Thought on Cal’s player development

[WildcatsAndBourbon]

Does Cal hide some of his pieces and his players skills until later in the season? But that’s not what I really mean at all…

I think Cal wants players to mainly focus on their weaknesses things during the slog of the middle of the season more than other coaches. He’ll take an L if it gives players a chance to work on the things he thinks are holding them back; once they’ve focused on those deficiencies during practice and games, he frees everyone up to do their entire thing again, but with the additional work they’ve put in on those problem areas.

I think this could be why Cal’s players transition and succeed in the NBA so often…he doesn’t just say, “go do what you’re already good at;” he pushes them to work at what they aren’t good at. Other coaches largely just exploit the talents kids already have, which is good enough to be good enough in college, but will ultimately hold them back. There’s only so much that can be achieved in one season, but the players can take those habits into the future with them. Also would be why Cal struggles with kids who only ever have a limited skillset.

 

[LmdCat]

Really!!! Lol

 

[WildcatsAndBourbon]

Really!!! Lol

I originally typed in a preface that I wasn’t taking this thought too seriously, but wanted to at least bounce it out there and see the feedback. My posts are wordy enough, so I deleted that part to sorta shorten the post. I’ve never been good at being concise.

That said, even though I barely pay attention to other poster’s names, your opinions I’ve come to recognize as generally being terrible, I mean , not always, but usually.

 

[WildcatsAndBourbon]

For everyone to see, I openly admit to being neurotic, the worst overthinker I’ve ever known. Part of why I’m on this forum is that sometimes I just need a place to bullshit. I hate the ridicule that happens here (even though I get caught up in it. wish people add substance/evidence to their backlash). I enjoy seeing the thoughts of other deep thinkers and the thoughts of people who can say things in fewer words than I can.

 

[mdlUK.1]

I trust Pat Riley’s opinion. He has said he likes taking UK players because they are nba ready.

 

[DraftCat]

I think some fans want to think Calipari is smarter than he really is.... seems to be the case here.

The NBA has worse defense than our current KY Wildcats.. hard to even say at this point if they get better.

 

[catben]

I agree somewhat with your post, but I will take it one step further. Cal has a PRE-CONCEIVED notion about how each player should play for him. He has a designated role for each player and it is EXTREMELY difficult for that player to break out of that particular role.

This season has been hard on Cal because of that approach. Almost EVERY player on this roster has SURPRISED Cal because his "ROLES" have NOT been the best way to win with this group.

When he ADMITTED yesterday that this team will most likely need to "outscore everybody" because they aren't great at defending, he is giving in on what he has normally done with his previous teams.

You know it's killing him, but he is DESPERATE to win at a high level again. Losing will make even the staunchest egomaniac like Cal alter his approach.

 

[LmdCat]

I originally typed in a preface that I wasn’t taking this thought too seriously, but wanted to at least bounce it out there and see the feedback. My posts are wordy enough, so I deleted that part to sorta shorten the post. I’ve never been good at being concise.

That said, even though I barely pay attention to other poster’s names, your opinions I’ve come to recognize as generally being terrible, I mean , not always, but usually.

So, one word got you this worked up? I don't think so. I think you are worked up because you didn't fully think it through before posting your ridiculous theory.

 

[UKBB4Ever]

I think some fans want to think Calipari is smarter than he really is.... seems to be the case here.

The NBA has worse defense than our current KY Wildcats.. hard to even say at this point if they get better.

That is so stupid to even comment on. But I guess I will anyway. You have to be the biggest moron on the inner web to think the NBA doesn’t play defense.

If a guy can’t play defense then he’s not making it in the NBA unless he’s a freak scorer like Hardin, Kyrie or Luca.

And none of them win.

 

[LmdCat]

For everyone to see, I openly admit to being neurotic, the worst overthinker I’ve ever known. Part of why I’m on this forum is that sometimes I just need a place to bullshit. I hate the ridicule that happens here (even though I get caught up in it. wish people add substance/evidence to their backlash). I enjoy seeing the thoughts of other deep thinkers and the thoughts of people who can say things in fewer words than I can.

You state you hate the ridicule, yet you participate in it.

 

[CRZ4UK]

Does Cal hide some of his pieces and his players skills until later in the season? But that’s not what I really mean at all…

I think Cal wants players to mainly focus on their weaknesses things during the slog of the middle of the season more than other coaches. He’ll take an L if it gives players a chance to work on the things he thinks are holding them back; once they’ve focused on those deficiencies during practice and games, he frees everyone up to do their entire thing again, but with the additional work they’ve put in on those problem areas.

