opponent up to be the Warriors.

And Cal excels is taking care of his players by getting them into the league. He hasn't run any of his recruits off, like Rodney Roades.

 

[hamidousvertical]

Regardless of all Pitino has done since his departure from Lexington, I will always have great respect for what he did for Kentucky basketball. This does not mean I respect him as a human being.

Cal has been true to his word since day 1. While his success as a coach has been equal to (or I would argue greater than) Pitinos, it's his honesty and character as a man that places his time at UK above Pitinos.

Both brought the success we have all come to expect on the court. Only one translates this success off the court. Cal>Pitino

 

[Mojocat]

However you slice it, there have been 3 (to my unresearched mind) golden eras of UK Basketball, and you've named two of them (along with 1946-53, call it). So hard to quibble with either.

I think Cal edges Pitino in just about every metric - winning percentage, tournament winning percentage, etc. And the clincher for me: Calipari did what he's done by relying mostly on freshmen. And he had to rebuild his team every single year. Which is crazy, and unheard of, and something I'm quite certain no other coach could do or would even attempt. And of course, after he did it a couple of times, that all changed to - "he ought to do better!" Which is human nature (both with well intentioned folks and especially with not so well intentioned folks!).....

 

[Mojocat]

To compare their legacies as basketball coaches would be open to debate: Pitino took the program from deeper in the hole to national prominence, won a championship and made three FFs, Cal rescued the program at a moment it was facing Indiana-like second rate status and returned it to the top, winning a championship and going to FOUR FFs. I'd give Cal the slight edge in terms of their legacy as Kentucky basketball coaches.

But it matters what kind of human being is handling the legacy of your university's sports crown jewel. I didn't know Cal before he came to Kentucky but it is clear to me with all he has done that he is a great role model for young men and a symbol of Kentucky basketball that can make us all proud.

As a human being, Pitino has always been second rate. We overlooked some of it when he was here, but in fairness he's one of those people whose character has been revealed by life's challenges and the true levels of his lack of decency emerged later in his life.

So, there really isn't a comparison.

Really good post - and though some (mostly Pitino defenders) will bristle at your characterization of him, and accuse you of simply having biased thinking, I think time has proved you right. Like all men, they are flawed. But what Cal's detractors are talking about when they trash his character always comes down to, in essence, that he flouted the rules of a private club (taking what they allege at face value). Rick's transgressions all have to do with far more weighty things......

 

[docholiday51]

This is a complex issue (if one tries to be fair)when you approach the question from a character standpoint Cal is the clear winner,we overlooked some of Pitino's issues when he was here but there were clear signs of potential problems and as we stand today it is a good thing he was here and also a good thing he left.If he were here now think what UK would be going thru.

Pitino is at a place and time that he doesn't matter as much as he once did,the media and the NCAA seem to have a hard time getting excited about the outlandish stuff he does or says.

Cal has issues as well, some or all of them may not be his doing but he has to live with them.The media and the NCAA really don't like Cal,both would love to see him fail or get in trouble and take UK down with him.As long as he is here we will be under the microscope,Cal has proved he can take it I hope we can as well

There may come a time when Cal gets the Godfather treatment by the NCAA and the media but that time(if it ever comes)is way down the road.

History may view the two as rivals like Rupp/Smith or Hall/Knight or Hall/Crum the exception is of course that both were once here.It is almost certain that Cal will overshadow Rick,if for no other reason than he was here longer.If rick had stayed 2 or 3 more years things might have turned out different.I think Tubby would have probably followed Rick(as a coach here) at some point.

 

[Cat78Scot]

Some great responses.

It strikes me how big a role the evolution of media and the internet played in the Pimp's downfall. As others have said, he probably had issues while he was here that we all never knew about. I don't think he cheated here because I don't really think you have to at a program at UK unless you're lazy or inept and, well, Sandy Bell.

It does make me wonder how many famous and beloved people were actually pretty tainted personally and what kind of cover ups, past and present have occurred. You look at the ones exposed for various reasons: Cosby, Paterno, the Pimp, and others that are still protected: Wooden, K, Smith, Roy.

Then you look at both Rupp and Cal; unfairly characterized and criticized for events out of their control and/or knowledge. I'm sure we've had our fair share of scoundrels but we've also stood up and taken our medicine when it was warranted (even when it wasn't).

 

[ram1955]

Really like both as coaches and will always have a warm spot for Pitino simply because he resurrected the bball program that was essentially on life support.
However, Cal has something RP didn't have. It was apparent last night when he was interviewed during the baseball game. He spoke less of his own program than he did about the other programs at UK. Personally I don't care about any of the sports other than Football, bball (men's) and baseball when they win but if potential students/recruits of any sport had been watching, they had to be impressed. He would make a tremendous salesman-type AD. In fact, at risk of arousing the mb fans, having Cal as THE AD with a guy like mb behind the scenes would be the ideal arrangement.

 

[uky8unc5]

Rick will always have an asterisk in my mind. Great coach. Despicable human being. Didn't give a dang about UK.

Give me Cal any day of the week and twice on Sunday.