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KHSAA Sweet 16

Roe07

Roe07

All-American
Dec 16, 2007
13,632
9,900
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Bluegrass State
State tournament is set.

13th: Knox Central (30-4)
vs.
8th: Walton-Verona (27-6)

5th: John Hardin (35-0)
vs.
10th: Campbell County (29-4)

3rd: Owensboro (23-7)
vs.
16th: Ashland Blazer (17-16)

7th: Trinity (26-8)
vs.
15th: Johnson Central (27-7)

9th: Covington Catholic (27-7)
vs.
11th: Scott County (32-3)

6th: Butler (25-7)
vs.
14th: Perry County Central (19-12)

12th: Lincoln County (23-12)
vs.
2nd: Madisonville-North Hopkins (29-5)

4th: Warren Central (20-11)
vs.
1st: Mayfield (25-7)

* Covington Catholic v. Scott County is a rematch of last years championship game. I think SC gets this one.

* John Hardin enters the tournament 35-0. Anyone know when the last time a team entered the state tournament undefeated?

* I'm picking John Hardin vs. Scott County in the Championship game. Scott County wins their 3rd State Championship
 
Last edited:
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Roe07 said:
State tournament is pretty much set. 1st and 16th region championship games take place later today. Bracket sets up like this...

13th: Knox Central (30-4)
vs.
8th: Walton-Verona (27-6)

5th: John Hardin (35-0)
vs.
10th: Campbell County (29-4)

3rd: Owensboro (23-7)
vs.
16th: Ashland Blazer/Boyd County

7th: Trinity (26-8)
vs.
15th: Johnson Central (27-7)

9th: Covington Catholic (27-7)
vs.
11th: Scott County (32-3)

6th: Butler (25-7)
vs.
14th: Perry County Central (19-12)

12th: Lincoln County (23-12)
vs.
2nd: Madisonville-North Hopkins (29-5)

4th: Warren Central (20-11)
vs.
1st: McCracken County / Mayfield

* Covington Catholic v. Scott County is a rematch of last years championship game. I think SC gets this one.

* John Hardin enters the tournament 35-0. Anyone know when the last time a team entered the state tournament undefeated?

* I'm picking John Hardin vs. Scott County in the Championship game. Scott County wins their 3rd State Championship
Click to expand...

I think Clay County was undefeated in 1989.
 
Roe07 said:
State tournament is pretty much set. 1st and 16th region championship games take place later today. Bracket sets up like this...

13th: Knox Central (30-4)
vs.
8th: Walton-Verona (27-6)

5th: John Hardin (35-0)
vs.
10th: Campbell County (29-4)

3rd: Owensboro (23-7)
vs.
16th: Ashland Blazer/Boyd County

7th: Trinity (26-8)
vs.
15th: Johnson Central (27-7)

9th: Covington Catholic (27-7)
vs.
11th: Scott County (32-3)

6th: Butler (25-7)
vs.
14th: Perry County Central (19-12)

12th: Lincoln County (23-12)
vs.
2nd: Madisonville-North Hopkins (29-5)

4th: Warren Central (20-11)
vs.
1st: McCracken County / Mayfield

* Covington Catholic v. Scott County is a rematch of last years championship game. I think SC gets this one.

* John Hardin enters the tournament 35-0. Anyone know when the last time a team entered the state tournament undefeated?

* I'm picking John Hardin vs. Scott County in the Championship game. Scott County wins their 3rd State Championship
Click to expand...
Do they still draw region match ups for state tourney or do they re-seed teams? I have been out of touch with sweet 16 for a few years. I still love the purity of one state champ.
 
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Can’t figure out why Henderson doesn’t make more appearances or better showings in the Sweet 16. Demographically it should be the favorite in the 2nd region most of the time, I would think.
 
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TNCatfanforever said:
Do they still draw region match ups for state tourney or do they re-seed teams? I have been out of touch with sweet 16 for a few years. I still love the purity of one state champ.
Click to expand...