I think this could be why Cal’s players transition and succeed in the NBA so often…he doesn’t just say, “go do what you’re already good at;” he pushes them to work at what they aren’t good at. Other coaches largely just exploit the talents kids already have, which is good enough to be good enough in college, but will ultimately hold them back. There’s only so much that can be achieved in one season, but the players can take those habits into the future with them. Also would be why Cal struggles with kids who only ever have a limited skillset.

Yes and No. lol. I truly believe Cal tries to prepare his young guys for the NBA. This includes playing defense like in the NBA. Make no mistake. The SEC IS NOT OFFICIATED LIKE THE NBA. Arkansas would have to forfeit in the first half last game for not enough players. Tennessee is taught to put a hand on your shoulder or hip as their opponent begins his drive. The SEC lets them play that way but Cal refuses to teach that because it WONT be allowed in the NBA. I just wish the SEC didn’t allow it because it’s a foul. It stops your opponent when he has an advantage. KSRs photographer had 30 still photos of them with their hand on our shoulder or hip at the top of the key. A hand there prevents your burst past someone. That’s why we never can turn the corner on Tennessee or some others. . It’s taught. And it’s a high advantage.

 

[UKBB4Ever]

Does Cal hide some of his pieces and his players skills until later in the season? But that’s not what I really mean at all…

I think Cal wants players to mainly focus on their weaknesses things during the slog of the middle of the season more than other coaches. He’ll take an L if it gives players a chance to work on the things he thinks are holding them back; once they’ve focused on those deficiencies during practice and games, he frees everyone up to do their entire thing again, but with the additional work they’ve put in on those problem areas.

I think this could be why Cal’s players transition and succeed in the NBA so often…he doesn’t just say, “go do what you’re already good at;” he pushes them to work at what they aren’t good at. Other coaches largely just exploit the talents kids already have, which is good enough to be good enough in college, but will ultimately hold them back. There’s only so much that can be achieved in one season, but the players can take those habits into the future with them. Also would be why Cal struggles with kids who only ever have a limited skillset.

No. Cal has players work on their whole game all the time.

Now, will he let a guy play thru tough times? Yes.

But one thing even the CHC can’t bust on Cal about is player development.

They will anyway. Just because they are programmed to hate. That’s what being in a cult does to a person.

No rational person would ever question player development under Cal.

 

[ukcatz12]

You have to be the biggest moron on the inner web to think the NBA doesn’t play defense.

It's a common thought for people who don't actually watch the league or older people who compare it to how it was in the '80s and '90s.

The defensive schemes in the NBA are very complex. They run defensive switches and rotations all the time and it's often done before the offense even crosses half court. The problem is the 3 point shot is pretty much a cheat code for guys like Dame and Steph, and if you can pull up and easily hit a 40 footer there's not much the defense can do about it.

 

[gbl97]

I think some fans want to think Calipari is smarter than he really is.... seems to be the case here.

It's hilarious when guys like Jay Wright and Bilas try to explain to viewers exactly what Cal is thinking during the game. If they could only have a glimpse...

 

[Wildcat-in-STL]

If Cal was this good..... the previous 3 seasons wouldnt have happened.

 

[$Z71$]

I trust Pat Riley’s opinion. He has said he likes taking UK players because they are nba ready.

Same, there is a reason why Kentucky had 7 All Stars, we prepare players for the NBA. Whether people want to admit that or not it's true. Tons of players rated higher never become All Stars and a lot of them are out of the league altogether already.

Booker ranked 22nd and 18th
Bam 12th and
SGA 35 and 21st
Towns 2nd and 9th
Randall 2nd and 3rd
Maxey 13th and 10th
AD 1st and 1st

Then look at the other guys qw put in the league all of who contribute and are good players. Our guys perform better than other schools overall. There is no denying that. People won't like that because I get it to a fan it's not about the NBA and success after Kentucky. To the players though it is.

 

[IL Wildcat]

The answers to this question will likely align with posters' feelings toward Calipari. The chances of getting an unbiased answer are pretty much nil on this board when it comes to Calipari. It's almost nauseating to me, personally. I don't even bring him up to anyone here. I don't mention his coaching very much at all, unless my opinion is a critique, which is rarely an issue here. If I think Cal did a good job on something, I just keep it to myself.

