Stop Blaming NIL, and Look at Recruiting Numbers:

[The-Hack]

Stoops’ 12 seasons nicely break down into three 4 year recruiting periods, and they were cumulatively ranked, nationally, on Rivals as follows:

(A) 2013-2016 . . . . . 27.25th
(B) 2017-2020 . . . . . 26.75th
(C) 2021-2024 . . . . .24.75th.

Simply put, since the advent of NIL we have marginally improved our recruiting position. And if you count the core of the 2021 transfers, along with notables, since, our transfer classes have been as well respected.

If we are terrible at NIL, then somebody is an F’n genius to have improved our recruiting numbers since NIL came into existence.

This is not a raw talent question, though one might question our O-line choices, as more than any other position, it has blown up in our faces.

Still, if we are a Top 25 average, and have successively (thru transfers), inked three QB’s who were discussed as the best available, or darn near it, Coaching comes into serious question.

 

[TOMCATS1990]

It’s all on Stoops and the way the program has been run since he got that massive pay raise and extension. It’s not assistants however we need a couple of changes. It’s not the talent but they have whiffed on QB’s and OL. It starts and ends with Stoops. KY needs to find a way to part ways with his inept lazy azz.

 

[billoliver40]

Coaching definitely is a question. Besides the voided win season, thus is Stoops 2nd worse year. This far in.

 

[merrimanm]

I would be interested in seeing how that compares to our competition. Also, does this include transfer portal situations?

 

[The-Hack]

It’s all on Stoops

Yep.

We should be 8-4 or in that vicinity, if talent means anything.

1-7 in the SEC? We are probably 10th/11th in the SEC but at least 3 ahead of us are very marginally ahead of us . . . about as far ahead of us as we are South Carolina . . . and USCe put a 25 point beat down on us.

This odd slide began with a well-known Stoops whine about the difficulty of coaching, “it’s more than wearing silly sunglasses.” That was interpreted as a slight to USCe (maybe it was or wasn’t), but remembering the context, it was the beginning of the persistent whining we have heard for three years.

Sure, it’s tough . . . and about 9 folks get 9 million a year or more to do it.

 

[The-Hack]

I would be interested in seeing how that compares to our competition. Also, does this include transfer portal situations?

Well ahead of U of L, miles ahead of our three minor opponents, and at least on par with Ole Miss, Miss State, Arkansas, South Carolina, Mizzou and miles ahead of Vandy.

 

[The-Hack]

Also, does this include transfer portal situations?

Our average Star value on transferring talent has generally exceeded our average Star ranking for freshman class. Brock Vandergriff and the All-American LB from Georgia were highly rated, as were many that have come since 2021.

 

[merrimanm]

Well ahead of U of L, miles ahead of our three minor opponents, and at least on par with Ole Miss, Miss State, Arkansas, South Carolina, Mizzou and miles ahead of Vandy.

Well Vandy had a completely new offensive side of the ball this year. So did it include the portal as well? Also, I am not so sure we are on par with Ole Miss and South Carolina. Could be wrong though.

 

[The-Hack]

Well Vandy had a completely new offensive side of the ball this year. So did it include the portal as well? Also, I am not so sure we are on par with Ole Miss and South Carolina. Could be wrong though.

We have ranked well in portal additions, if rankings actually mean anything.

 

[merrimanm]

Our average Star value on transferring talent has generally exceeded our average Star ranking for freshman class. Brock Vandergriff and the All-American LB from Georgia were highly rated, as were many that have come since 2021.

Gotcha. So some guys have outperformed their HS ranking and some have underperformed their ranking.

 

[merrimanm]

We have ranked well in portal additions, if rankings actually mean anything.

We for sure have rated well. But I wonder if that is because of where these guys came from and the assumption was they were good, but just had too many good players ahead of them at the elite school, but in reality, they just wasn't good enough in general.

 

[The-Hack]

Gotcha. So some guys have outperformed their HS ranking and some have underperformed their ranking.

Always true across the country, but generally Coaches get credit for players playing above their presumed rankings, and fired for the opposite. The 2019 UK team ended 11th in the nation, having averaged about 27.5th the prior 4 recruiting years. We are ranked this season (by someone) in the eighties, having more recently averaging about 24th.

I’m not upset that Stoops pitched a 4-8 record: I’m angry he did so with some of the best recruiting in program history, yet has whines about NIL.

NIL is no excuse: Leary, BV, and Levis were huge gets in the portal, ironically, Levis being the least ballyhooed.

 

[merrimanm]

Always true across the country, but generally Coaches get credit for players playing above their presumed rankings, and fired for the opposite. The 2019 UK team ended 11th in the nation, having averaged about 27.5th the prior 4 recruiting years. We are ranked this season (by someone) in the eighties, having more recently averaging about 24th.