Pretty sure they just draw the region matchups randomly. I think it would be better to seed all the teams but what do I know? And yes, the fact that every school plays for 1 state championship is awesome.
 
Roe07 said:
Pretty sure they just draw the region matchups randomly. I think it would be better to seed all the teams but what do I know? And yes, the fact that every school plays for 1 state championship is awesome.
Click to expand...
I think randomly is the only way to do it without arguments of partiality coming in.

If you seed them, you’re seeding based highly on strength of their region which is very subjective even if we know the 5A team is likely better than the 1A team.

You could go strictly based on record but back to the above point, is it fair to place the 4 loss 5A team below the 2 loss 1 A team on a seed line?

Point being, there are so many variables that it would be pretty random regardless. And utilizing a straight eye test (probably the only way to do it semi efficiently) to try to seed 1-16 would lead to a bunch of complaining about favoritism.

So to keep the appearance as fair as possible, having a lottery where you just draw regions and let the cards fall is the only way to do it on such limited Data without weighting regions.
 
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There was an article in the Herald Leader 2 years ago about the tournament format and how Edmonson County winning the state title in 1976 pretty much saved the 1 champion model. KHSAA was concerned that the Lexington and Louisville schools had been dominating the tournament over the previous 10-15 years and thought the rural county schools really had no chance to really ever win it again.

In '76 they wanted to see how the tournament played out and if another big city school won it, they were going to switch it to classes in 1977. Apparently Edmonson County came out of nowhere that year and beat Christian County for the state championship and KHSAA voted to keep the 1 champion format.

I'm only 34 and that was 8 years before I was born, but I gathered from that article that nobody expected EC to win a game in the Sweet 16, much less win the whole thing. I think it's great when the championship game is one of the big Louisville/Lexington area schools against a small school from the mountains. I can't imagine any other state has a format like Kentucky does to determine their state champions.
 
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Roe07 said:
There was an article in the Herald Leader 2 years ago about the tournament format and how Edmonson County winning the state title in 1976 pretty much saved the 1 champion model. KHSAA was concerned that the Lexington and Louisville schools had been dominating the tournament over the previous 10-15 years and thought the rural county schools really had no chance to really ever win it again.

In '76 they wanted to see how the tournament played out and if another big city school won it, they were going to switch it to classes in 1977. Apparently Edmonson County came out of nowhere that year and beat Christian County for the state championship and KHSAA voted to keep the 1 champion format.

I'm only 34 and that was 8 years before I was born, but I gathered from that article that nobody expected EC to win a game in the Sweet 16, much less win the whole thing. I think it's great when the championship game is one of the big Louisville/Lexington area schools against a small school from the mountains. I can't imagine any other state has a format like Kentucky does to determine their state champions.
Click to expand...

I think only Kentucky and Hawaii do not have basketball divided into classes.

Every other sport in Kentucky has classes.
 
Roe07 said:
There was an article in the Herald Leader 2 years ago about the tournament format and how Edmonson County winning the state title in 1976 pretty much saved the 1 champion model. KHSAA was concerned that the Lexington and Louisville schools had been dominating the tournament over the previous 10-15 years and thought the rural county schools really had no chance to really ever win it again.

In '76 they wanted to see how the tournament played out and if another big city school won it, they were going to switch it to classes in 1977. Apparently Edmonson County came out of nowhere that year and beat Christian County for the state championship and KHSAA voted to keep the 1 champion format.

I'm only 34 and that was 8 years before I was born, but I gathered from that article that nobody expected EC to win a game in the Sweet 16, much less win the whole thing. I think it's great when the championship game is one of the big Louisville/Lexington area schools against a small school from the mountains. I can't imagine any other state has a format like Kentucky does to determine their state champions.
Click to expand...
Shelby Valley winning a few years back should keep the pressure for classes off for awhile.
 
Rockford said:
I think only Kentucky and Hawaii do not have basketball divided into classes.

Every other sport in Kentucky has classes.
Click to expand...