But since you asked directly, I'll give an opinion. I do agree that Cal pinpoints what he believes to be weaknesses of players that need to be corrected before they can seriously consider an NBA career. He does encourage the players, from what I can see, to improve those areas. I don't necessarily think that means he "holds players back." He also usually mentions that he pinpoints the strengths of players and encourages them to use their particular skill set to help the team succeed.

I think the struggle he's had with this particular group could be that several guys didn't show their full hand from the beginning, so his evaluations may not have been quite as accurate. For example: I don't think Thiero was seen as a shooter early on, but he's showing that more. I think Cal had Thiero pegged as a defender, rebounder, and trash guy, but he's shown he's more than that. Another player is Edwards whom Cal had pegged as a small forward on this team but who has clearly shown he's probably better at the 4. There are other players I feel were fitting a particular role whose skills have changed.

The positive in all of this is that the team has shown quite a bit of versatility.

As for preparing guys for the NBA, it doesn't matter what any of us think. He's shown he's good at it. His players who have gone to the League have said as much, one recently told someone that if he wants to change his life, go to UK. That's high praise. Now, that can be taken 2 ways- "Cal is great at prepping guys for the NBA" OR "Cal cares more about NBA than UK." I'd say you can do both at the same time. But I've heard it both ways and it just depends on how you look at it. If anyone wants to throw darts at me, I'll send you an 8×10. 🤣

 

[Ripcord65]

I originally typed in a preface that I wasn’t taking this thought too seriously, . . . .
That said, even though I barely pay attention to other poster’s names, your opinions I’ve come to recognize as generally being terrible, I mean , not always, but usually.

Well, W&Bourbon ... you'll have to add me to your list of terrible posters, because my thought about your original post was the same as LmdCat's ... but I would have expressed it much less gently. I think your original post ascribes to CCC a level of forethought and intellectual capability that is laughable. But, then ... that's pretty much what LmdCat said, isn't it !

 

[chroix]

Behold the nobility of the self righteous troll. We are all the more fortunate to have witnessed so gallant a display.

 

[sambowieshin]

I think some fans want to think Calipari is smarter than he really is.... seems to be the case here.

The NBA has worse defense than our current KY Wildcats.. hard to even say at this point if they get better.

Nick Richards, Tyler Herro, SGA, Reed Sheppard, Antonio Reeves, Bam Adebayo, Tyrese Maxey, Julius Randle, Devin Booker and all the other players who greatly improved in their time here say hi.
Cal deserves some grief for some of his Xs and Os but player development is near the bottom of the bitch list.

 

[LmdCat]

The answers to this question will likely align with posters' feelings toward Calipari. The chances of getting an unbiased answer are pretty much nil on this board when it comes to Calipari. It's almost nauseating to me, personally. I don't even bring him up to anyone here. I don't mention his coaching very much at all, unless my opinion is a critique, which is rarely an issue here. If I think Cal did a good job on something, I just keep it to myself.

But since you asked directly, I'll give an opinion. I do agree that Cal pinpoints what he believes to be weaknesses of players that need to be corrected before they can seriously consider an NBA career. He does encourage the players, from what I can see, to improve those areas. I don't necessarily think that means he "holds players back." He also usually mentions that he pinpoints the strengths of players and encourages them to use their particular skill set to help the team succeed.

I think the struggle he's had with this particular group could be that several guys didn't show their full hand from the beginning, so his evaluations may not have been quite as accurate. For example: I don't think Thiero was seen as a shooter early on, but he's showing that more. I think Cal had Thiero pegged as a defender, rebounder, and trash guy, but he's shown he's more than that. Another player is Edwards whom Cal had pegged as a small forward on this team but who has clearly shown he's probably better at the 4. There are other players I feel were fitting a particular role whose skills have changed.

The positive in all of this is that the team has shown quite a bit of versatility.

As for preparing guys for the NBA, it doesn't matter what any of us think. He's shown he's good at it. His players who have gone to the League have said as much, one recently told someone that if he wants to change his life, go to UK. That's high praise. Now, that can be taken 2 ways- "Cal is great at prepping guys for the NBA" OR "Cal cares more about NBA than UK." I'd say you can do both at the same time. But I've heard it both ways and it just depends on how you look at it. If anyone wants to throw darts at me, I'll send you an 8×10. 🤣

The only things CCC does well are recruit and run his mouth. By no means should CCC get credit for the success of his former players in the NBA. If he was truly developing players under his tutelage, there should be some sign of player progression while they are at UK. Most of his players actually play better when they first arrive and progressively go downhill the longer they play under him. This explains why some of UK's greatest upset losses occur towards the end of the season and not at the beginning.