I’m not upset that Stoops pitched a 4-8 record: I’m angry he did so with some of the best recruiting in program history, yet has whines about NIL.

Agreed with a lot of that. I would argue the biggest thing he was not able to get more talent at was OL. Arguably the most important position on the field. Also, the difference in 27th and 24th is very small in reality.

 

[bthaunert]

I would be interested in seeing how that compares to our competition. Also, does this include transfer portal situations?

Generally speaking, we are equal to or better than 8 of our opponents on an annual basis in terms of HS recruiting rankings.

 

[The-Hack]

Generally speaking, we are equal to or better than 8 of our opponents on an annual basis in terms of HS recruiting rankings.

Exactly!!

And we are now, annually, getting soooo daaaarn close to 50 percent former Blue Chips.

 

[merrimanm]

Generally speaking, we are equal to or better than 8 of our opponents on an annual basis in terms of HS recruiting rankings.

So then other than this year, that means we are beating all 4 of the teams we are better than, and winning on average 2 or 3 against the four we are even with. So we are on average right where we should be based on that. So we aren't really losing games we are supposed to win, but we may win one we aren't supposed to.

 

[The-Hack]

Agreed with a lot of that. I would argue the biggest thing he was not able to get more talent at was OL. Arguably the most important position on the field. Also, the difference in 27th and 24th is very small in reality.

Yep.

Offensive line has been the weakest unit.

The frustrating part to a 60 year old: I watched decades of UK football with at least average O-lines in the SEC, good QB and back talent, and absolutely horrendous defensive lines. On paper our D-line now measures up with Top Ten programs, and our QB’s have less than 2 seconds to throw the damn ball, because our O-line sucks.

 

[TOMCATS1990]

So then other than this year, that means we are beating all 4 of the teams we are better than, and winning on average 2 or 3 against the four we are even with. So we are on average right where we should be based on that. So we aren't really losing games we are supposed to win, but we may win one we aren't supposed to.

The team this season was a mess in
most games little to no effort and not a care in the world. Coaches making bank to suck and the players making bank to take plays and games off.

 

[The-Hack]

So then other than this year, that means we are beating all 4 of the teams we are better than, and winning on average 2 or 3 against the four we are even with. So we are on average right where we should be based on that. So we aren't really losing games we are supposed to win, but we may win one we aren't supposed to.

Exactly, with 7 win seasons . . . maybe a tad low. But we lined up against Penn State with only one-third the number of former Blue Chip recruits than they had . . . having already exceeded expectations with 9 regular season wins.

 

[merrimanm]

Yep.

Offensive line has been the weakest unit.

The frustrating part to a 60 year old: I watched decades of UK football with at least average O-lines in the SEC, good QB and back talent, and absolutely horrendous defensive lines. On paper our D-line now measures up with Top Ten programs, and our QB’s have less than 2 seconds to throw the damn ball, because our O-line sucks.

Lol. I hear ya brother. I remember the days our defense couldn't stop anyone. DL was sooo bad.

 

[The-Hack]

Lol. I hear ya brother. I remember the days our defense couldn't stop anyone. DL was sooo bad.

I know we shat the bed on defense this season, but with no offense, you put too much pressure on the defense, and it is simple psychology for defenders to begin to give up, if they get no help from
the other side.

As to talent, watch the draft in June: we will have several names called, proving that we do not lack talent.

 

[merrimanm]

Exactly, with 7 win seasons . . . maybe a tad low. But we lined up against Penn State with only one-third the number of former Blue Chip recruits than they had . . . having already exceeded expectations with 9 regular season wins.

Right. Our 10 and 9 win seasons were outperforming their recruiting. This year they underperformed. But most of Stoops teams have been on par with what they should have been and a few seasons above where they should be. Based on recruiting rankings.

 

[3632]

Well Vandy had a completely new offensive side of the ball this year. So did it include the portal as well? Also, I am not so sure we are on par with Ole Miss and South Carolina. Could be wrong though.

Vandy wasn’t bringing in ‘big time’ players. Couple of p4 backups and guys from schools like mtsu. Obviously the qb from New Mexico with his coach

 

[merrimanm]

I know we shat the bed on defense this season, but with no offense, you put too much pressure on the defense, and it is simple psychology for defenders to begin to give up, if they get no help from
the other side.

Yup. They knew about the only chance they had was to hold every team scoreless. At this level, that is very hard. Hell, as bad as our Offense was even we found ways to score at least some every game. Lol

 

[merrimanm]

Vandy wasn’t bringing in ‘big time’ players. Couple of p4 backups and guys from schools like mtsu.

They brought in nearly all of their OCs team from New Mexico where he was the head coach. That team won 8 or 9 games with some very good wins IIRC.

