NFL Conference Championship Round

[LineSkiCat14]

I hate the chiefs and honestly believe the NFL and refs favor them at every turn, but the Bills are such chokers and they lost the game because they were inept.

See I really can't understand this line of thinking. Based on the final score, I think we can all say that the Bills did more than enough to win the game. So why do we excuse bad officiating just because the Bills didn't play perfect? I'll tell yah, if those two calls were made correctly, Bills might be (maybe even probably) going to the superbowl, and no one is talking about some of their plays that didnt go as well as they wanted.

No team ever plays a perfect game. Chiefs sure made mistakes at times..

Have to get the calls right. If the Bills lose after fixing those 5-6 calls, then that's on them. But you should never have to win the game twice. You shouldn't have to play the game well enough to win (Which the Bills clearly did), and then have the officials say "no, you're gonna have to win it a 2nd time".

 

[Pelosigalore]

I would assume that 99% of America wil be rooting for the Eagles in the Superbowl

 

[LineSkiCat14]

Believe it or not, there's a part of me that wants to see Mahomes get his 3 peat, because it will only hurt Tom's GOAT status. A guy who was the ORIGINAL protected QB from the NFL officials. How quickly some forget that we had to deal with this for 15 years with the Pats.. but I will day, Mahomes has taken it to a whole different level.

I also think if he 3peats, then Kelce might retire and then we can hopefully start to move on from the Taylor Swift part of the equation.

 

[HeismaNole]

Believe it or not, there's a part of me that wants to see Mahomes get his 3 peat, because it will only hurt Tom's GOAT status. A guy who was the ORIGINAL protected QB from the NFL officials. How quickly some forget that we had to deal with this for 15 years with the Pats.. but I will day, Mahomes has taken it to a whole different level.

I also think if he 3peats, then Kelce might retire and then we can hopefully start to move on from the Taylor Swift part of the equation.

Brady wasn’t protected like this. He certainly wasn’t the “star” early on like Mahomes has been. The Tuck Rule, although an incredibly stupid rule, was still the rule at the time. Normally that would just be a fumble and that’s over. But letter of the rule was correct and had went against them earlier that season vs the Jets. That and the 2017 AFC title game is the only ones that seemed to have favorable officiating for postseason. Don’t remember officiating going their way like this.

Soft rule changes didn’t start until about 10 years after his first Super Bowl. Brady used to get lit up. Remember that awesome hit from Nate Clements? Guy would’ve went to prison if that were against Mahomes today.

If Brady got the Mahomes treatment, no way would the Giants have beaten their perfect season.

Two things regarding the Brady and Mahomes debate which Mahomes is clearly second all-time as of now, is that his success has been more front loaded than Brady’s was.

Brady’s first MVP was like his seventh year as a starter. Mahomes’ was in his first season as a starter.

Mahomes has been to five Super Bowls in seven seasons as a starter. Brady’s fifth Super Bowl appearance was in his 11th season.

Here’s what I think makes it hard to argue Mahomes over Brady. They played twice in the postseason. Brady is responsible for two of Mahomes’ only three postseason losses.

 

[LineSkiCat14]

Brady wasn’t protected like this. He certainly wasn’t the “star” early on like Mahomes has been. The Tuck Rule, although an incredibly stupid rule, was still the rule at the time. Normally that would just be a fumble and that’s over. But letter of the rule was correct and had went against them earlier that season vs the Jets.

Soft rule changes didn’t start until about 10 years after his first Super Bowl. Brady used to get lit up. Remember that awesome hit from Nate Clements? Guy would’ve went to prison if that were against Mahomes today.

If Brady got the Mahomes treatment, no way would the Giants have beaten their perfect season.

Two things regarding the Brady and Mahomes debate which Mahomes is clearly second all-time as of now, is that his success has been more front loaded than Brady’s was.

Brady’s first MVP was like his seventh year as a starter. Mahomes’ was in his first season as a starter.

Mahomes has been to five Super Bowls in seven seasons as a starter. Brady’s fifth Super Bowl appearance was in his 11th season.

Here’s what I think makes it hard to argue Mahomes over Brady. They played twice in the postseason. Brady is responsible for two of Mahomes’ only three postseason losses.

I do agree that this is a whole different level for Mahomes. But I watched a LOT of Patriots games through the years, being a Jets fan, Bills family, etc. Brady certainly got his protection as he ushered in the era of protecting the QB. The RTPs, late hit calls, the whining to the officials.. and in generaly just the calls the Pats would get.. the PIs, holding calls, etc.

