NIL downside

[RobEStacy]

For players that know they don't have a NBA chance, or for those without a good work ethic... Is getting paid up front causing players to coast, and not play as hard, all the time.

Is NIL causing coach's to play highly paid NIL players even when they are not producing, in fear of losing that NIL money for the next year.

Solutions to this? Structure NIL with incentives... A base pay, that rewards the player for x amount of games won. Reach sec champ is a bonus. Sweet 16...bonus....ect. I don't think you can add personal achievements like, lead team in scoring.... Ect, because that would cause players to become ball hogs.

Just seems, like we have seen alot of less then engaged play, since NIL became a thing. Not just at UK either... But across the board, in basketball and football.

 

[4849515878969812...]

Your title would indicate that there is some type of upside to NIL. There is not. NIL and the portal is causing a slow, agonizing death to collegiate athletics.

 

[LineSkiCat14]

It's funny I sort of thought of this yesterday with our team. It's too early to say, but this lack of effort from this team.. even Cals teams didn't have this problem..

Some of these guys know they aren't playing ball as a career, yet UK was handing out quite big paydays to entice talent. Does make you wonder.

I still think we need to not only expand NIL offering but also create a NIL department if it doesn't already exist. I'd like to see all players with a NIL deal be evaluated at year end to determine if we want to extend the offering. If some players are coasting, you don't renew. And really, that's how this SHOULD be. The players should be paid based on results just like the rest of us, so many there needs to be some sort of review where players know they have to play hard in order to keep getting a pay day.

 

[Tf2217]

NIL should be paid after the season at least for freshman when a more reasonable guess of their value can be made. Can't have millions worth of NIL if you've never done anything to gain any name or image.

 

[TFCats11]

Yeah, this is going to be a problem for sure! You hear the national guys already talking about it becoming an issue!

Serval teams, and I don’t believe UK is one of them yet, are not getting anywhere near the production value for what they paid out!

The big money will dry up fast for some programs if this pattern persists.

 

[yoshukai]

Your title would indicate that there is some type of upside to NIL. There is not. NIL and the portal is causing a slow, agonizing death to collegiate athletics.

I’m not even sure if it’s “slow” death. Seems to be deteriorating pretty quickly to me .

 

[Butters' Dad]

This is ridiculous logic. You think our guys are getting paid more than Tennessee's roster? Doesn't seem to be affecting their play very much.

 

[Wildcat-in-STL]

Its not causing the rest of the SEC to coast. there are a lot of non nba guys on SEC teams and they are all playing hard.

 

[Catfanlou]

I thought our players played hard and never gave up . Poor defense and off night shooting . I don’t know enough about our system to know if they are still not running it properly . I am frustrated that we can’t get Brea more open shots . Maybe some double screens down low ?

 

[gojvc]

Your title would indicate that there is some type of upside to NIL. There is not. NIL and the portal is causing a slow, agonizing death to collegiate athletics.

It’s slow?

 

[Fox2monk]

For players that know they don't have a NBA chance, or for those without a good work ethic... Is getting paid up front causing players to coast, and not play as hard, all the time.

Is NIL causing coach's to play highly paid NIL players even when they are not producing, in fear of losing that NIL money for the next year.

Solutions to this? Structure NIL with incentives... A base pay, that rewards the player for x amount of games won. Reach sec champ is a bonus. Sweet 16...bonus....ect. I don't think you can add personal achievements like, lead team in scoring.... Ect, because that would cause players to become ball hogs.

Just seems, like we have seen alot of less then engaged play, since NIL became a thing. Not just at UK either... But across the board, in basketball and football.

I think in the future this is exactly what will happen, at base you will play here X number of years, paid out in a structure after games played. Maybe incentives laced too.

 

[Fox2monk]

It's funny I sort of thought of this yesterday with our team. It's too early to say, but this lack of effort from this team.. even Cals teams didn't have this problem..

Some of these guys know they aren't playing ball as a career, yet UK was handing out quite big paydays to entice talent. Does make you wonder.

