The Ukraine war. (Yes, we'll mind our manners)
- Thread starter BigBlueFanGA
- Start date
I agree with that. I just don't believe the bs I hear - like some people. Do you believe that bs?
The question is... Do we implode our own debt by financing a corrupt country for globalist to enrich themselves...?
Something positive and you still find the need to twist it back on Ukraine and the US. Why?
(1) imploding debt
(2) corrupt country
(3) globalists enriching themselves off war
Do you agree about any of those?
1, yes
2, some but they have improved. Sadly it seems that most countries are corrupt these days.
3, I would need specifics so I can research it.
Yes, if we spend about 100x more than we are at the moment. Many way bigger financial issues.
Only pardon left is Joe, then the entire Biden family has been pardoned for their crimes in Ukraine.
Mr. Putin exists in a hall of mirrors. Only an implausible nuclear bluff has kept his floundering war afloat through 2½ years of Bidenism and Mr. Putin’s fear of certain segments of his own population.
His flunkies like Dmitri Medvedev and the talking heads on Russian TV who want to nuke the world only say it because they don’t mean it. Mr. Putin himself knows he can’t put off forever a reckoning with his failed gamble of February 2022. It’s a reckoning that, if he bothered to count, he will realize he shares with most Soviet as well as Western leaders who started wars since 1945.
His flunkies like Dmitri Medvedev and the talking heads on Russian TV who want to nuke the world only say it because they don’t mean it. Mr. Putin himself knows he can’t put off forever a reckoning with his failed gamble of February 2022. It’s a reckoning that, if he bothered to count, he will realize he shares with most Soviet as well as Western leaders who started wars since 1945.
Just wail til Trump is elected, bro, the war will be over in a day!
I wouldn't describe Ukraine as having lost as she did. I mean Ukraine took back much of what Russia originally took & it still exists independently. Have they permanently lost part of their territory? Yes. But that was true before the war. I'd call it a stalemate.
I am not sure that is accurate, but the longer this goes, the worse it gets for Ukraine, absent intervention. We have Americans getting injured in this war right now, but they appear to be acting as individuals, rather than as members of the U.S. military. Without formal intervention, Ukraine loses this war, eventually. That is why the comment was made that while there is still some leverage, actively pursing a compromised solution is important.
If Zelensky doesn't stop soon I fear the map above is going to be the new Russia/Ukraine border map.
Who did not see that coming. The laundering scheme worked for them. No one is going to follow up on the Biden, Piglosi, Zelensky kickback program.
There is little support for this.
If Zelensky doesn't stop soon I fear the map above is going to be the new Russia/Ukraine border map.
Maybe Zelensky will be open to having the DOGE team come over and do a forensic analysis of the government’s finances.
What happened to all the Ukraine news? No big z cameo at the Grammys?
Weird. Except oh ya....the propaganda machine had its lights turned out.
None of the ukraine flag carrying, zelinski underwear wearing posters in here concerned that just one shadow government agency funded 90% of the Ukraine news sources? Im guessing some usaid funded ngos funded the other 10%.
Oh well im sure they only ever told people the truth.
Weird. Except oh ya....the propaganda machine had its lights turned out.
None of the ukraine flag carrying, zelinski underwear wearing posters in here concerned that just one shadow government agency funded 90% of the Ukraine news sources? Im guessing some usaid funded ngos funded the other 10%.
Oh well im sure they only ever told people the truth.
They ran the exact same con there they ran here.
There, it was stoking ethnic divisions through past injustices to install a puppet, a puppet the public was literally brainwashed through a comedy series into believing was a reformer, a uniter.
Here, it was stoking racial/sexual
divisions (DEI, transgender) and "muh democracy, fascist!" nonsense divisions to install a puppet, ole jdoe from from scranton, as the uniter, to build back btr! They just couldn't get cackles, "they ain't like us!" across the finish line because of what little they didn'tt control, elon's twitter, joe rogan's podcasts etc.
There, it was stoking ethnic divisions through past injustices to install a puppet, a puppet the public was literally brainwashed through a comedy series into believing was a reformer, a uniter.
Here, it was stoking racial/sexual
divisions (DEI, transgender) and "muh democracy, fascist!" nonsense divisions to install a puppet, ole jdoe from from scranton, as the uniter, to build back btr! They just couldn't get cackles, "they ain't like us!" across the finish line because of what little they didn'tt control, elon's twitter, joe rogan's podcasts etc.Whaddya know…we said this exact thing in the first week.
Since usaid was dismantled, heard nothing about this conflict. Weird huh. Im sure it had nothing to do with them funding all of Ukraine media in return for "sympathetic" coverage.
But im sure everything they said before they went dark was all totally true.
But im sure everything they said before they went dark was all totally true.
" Donald Trump is Donald Trump. If he saw Europe as the source of political and resource commitment to Ukraine’s future security that would let him reach one kind of deal, he would jump at it. If Europe is not willing, then he will look for a different kind of success that will be less to Europe’s and Ukraine’s liking. This is the state of play now.
It’s true Mr. Trump might be seeing different opportunities and incentives if the Biden administration had proceeded differently. These possibilities are no longer in play but don’t kid yourself: President Biden wasn’t paralyzed by Russian nukes as if Mr. Putin is suicidal. Mr. Biden wanted to keep the stakes low lest voters at home take fright at his shambling state and promptly disqualify him for the second term that was Mr. Biden’s sole, exclusive priority until he was forced out of the race on July 21.