 

[Deeeefense]

I looked at both controversial calls and I conclude on the 4th down conversation that failed, the reason the one side official overruled the other is because he had the better look. To me the replay was inconclusive, so call stands.

On the contested catch, the ball did hit the ground but it did not move in any appreciable way that would indicate firm possession wasn't there. IN fact both the recdeive and the defener appared to have possession. The receiver came out with the ball so the call of a catch was proper IMO

 

[HeismaNole]

I do agree that this is a whole different level for Mahomes. But I watched a LOT of Patriots games through the years, being a Jets fan, Bills family, etc. Brady certainly got his protection as he ushered in the era of protecting the QB. The RTPs, late hit calls, the whining to the officials.. and in generaly just the calls the Pats would get.. the PIs, holding calls, etc.

I hated the Pats pre Pats 2.0. Loved Gronk and Edelman. I like those guys a lot. Hated Brady until like 2011.

The hit on Brady that took him out for the season definitely aided the rule changes but I think those Steelers teams (dirtiest) were what got the rules changed the most.

But it’s crazy how much of the Patriots success/losses had the thinnest of margins.

01- last second field goal (tuck rule in divisional
03- Panthers tie the game then kick the kickoff out of bounds/ setting up for a shorter field to get the game winning field goal.

04- won by three again but never felt like the Eagles were that big of threats

07- one play away from an undefeated season, missed two easy INTs.

11- Difference of one play/ Welker missed catch/Manningham catch, offsides on Giants INT in red zone

14- Malcolm Butler interception

16- 28 point comeback where literally everything had to be perfect to come back.

18- Won Super Bowl by 10 but in the AFC title game, they would’ve lost to the Chiefs if Dee Ford wasn’t offsides on a game-sealing pick.

Look how thin that is from being 10-0 or 0-10,

 

[HeismaNole]

I looked at both controversial calls and I conclude on the 4th down conversation that failed, the reason the one side official overruled the other is because he had the better look. To me the replay was inconclusive, so call stands.

On the contested catch, the ball did hit the ground but it did not move in any appreciable way that would indicate firm possession wasn't there. IN fact both the recdeive and the defener appared to have possession. The receiver came out with the ball so the call of a catch was proper IMO

How did he have the better look when his side couldn’t even see the ball?

Look up the rule for the catch. By no means did Worthy have possession. He had one hand on the side of the ball. Look at the gloves.

 

[LineSkiCat14]

You also had what I thought were a few missed PIs on KC and a few late hits RTPs on Josh Allen, that would have been called if it was Mahomes. That's kind of the downside to being a big QB, is that you can sort of absorb these big hits.. but that doesn't mean it's not still a penalty. Hitting a QB who is already out of bounds should be a penalty whether you're 6 foot 5 or 5 foot 9.

 

[screwduke1]

I would assume that 99% of America wil be rooting for the Eagles in the Superbowl

I don't want the Chiefs to win but I'm not necessarily rooting for the Eagles either. I'm probably not even gonna watch it.

 

[Soupbean]

Someone want to tell the Bills coach they should teach them the tush push? Holy hell that was embarrassing

Tush push has to have two waves. Cant just leave it up to a running back on the initial shove, the second shove once the pile stops is the big one that always moves the pile.

Some engineer type out there smarter than me can probably explain why that is but it works every time. Must have something to do with inertia or transfer of energy or something else I never understood.

 

[vhcat70]

I would assume that 99% of America wil be rooting for the Eagles in the Superbowl

I won't be rooting. Only cared about Bills.

 

[Soupbean]

You're right. I mean look at this picture at an odd angle, of the qbs back, with the football hidden, and yardmarker out of screen. No way to argue against that

Yeah cant tell anything on the 4th down just cant see where the ball is to determine enough, but either way sure wasnt clear he made it. The third down spot with the WR was the bigger miss IMO. Looked like he got a bad spot but since there was another down they didnt spend anytime looking at it.

 

[Joerules19]

...and you're OK with cheating as long as it benefits you. Thanks for illustrating that by avoiding the rest of my post. Seems we all have issues

I am confused. Who cheated?
Mahomes?
Travis Kelce?
Andy Reid?
The entire Chiefs organization?
The referees?
The NFL?

 

[Joerules19]

The Chiefs catch that was not in clear possession was the real problem for me. The Bills 4th down run was a bad call, but it's also one that I can SORT of see not always being accurate (Why we don't have sensors in the ball is beyond me). But that catch call was just clear as day, not a catch.