I still think we need to not only expand NIL offering but also create a NIL department if it doesn't already exist. I'd like to see all players with a NIL deal be evaluated at year end to determine if we want to extend the offering. If some players are coasting, you don't renew. And really, that's how this SHOULD be. The players should be paid based on results just like the rest of us, so many there needs to be some sort of review where players know they have to play hard in order to keep getting a pay day.

I wouldn’t question the effort it has been there for the most part. I think some is lack of ability maybe but they play hard. Williams body language and effort guarding could be better, but that is an issue with players every year.

 

[KYExtemper]

Sooner rather than later I think you are going to see teams make NIL deals with a lot of stings attached. If you don't produce? Goodbye or you get much less. You opt out of a bowl game? You don't get everything you are owed.

Right now players have the leverage but market forces will soon create a correction, especially if teams move in unison to do this.

 

[UKBB4Ever]

That’s not how NIL works and making NIL performance based is illegal.

And the notion that our guys are not playing hard is preposterous.

 

[Son_Of_Saul]

UK should hire a scouting department.

Two to three guys who know Pope's system whose #1 job is just to monitor players who fit the system who might enter the portal in the Spring.

That way, the coaching staff can have a "big board" of sorts, and spring the action when the portal opens, with money allocations already prepared and set aside the moment a player enters the portal.

 

[Phil_The_Music]

That’s not how NIL works and making NIL performance based is illegal.

And the notion that our guys are not playing hard is preposterous.

Does anyone REALLY know how NIL works?

 

[LineSkiCat14]

Sooner rather than later I think you are going to see teams make NIL deals with a lot of stings attached. If you don't produce? Goodbye or you get much less. You opt out of a bowl game? You don't get everything you are owed.

Right now players have the leverage but market forces will soon create a correction, especially if teams move in unison to do this.

We have to move to this in college athletics. I'm all for the players getting revenue, but in turn I also think they now have to fulfill work obligations just like the rest of us. And yes I agree. Market forces will eventually dictate this, there have to be tons of schools and NIL funders who are passed that their investment isn't paying off. Like what if Dybantsa is a bust that cost BYU however many millions?

The problem is, who wants to be the first school to do this? Because the players won't like this. But some school will have to bite the bullet and maybe even up the offers for a while.

But I cant wait until this corrects itself, because like you said the playsrs have all the power right now.

 

[westerncat]

ALL the schools should get together and agree that they will only play a certain amount but we know that will not happen. I said when this NIL came about that they were opening a can of worms. Might as well say schools are pro's now.

 

[RobEStacy]

That’s not how NIL works and making NIL performance based is illegal.

And the notion that our guys are not playing hard is preposterous.

First, this was not a 100% directed toward this team, or UK in general... Just a observation in general in football and basketball across the NCAA. There is countless Twitter, reddit and other message board posts asking simular questions.

You are correct... The NIL deal itself, can't be performance based. It can included injury clauses and for leaving the team. NIL was not supposed to be pay for play either, and yet we have these massive collectives that have nil deals open up if a kid come to school XYZ. We have coaches publicly saying, if you want to win more games, then pony up. The idea that NIL is strictly for what it was made for, is a illusion, the NCAA made to keep some semblance of ameturism and not just become semi pro ball. Which we all already know that's what it has become.

Already talk of nil deals having a clause that will reduce the deal if a player skips bowl games. NCAA rules do not prohibite nil deals from happening at any point during the season... And there is a multitude of ways to infer if a football team wins 10 game, then these nil deal might become available. We are stupid to think, that this is not already happening. At some point, the money will dry up, if companies and individuals don't see on field results for the money they spent. I forsee that crash coming in the next few years.

 

[MrHotDice]

Mob run, organize crime, betting scandal it’s all coming to a basketball arena near you.

 

[susan2361]

How is making NIL performance based illegal? I don't know enough about NIL and how it is structured and the rules that apply to it.
Thanks in advance to someone who can explain how it works. If someone is paying NIL to a player, why can't they expect decent play from that player? ( Example: instead of using a weekend in NYC to go to a Broadway show, spend time thinking about and planning on getting engaged, sightseeing, etc. I thought their primary reason for being there was to play basketball. I guess I don't understand NIL. If those players are traveling to NYC to play basketball and being paid to play basketball, shouldn't the game take priority?)
Sorry, but I really don't understand.