But the news is also potentially better than it seems. NATO won’t be Ukraine’s savior but the right kind of Ukraine deal can be NATO’s savior. The right kind of peace deal would be a quasi-template for the alliance’s own future. It would internalize one big lesson of the war: Russia is a conventional military power that can be thwarted, defeated and deterred by conventional means.
It would internalize a second lesson. Banished would be the convenient nuclear fatalism that Germany especially has relied on over the decades to justify its passivity. Europe’s security no longer needs to depend on Washington’s willingness to risk nuclear war over Estonia. In the post-Cold War world, nuclear threats turn out to be of little actual use to an aggressor at least against the first party-victim of its aggression. If the Ukraine war proves anything, the nuclear taboo holds for a country like Russia because, to put it simply, Russia still needs customers for its oil if it’s to survive.
Ukraine will always be a many-faceted headache for the alliance. No deal would stop it from being one democratic election away from a government bent on riling up voters over stolen lands. NATO wants no part of this. It would be a constant incitement to the Igor Girkins on both sides, i.e., nationalist adventurers seeking to embroil the alliance in revanchist intrigues. It would be an incitement to the Kremlin’s strategists, always on the lookout for new ways to test the West’s cohesion.
Mr. Hegseth vaguely walked back his words a day later. But let’s face it: His concession was less a concession than an admission that saves the U.S. a pantomime of negotiating with Mr. Putin over an outcome no more agreeable to the U.S. and its major allies than to Russia.
Meanwhile, it supplies real leverage to keep Mr. Putin outside the talks that matter, which he should have no role in: What the U.S. and Europe will do for Ukraine after a cease-fire is reached. Does Mr. Trump see it this way? Beats me. Some statements and signals suggest so. It should be a very simple calculation for Mr. Putin: Get out now while the getting is good, because Europe and the U.S. are committed to raising the Ukrainian military to a NATO standard even without it being a NATO member.
Mr. Putin has learned his military is no match for a properly equipped NATO force. His Ukraine misadventure is rapidly degrading his ability to compete in the long run. Mr. Putin will continue to pretend his war isn’t a disastrous miscalculation for which his country will be paying for generations to come. The peanut gallery should not be fooled.
It’s true Mr. Trump might be seeing different opportunities and incentives if the Biden administration had proceeded differently. These possibilities are no longer in play but don’t kid yourself: President Biden wasn’t paralyzed by Russian nukes as if Mr. Putin is suicidal. Mr. Biden wanted to keep the stakes low lest voters at home take fright at his shambling state and promptly disqualify him for the second term that was Mr. Biden’s sole, exclusive priority until he was forced out of the race on July 21.
But the news is also potentially better than it seems. NATO won’t be Ukraine’s savior but the right kind of Ukraine deal can be NATO’s savior. The right kind of peace deal would be a quasi-template for the alliance’s own future. It would internalize one big lesson of the war: Russia is a conventional military power that can be thwarted, defeated and deterred by conventional means.
It would internalize a second lesson. Banished would be the convenient nuclear fatalism that Germany especially has relied on over the decades to justify its passivity. Europe’s security no longer needs to depend on Washington’s willingness to risk nuclear war over Estonia. In the post-Cold War world, nuclear threats turn out to be of little actual use to an aggressor at least against the first party-victim of its aggression. If the Ukraine war proves anything, the nuclear taboo holds for a country like Russia because, to put it simply, Russia still needs customers for its oil if it’s to survive.
Ukraine will always be a many-faceted headache for the alliance. No deal would stop it from being one democratic election away from a government bent on riling up voters over stolen lands. NATO wants no part of this. It would be a constant incitement to the Igor Girkins on both sides, i.e., nationalist adventurers seeking to embroil the alliance in revanchist intrigues. It would be an incitement to the Kremlin’s strategists, always on the lookout for new ways to test the West’s cohesion.
Mr. Hegseth vaguely walked back his words a day later. But let’s face it: His concession was less a concession than an admission that saves the U.S. a pantomime of negotiating with Mr. Putin over an outcome no more agreeable to the U.S. and its major allies than to Russia.
Meanwhile, it supplies real leverage to keep Mr. Putin outside the talks that matter, which he should have no role in: What the U.S. and Europe will do for Ukraine after a cease-fire is reached. Does Mr. Trump see it this way? Beats me. Some statements and signals suggest so. It should be a very simple calculation for Mr. Putin: Get out now while the getting is good, because Europe and the U.S. are committed to raising the Ukrainian military to a NATO standard even without it being a NATO member.
Mr. Putin has learned his military is no match for a properly equipped NATO force. His Ukraine misadventure is rapidly degrading his ability to compete in the long run. Mr. Putin will continue to pretend his war isn’t a disastrous miscalculation for which his country will be paying for generations to come. The peanut gallery should not be fooled.
That’s the exact perspective I expect from the neocons. No matter the outcome now, two years of death, misery and expense was worth it.
Putin will pretend it was not a total disaster though.
Edit: I’ve lost track of time. It’s been almost three years to the day.
Putin will pretend it was not a total disaster though.
Edit: I’ve lost track of time. It’s been almost three years to the day.