I've thought about the sensor part, but what I keep going back to is wouldn't there need to be sensors an their knees, forearms, elbows etc. to see when they are down. I guess it could work in the situation you described if the player is still upright

 

[FirewithFire]

the Bills are such chokers and they lost the game because they were inept.

They do have quite the history of that don't they, lol?

 

[ukalum1988]

Chiefs bandwagon gets bigger. I know multiple Celtics/Chiefs/Cardinals/Duke basketball/Alabama Football fans.

All I can say is I see a whole LOT more Chiefs license plates, bumper stickers, etc. than I did 5+ years ago. At one house in my neighborhood they even have a Chiefs flag on the flagpole.

Even my wife has become a fair-weather Chiefs fan because one of the close friends she's made in past 10 years is a legit, lifelong Chiefs fan.

I'm really trying hard to get pumped up to watch Super Bowl LIX but I'm just not feeling it.

 

[HeismaNole]

They do have quite the history of that don't they, lol?

Oh yeah. That’s how it goes. To be fair, they were only favored in the first Super Bowl. The other three years the NFC was just clearly better.

But I watched Buffalo choke so many normal games too. Watched them piss away a game vs the Patriots in the Brady/Moss era. They were up two scores, gave up a TD in the final minute. All they have to do is recover an onside kick. Nope. Pats got that and then score again. 😂

They went like 18 years without a playoff appearance. Josh Allen has completely changed the organization. For most of that time period, Bills were never good enough for the playoffs but never bad enough to get an organizational-changing draft pick.

 

[HeismaNole]

All I can say is I see a whole LOT more Chiefs license plates, bumper stickers, etc. than I did 5+ years ago. At one house in my neighborhood they even have a Chiefs flag on the flagpole.

Even my wife has become a fair-weather Chiefs fan because one of the close friends she's made in past 10 years is a legit, lifelong Chiefs fan.

I'm really trying hard to get pumped up to watch Super Bowl LIX but I'm just not feeling it.

Before the Mahomes era, I only saw two Chiefs jerseys out in the wild and they were usually worn by a waitress ant Buffalo Wild Wings and it was a Larry Johnson or Tony G jersey.

Now kids wear them just like you saw everyone as Bulls fans in the 90s.

 

[LineSkiCat14]

Oh yeah. That’s how it goes. To be fair, they were only favored in the first Super Bowl. The other three years the NFC was just clearly better.

But I watched Buffalo choke so many normal games too. Watched them piss away a game vs the Patriots in the Brady/Moss era. They were up two scores, gave up a TD in the final minute. All they have to do is recover an onside kick. Nope. Pats got that and then score again. 😂

They went like 18 years without a playoff appearance. Josh Allen has completely changed the organization. For most of that time period, Bills were never good enough for the playoffs but never bad enough to get an organizational-changing draft pick.

That game that they gave up to the Pats.. that might have been the one my Dad said "We got this!" and I said "IDK.. It's the Bills man, they find ways to lose".. and sure enough they did.

 

[HeismaNole]

That game that they gave up to the Pats.. that might have been the one my Dad said "We got this!" and I said "IDK.. It's the Bills man, they find ways to lose".. and sure enough they did.

It was. It was the game the Pats wore the red throwbacks. Beating them was so rare and it was such a big deal to beat the Pats and then without fail---it's like a disease. You just expect it. Similar feeling as UK football but without ever having any success.

 

[Joerules19]

Brady wasn’t protected like this. He certainly wasn’t the “star” early on like Mahomes has been. The Tuck Rule, although an incredibly stupid rule, was still the rule at the time. Normally that would just be a fumble and that’s over. But letter of the rule was correct and had went against them earlier that season vs the Jets. That and the 2017 AFC title game is the only ones that seemed to have favorable officiating for postseason. Don’t remember officiating going their way like this.

Soft rule changes didn’t start until about 10 years after his first Super Bowl. Brady used to get lit up. Remember that awesome hit from Nate Clements? Guy would’ve went to prison if that were against Mahomes today.

If Brady got the Mahomes treatment, no way would the Giants have beaten their perfect season.

Two things regarding the Brady and Mahomes debate which Mahomes is clearly second all-time as of now, is that his success has been more front loaded than Brady’s was.

Brady’s first MVP was like his seventh year as a starter. Mahomes’ was in his first season as a starter.

Mahomes has been to five Super Bowls in seven seasons as a starter. Brady’s fifth Super Bowl appearance was in his 11th season.