 

[K_TIME]

That’s not how NIL works and making NIL performance based is illegal.

And the notion that our guys are not playing hard is preposterous.

You have no idea how NIL can or does work......it is essentially...wild west...you can structure what you want....now will a kid sign than NIL if competing NIL isn't incentive based...maybe that is the landscape.

 

[KYExtemper]

That’s not how NIL works and making NIL performance based is illegal.

Just put people on one year NIL deals like current academic/athletic scholarships are one year. Restructure afterward. Not too hard to do. I'd argue we're already seeing this in the status quo with players abandoning ship at some schools after a year or so to make more money elsewhere. That's basically performance based.

 

[NociHTTP]

That’s not how NIL works and making NIL performance based is illegal.

And the notion that our guys are not playing hard is preposterous.

That's how NIL is going to work. Anyone with a working set of eyes, and functioning frontal lobe, can see that in order for collegiate sports to survive at a high level, the contract language WILL change to protect schools and the respective sports.

 

[Padsfs07]

NIL should be paid after the season at least for freshman when a more reasonable guess of their value can be made. Can't have millions worth of NIL if you've never done anything to gain any name or image.

So if they don’t play ‘hard’, are you gonna withhold the money? Doesn’t even make sense.

 

[Fox2monk]

Does anyone REALLY know how NIL works?

Definitely not working how it should and everyone knows it, but the NCAA is powerless to stop it. So they can do and make payment based on anything now I’d say.

 

[Fox2monk]

How is making NIL performance based illegal? I don't know enough about NIL and how it is structured and the rules that apply to it.
Thanks in advance to someone who can explain how it works. If someone is paying NIL to a player, why can't they expect decent play from that player? ( Example: instead of using a weekend in NYC to go to a Broadway show, spend time thinking about and planning on getting engaged, sightseeing, etc. I thought their primary reason for being there was to play basketball. I guess I don't understand NIL. If those players are traveling to NYC to play basketball and being paid to play basketball, shouldn't the game take priority?)
Sorry, but I really don't understand.

It’s not supposed to be a direct pay to play but it absolutely is right now. Nobody can do anything to stop it and the NCAA is waiting on congress to do something about it. We all know the rate they move at this will be the way it goes for at least another decade I’d say.

 

[CaptainBoogerBuns]

It’s not supposed to be a direct pay to play but it absolutely is right now. Nobody can do anything to stop it and the NCAA is waiting on congress to do something about it. We all know the rate they move at this will be the way it goes for at least another decade I’d say.

Tennessee leads the pack with "creative license" for NIL with their fb team. Is it any surprise?

 

[Butters' Dad]

That's how NIL is going to work. Anyone with a working set of eyes, and functioning frontal lobe, can see that in order for collegiate sports to survive at a high level, the contract language WILL change to protect schools and the respective sports.

There's such a fundamental misunderstanding of the ruling that established NIL still that it's remarkable to me that more people haven't just read the ruling. It would allow you to avoid looking like an idiot on the internet for whatever that's worth. You can't regulate NIL. You can't pass rulings to limit NIL or cap NIL. The ruling that established a player's right to earn NIL also established that it cannot be limited in any way and any attempt to regulate it will fail in court. There is no change coming that will put schools on more of a level playing field again. This is the new normal in college sports. More and more people will slowly start to catch onto this and tune out.

 

[chroix]

ALL the schools should get together and agree that they will only play a certain amount but we know that will not happen. I said when this NIL came about that they were opening a can of worms. Might as well say schools are pro's now.

That’s wage fixing and would get them in huge trouble.

 

[chroix]

NIL should be paid after the season at least for freshman when a more reasonable guess of their value can be made. Can't have millions worth of NIL if you've never done anything to gain any name or image.

You should talk to your boss and do this at your job.

 

[RobEStacy]

Might not have to wait long... Looks like a NIL antitrust case is set to be desided in the spring... Would limit NIL to $600. Anything over that would have to go to a clearing house, to deem if it's truly a NIL deal. If not.. It will get rejected... Judge has already granted Preliminary Approval.