 

[The-Hack]

They brought in nearly all of their OCs team from New Mexico where he was the head coach. That team won 8 or 9 games with some very good wins IIRC.

I watched NMS 2023 beat down of Auburn on the Plains.

I had no idea Coach Kill, Pavia and the All-Conference tight end from NMS we’re available, but had I been a Coach, I think I would have looked at that trio.

Yes, Pavia will never play NFL ball, but like LBJ, he just has that knack on the collegiate level.

 

[The-Hack]

Also, the difference in 27th and 24th is very small in reality.

But there is one Hell of a difference between finishing ranked 11th, with a 10-3 record, and beating PSU on NYD, in Florida, and a 4-8 finish.

It is especially frustrating that the 4-8 team was marginally more talented by recruiting rankings than was the 2019 team.

 

[merrimanm]

I watched NMS 2023 beat down of Auburn on the Plains.

I had no idea Coach Kill, Pavia and the All-Conference tight end from NMS we’re available, but had I been a Coach, I think I would have looked at that trio.

Yes, Pavia will never play NFL ball, but like LBJ, he just has that knack on the collegiate level.

Agreed. And Kill is a dang good Coach. Those dude can play too.

 

[RunninRichie]

Stoops’ 12 seasons nicely break down into three 4 year recruiting periods, and they were cumulatively ranked, nationally, on Rivals as follows:

(A) 2013-2016 . . . . . 27.25th
(B) 2017-2020 . . . . . 26.75th
(C) 2021-2024 . . . . .24.75th.

Simply put, since the advent of NIL we have marginally improved our recruiting position. And if you count the core of the 2021 transfers, along with notables, since, our transfer classes have been as well respected.

If we are terrible at NIL, then somebody is an F’n genius to have improved our recruiting numbers since NIL came into existence.

This is not a raw talent question, though one might question our O-line choices, as more than any other position, it has blown up in our faces.

Still, if we are a Top 25 average, and have successively (thru transfers), inked three QB’s who were discussed as the best available, or darn near it, Coaching comes into serious question.

This just shows how broken this program is. We did better with lower ranked classes. Now, we have the "jimmies and joes" but the X's and O's have fallen off a cliff. Just makes no sense. What went from a blue collar, hardworking, take no shit, program. Has quickly turned into a fat, lazy, and entitled program. Remember when teams like UGA, said UK was the most physical and toughest team, they played all year? What happened to that?

Either our scouting/player eval, has taken a dip, or the coaching has fallen off a cliff. Either way, not good.

 

[The-Hack]

Our 10 and 9 win seasons were outperforming their recruiting. This year they underperformed.

Exactly: so the more infuriating when Stoops implies NIL has crippled us with the “Pony Up,” demand.

THESE COACHES WERE OUTWARDLY PLEASED WITH THEIR RECRUITING EFFORTS THE LAST 4 YEARS, ONE CLASS BEING RANKED 14th NATIONALLY.

NIL is neither a cause nor an excuse for beatdowns by Vandy and USCe. NIL did not allow Murray State to sack and pressure our QB’s like a good FBS team does.

 

[merrimanm]

Exactly: so the more infuriating when Stoops implies NIL has crippled us with the “Pony Up,” demand.

THESE COACHES WERE OUTWARDLY PLEASED WITH THEIR RECRUITING EFFORTS THE LAST 4 YEARS, ONE CLASS BEING RANKED 14th NATIONALLY.

NIL is neither a cause nor an excuse for beatdowns by Vandy and USCe. NIL did not allow Murray State to sack and pressure our QB’s like a good FBS team does.

But it could though. Because again, those recruiting rankings are as a whole. But not the OL. And teams are spending a LOT of money to get those guys. So we may need more money to get them now instead of getting them as a guy who is ok to come and really grind and develop. I'm not sure to be honest though. I just know we tried to get top portal and HS OL guys last year and simply got outbid.

 

[The-Hack]

Because again, those recruiting rankings are as a whole. But not the OL.

We lost by transfer or simply giving up on football several 4 Star and high 3 Star OL guys, that were either not worth a scholly offer, and/or were not developed. By “Stars” or O-line recruiting 2020-2023 smoked the Bunchy Stallings/Kinnard/Stenberg classes.

 

[merrimanm]

We lost by transfer or simply giving up on football several 4 Star and high 3 Star OL guys, that were either not worth a scholly offer, and/or were not developed. By “Stars” or O-line recruiting 2020-2023 smoked the Bunchy Stallings/Kinnard/Stenberg classes.

Yeah. I think it was troll that posted the OL recruiting. It was bad during this stretch.

I will say this though. I think losing our identity has been the biggest issue. The guys you named were road graders and nasty dudes. Which is why we went to the power run game. We didn't need to lose that. We just needed to develop a competent pass game to compliment it. But instead, we completely change systems.