Here’s what I think makes it hard to argue Mahomes over Brady. They played twice in the postseason. Brady is responsible for two of Mahomes’ only three postseason losses.

Brady did used to get destroyed. Then the NFL decided they needed to protect their stars because that is what people pay to see. It wasn't just Brady either. Peyton Manning was in his prime and he was getting destroyed. No one wants to see a matchup between Matt Cassel and Brock Osweiler. They want Brady v Manning or today Allen v Mahomes. Its the same reason a lot of people get really pissed about the NBA. People pay good money to go to a regular season game to see Lebron or Jokic or the Greek Freak and it is a day off for them.

Regardless, you can't blame Mahomes or other star QB's because they play in a different era and are more protected. Allen is protected, Mahomes is, they all are. It's a part of the game now.

Who cheated?
Mahomes?
Travis Kelce?
Andy Reid?
The entire Chiefs organization?
The referees?
The NFL?

 

[LineSkiCat14]

Brady did used to get destroyed. Then the NFL decided they needed to protect their stars because that is what people pay to see. It wasn't just Brady either. Peyton Manning was in his prime and he was getting destroyed. No one wants to see a matchup between Matt Cassel and Brock Osweiler. They want Brady v Manning or today Allen v Mahomes. Its the same reason a lot of people get really pissed about the NBA. People pay good money to go to a regular season game to see Lebron or Jokic or the Greek Freak and it is a day off for them.

Regardless, you can't blame Mahomes or other star QB's because they play in a different era and are more protected. Allen is protected, Mahomes is, they all are. It's a part of the game now.

Who cheated?
Mahomes?
Travis Kelce?
Andy Reid?
The entire Chiefs organization?
The referees?
The NFL?

The NFL. I dont think the Chiefs did any sort of cheating.. they just landed in a situation with Kelce/Swift where the NFL stands to gain a LOT more money from the female demographic if they make it to the SB.

The thing is, everyone and every show that isn't beholden to the NFL, told us the Chiefs would get the calls.. and they did. Houston Texans went off about it. But they weirdly didn't have a problem with the officiating when the Jets beat them (Texans) on Halloween

 

[Joerules19]

The NFL. I dont think the Chiefs did any sort of cheating.. they just landed in a situation with Kelce/Swift where the NFL stands to gain a LOT more money from the female demographic if they make it to the SB.

The thing is, everyone and every show that isn't beholden to the NFL, told us the Chiefs would get the calls.. and they did. Houston Texans went off about it. But they weirdly didn't have a problem with the officiating when the Jets beat them (Texans) on Halloween

On a side note, just remembered it was the Bills who swapped first round picks w the chiefs. Chiefs used that to draft Mahomes

 

[ukalum1988]

 

[sieken]

View embedded media

That about sums it up for me

 

[yes_takeaside]

It looks way easier in slow-mo, but man you gotta make this catch with the game on the line.

View embedded media

I wouldn’t call that a drop at all. Could he have caught it? Maybe but it looked Ike he saw it late and sort of dove and it certainly didn’t hit him in the hands

 

[yes_takeaside]

How did he have the better look when his side couldn’t even see the ball?

Look up the rule for the catch. By no means did Worthy have possession. He had one hand on the side of the ball. Look at the gloves.

Both guys had their arms around the ball which is why it didn’t move when it hit the ground. Two arms versus one is meaningless. Tie goes to offense.

As far as the first down call the ref running in from the other side was clearly wrong. No way Allen got to where he was going to mark it.

Wonder how many of the whiners lost money on the game?

 

[Joerules19]

The NFL. I dont think the Chiefs did any sort of cheating.. they just landed in a situation with Kelce/Swift where the NFL stands to gain a LOT more money from the female demographic if they make it to the SB.

The thing is, everyone and every show that isn't beholden to the NFL, told us the Chiefs would get the calls.. and they did. Houston Texans went off about it. But they weirdly didn't have a problem with the officiating when the Jets beat them (Texans) on Halloween