 

[KYExtemper]

There's such a fundamental misunderstanding of the ruling that established NIL still that it's remarkable to me that more people haven't just read the ruling. It would allow you to avoid looking like an idiot on the internet for whatever that's worth. You can't regulate NIL. You can't pass rulings to limit NIL or cap NIL. The ruling that established a player's right to earn NIL also established that it cannot be limited in any way and any attempt to regulate it will fail in court. There is no change coming that will put schools on more of a level playing field again. This is the new normal in college sports. More and more people will slowly start to catch onto this and tune out.

While true, I don't think a lot of these players are making these deals on their own. If schools/boosters aren't arranging it, they aren't getting much. So the way I see it, yes, there can't be limitations per se but good luck to a player trying to hustle and get more money on their own without university/booster support.

 

[natchezrule]

NIL is all downside

 

[KAB Cats]

Pressure or market will lead to program X offering no incentive for payment vs program Y offering payment only for performance. Player A will choose program X every time.

I don’t think necessarily that younger players getting paid crushes their drive, but that probably will be the case for some. Take some of these Euro soccer players who join up with major academies from about the age of 14… that’s just how it is there and they have the greatest players in the world.

 

[SkyPrince1]

How is making NIL performance based illegal? I don't know enough about NIL and how it is structured and the rules that apply to it.
Thanks in advance to someone who can explain how it works. If someone is paying NIL to a player, why can't they expect decent play from that player? ( Example: instead of using a weekend in NYC to go to a Broadway show, spend time thinking about and planning on getting engaged, sightseeing, etc. I thought their primary reason for being there was to play basketball. I guess I don't understand NIL. If those players are traveling to NYC to play basketball and being paid to play basketball, shouldn't the game take priority?)
Sorry, but I really don't understand.

NIL has to attached to "NIL" type things like personal appearances, signing autographs etc.
That's how the collectives work.
They grossly overpay for pre arranged events that the player has agreed to participate in.
A collective can't tie a deal to "points, rebounds and assists".

 

[SkyPrince1]

There's such a fundamental misunderstanding of the ruling that established NIL still that it's remarkable to me that more people haven't just read the ruling. It would allow you to avoid looking like an idiot on the internet for whatever that's worth. You can't regulate NIL. You can't pass rulings to limit NIL or cap NIL. The ruling that established a player's right to earn NIL also established that it cannot be limited in any way and any attempt to regulate it will fail in court. There is no change coming that will put schools on more of a level playing field again. This is the new normal in college sports. More and more people will slowly start to catch onto this and tune out.

True.
You can't attack NIL on the players end.
Any hope to end the madness has to be done on the money supply end.
A Clearinghouse seems logical.
The courts would have to decide whether the NCAA could stop a gross overpayment for services rendered.
If say a UK QB was paid 10 times what Joe Burrow would receive for a personal appearances that could be struck down as outside of reasonable compensation for services.
I don't know if it was ever challenged in court but the NCAA shut down the " summer jobs" for players where compensation was way out of bounds for the jobs performed.

 

[susan2361]

NIL has to attached to "NIL" type things like personal appearances, signing autographs etc.
That's how the collectives work.
They grossly overpay for pre arranged events that the player has agreed to participate in.
A collective can't tie a deal to "points, rebounds and assists".

Thanks.

 

[Butters' Dad]

True.
You can't attack NIL on the players end.
Any hope to end the madness has to be done on the money supply end.
A Clearinghouse seems logical.
The courts would have to decide whether the NCAA could stop a gross overpayment for services rendered.
If say a UK QB was paid 10 times what Joe Burrow would receive for a personal appearances that could be struck down as outside of reasonable compensation for services.
I don't know if it was ever challenged in court but the NCAA shut down the " summer jobs" for players where compensation was way out of bounds for the jobs performed.

You say true, indicating you understood my post, and then proceed to prove you didn't understand it in the rest of your reply. It's not a difficult concept. Just read it over again... slowly.

 

[Butters' Dad]

While true, I don't think a lot of these players are making these deals on their own. If schools/boosters aren't arranging it, they aren't getting much. So the way I see it, yes, there can't be limitations per se but good luck to a player trying to hustle and get more money on their own without university/booster support.

I have no idea what you're even trying to say. It makes no sense.