We treat him like he is an enigma when that isn't the case. CCC is who he has demonstrated himself to be since the day he arrived. He is a narcissist who cares very little for this university, fans, SEC championships, or NCAA championships. He only cares about himself and the number of players who passes thru on the way to the NBA. The fact is that they would all get there if they never ever laid eyes on CCC, IMHO.

 

[DreadLox]

Does Cal hide some of his pieces and his players skills until later in the season? But that’s not what I really mean at all…

The "secret ingredient" in Calipari's development is to instill initiative and personal responsibility into his players. Not a skill set. "Here's what you need to do. Do it." As a result, for the players who take that to heart, when they've put in their hours, they excel more than players who have learned a skill set.

Frustrating for fans, of course.

 

[crestcat]

Yeah, he taught Booker how to shoot Fox speed etc etc etc

 

[docholiday51]

The answers to this question will likely align with posters' feelings toward Calipari. The chances of getting an unbiased answer are pretty much nil on this board when it comes to Calipari. It's almost nauseating to me, personally. I don't even bring him up to anyone here. I don't mention his coaching very much at all, unless my opinion is a critique, which is rarely an issue here. If I think Cal did a good job on something, I just keep it to myself.

But since you asked directly, I'll give an opinion. I do agree that Cal pinpoints what he believes to be weaknesses of players that need to be corrected before they can seriously consider an NBA career. He does encourage the players, from what I can see, to improve those areas. I don't necessarily think that means he "holds players back." He also usually mentions that he pinpoints the strengths of players and encourages them to use their particular skill set to help the team succeed.

I think the struggle he's had with this particular group could be that several guys didn't show their full hand from the beginning, so his evaluations may not have been quite as accurate. For example: I don't think Thiero was seen as a shooter early on, but he's showing that more. I think Cal had Thiero pegged as a defender, rebounder, and trash guy, but he's shown he's more than that. Another player is Edwards whom Cal had pegged as a small forward on this team but who has clearly shown he's probably better at the 4. There are other players I feel were fitting a particular role whose skills have changed.

The positive in all of this is that the team has shown quite a bit of versatility.

As for preparing guys for the NBA, it doesn't matter what any of us think. He's shown he's good at it. His players who have gone to the League have said as much, one recently told someone that if he wants to change his life, go to UK. That's high praise. Now, that can be taken 2 ways- "Cal is great at prepping guys for the NBA" OR "Cal cares more about NBA than UK." I'd say you can do both at the same time. But I've heard it both ways and it just depends on how you look at it. If anyone wants to throw darts at me, I'll send you an 8×10. 🤣

Fair and honest as usual but I think the OP is giving Cal too much credit. I think Cal tries to get the best(highest rated) players he can with minimal thought to roster construction or strengths/ weaknesses. Once they are here he tries to fit a team together while giving the higher rated players a longer leash than some others

 

[DraftCat]

That is so stupid to even comment on. But I guess I will anyway. You have to be the biggest moron on the inner web to think the NBA doesn’t play defense.

If a guy can’t play defense then he’s not making it in the NBA unless he’s a freak scorer like Hardin, Kyrie or Luca.

And none of them win.

NBA League Average
115 PPG in 2023/24
101 PPG in 2013/14
93.4 PPG in 2003/04

Spare me the NBA plays defense nonsense - I've watched plenty of games where it's a lay up line or spamming 3 pointers. Maybe they are playing the best defense they can and if so then the NBA is broken and they need to fix it.

But calling me a moron when there are statistics out there that show what a crap product the NBA has become is a little funny to me. But carry on.

Some of us miss defense being physical and varied styles of how the game is played. Spamming 3 pointers is like watching paint dry.

 

[CatPatrick13]

Cal deserves some grief for some of his Xs and Os but player development is near the bottom of the bitch list.

Truth.

 

[DraftCat]

83-38 at Halftime (Celtics vs. Warriors)

Looks like the Warriors gave up the Celts are shooting 62% from the field lol