I think the last sentence you typed hits home the most. The losing side is always going to bitch the most about calls (in any sport). To a certain extent we see what we want to see. We justify the calls that may go our way and we lose our minds when we are on the wrong side of it. We are extremely biased and always have our rose colored glasses on. I can think of several calls that didn't go the Chiefs way from the game. Off the top of my head, the refs missed a face mask, they called a false start on the Chiefs when the Bills guy jumped first and there was another play where the Bills jumped and it was missed. Did the refs do this on purpose or was it just human error, like Dalton missing the catch or Mahomes fumbling.? Did it ultimately effect the outcome of the game? Who knows. Take the Worthy catch/non-catch. Chiefs were up 14-10. Let's say they rule it not a catch. Chiefs still have the ball 1st and 10 because there was defensive holding. They had been driving the ball well all first half. There was only 4 minutes or so left. Maybe they milk the clock more, score and it doesn't leave Allen enough time to drive the ball to get it to 21-17 before half. Who knows? I

I could be convinced that certain refs will influence a game more than the NFL writing a script. If they did do this and it became public, they are ruined. They are the biggest cash cow in pro sports right now and would be jeopardizing billions if they were fixing games and it came out

 

[LineSkiCat14]

I think the last sentence you typed hits home the most. The losing side is always going to bitch the most about calls (in any sport). To a certain extent we see what we want to see. We justify the calls that may go our way and we lose our minds when we are on the wrong side of it. We are extremely biased and always have our rose colored glasses on. I can think of several calls that didn't go the Chiefs way from the game. Off the top of my head, the refs missed a face mask, they called a false start on the Chiefs when the Bills guy jumped first and there was another play where the Bills jumped and it was missed. Did the refs do this on purpose or was it just human error, like Dalton missing the catch or Mahomes fumbling.? Did it ultimately effect the outcome of the game? Who knows. Take the Worthy catch/non-catch. Chiefs were up 14-10. Let's say they rule it not a catch. Chiefs still have the ball 1st and 10 because there was defensive holding. They had been driving the ball well all first half. There was only 4 minutes or so left. Maybe they milk the clock more, score and it doesn't leave Allen enough time to drive the ball to get it to 21-17 before half. Who knows? I

I could be convinced that certain refs will influence a game more than the NFL writing a script. If they did do this and it became public, they are ruined. They are the biggest cash cow in pro sports right now and would be jeopardizing billions if they were fixing games and it came out

But it's not like the Texans say this after every game. It only seems to be said in regards to one team and the tape seems to show, that at the very least, the calls seemed to randomly go in KCs favor. I watch Houston Rockets and my Jets play a ton and I really dont see any glaring instances where either team hss gotten some bad calls like what we've been seeing with the Chiefs. So it's not like every time my teams lose I just blame the refs all around.

Have to get the calls right. Do they make a difference? Absolutely. Is it enough to win the game? Hard to say. But that question should never be left up for debate. Get the calls right. Use technology, expand the review capabilities.

 

[bigblueinsanity]

Brady was protected? Part of his career was when it was open season on qbs. Then the nfl tried to frame him for the stupid deflate gate. Thats hardly protected.

Compare that to the flag mahommes got when two defenders hit each other.

 

[Deeeefense]

How did he have the better look when his side couldn’t even see the ball?

Look up the rule for the catch. By no means did Worthy have possession. He had one hand on the side of the ball. Look at the gloves.

I agree on Worthy, saw another replay on X that showed Worthy had one hand on the ground so he could not have had control.

On the Allen run, I'm pretty sure he ran off left guard which would have been on the side the official called short.

 

[HeismaNole]

I agree on Worthy, saw another replay on X that showed Worthy had one hand on the ground so he could not have had control.

On the Allen run, I'm pretty sure he ran off left guard which would have been on the side the official called short.

I think this shows he definitely got it.

I can't imagine this doesn't go Mahomes and the Chiefs way if the roles were reversed.

 

[Deeeefense]

View embedded media

I think this shows he definitely got it.

I can't imagine this doesn't go Mahomes and the Chiefs way if the roles were reversed.

Could be, Gene Saratore said he "looked like" one third of the ball passed the mark but is this evidence enough to over turn the call on the field? IMO no. Do the Chief get more than their share of favorable calls? Seems that way.

 

[HeismaNole]

Could be, Gene Saratore said he "looked like" one third of the ball passed the mark but is this evidence enough to over turn the call on the field? IMO no. Do the Chief get more than their share of favorable calls? Seems that way.

They never even announced a call on the field. That's what was crazy. One guy ruled it first, the other said short. Never even brought chains out. Just straight to the camera and then New York says "Chiefs ball."

Changed the entire game.

 

[Deeeefense]

They never even announced a call on the field. That's what was crazy. One guy ruled it first, the other said short. Never even brought chains out. Just straight to the camera and then New York says "Chiefs ball."

Changed the entire game.

yea I thought that was odd too, I kept asking the TV "what's the call"?