Not true. Football is the only major sport in KY that has classes. Basketball, Soccer, Baseball, Softball, and Volleyball all abide by the 1 champion model. I couldn't tell you how track, cross country, tennis, etc determine their champions.
 
Roe07 said:
Not true. Football is the only major sport in KY that has classes. Basketball, Soccer, Baseball, Softball, and Volleyball all abide by the 1 champion model. I couldn't tell you how track, cross country, tennis, etc determine their champions.
Click to expand...


Tennis has 1 champion each for boys singles, boys doubles, girls singles, girls doubles
 
Roe07 said:
Not true. Football is the only major sport in KY that has classes. Basketball, Soccer, Baseball, Softball, and Volleyball all abide by the 1 champion model. I couldn't tell you how track, cross country, tennis, etc determine their champions.
Click to expand...

So you're saying I was close?

I forgot the Class A is not sanctioned by KHSAA
 
Roe07 said:
There was an article in the Herald Leader 2 years ago about the tournament format and how Edmonson County winning the state title in 1976 pretty much saved the 1 champion model. KHSAA was concerned that the Lexington and Louisville schools had been dominating the tournament over the previous 10-15 years and thought the rural county schools really had no chance to really ever win it again.

In '76 they wanted to see how the tournament played out and if another big city school won it, they were going to switch it to classes in 1977. Apparently Edmonson County came out of nowhere that year and beat Christian County for the state championship and KHSAA voted to keep the 1 champion format.

I'm only 34 and that was 8 years before I was born, but I gathered from that article that nobody expected EC to win a game in the Sweet 16, much less win the whole thing. I think it's great when the championship game is one of the big Louisville/Lexington area schools against a small school from the mountains. I can't imagine any other state has a format like Kentucky does to determine their state champions.
Click to expand...
There have been some other close calls over the years. Back in the early / mid 80s, Carlisle County from the 1st Region took Henry Clay to 3OT vs Henry Clay in the Title Game but lost. Back in the late 80s / early 90s Wayne County made to the title game against a big city school but lost.

I really like the one-class format and hope it never changes.
 
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Roe07 said:
There was an article in the Herald Leader 2 years ago about the tournament format and how Edmonson County winning the state title in 1976 pretty much saved the 1 champion model. KHSAA was concerned that the Lexington and Louisville schools had been dominating the tournament over the previous 10-15 years and thought the rural county schools really had no chance to really ever win it again.

In '76 they wanted to see how the tournament played out and if another big city school won it, they were going to switch it to classes in 1977. Apparently Edmonson County came out of nowhere that year and beat Christian County for the state championship and KHSAA voted to keep the 1 champion format.

I'm only 34 and that was 8 years before I was born, but I gathered from that article that nobody expected EC to win a game in the Sweet 16, much less win the whole thing. I think it's great when the championship game is one of the big Louisville/Lexington area schools against a small school from the mountains. I can't imagine any other state has a format like Kentucky does to determine their state champions.
Click to expand...
They were district runner-ups that year,a big strong physical team.One or two of their starters played football for WKU.
 
The tournament is as it should be in most respects.

Ky.high school basketball is unique.A tourney that draws the attention of the whole state.

Television for the games should be mandated by the state government.

(Not some stream that many cannot see or most won't enjoy because of picture quality I.e. lag)
 
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Roe07 said:
Not true. Football is the only major sport in KY that has classes. Basketball, Soccer, Baseball, Softball, and Volleyball all abide by the 1 champion model. I couldn't tell you how track, cross country, tennis, etc determine their champions.
Click to expand...

Track and cross country champions are determined by the class system. 1 A, 2A, and 3A
 
Roe07 said:
State tournament is pretty much set. 1st and 16th region championship games take place later today. Bracket sets up like this...

13th: Knox Central (30-4)
vs.
8th: Walton-Verona (27-6)

5th: John Hardin (35-0)
vs.
10th: Campbell County (29-4)

3rd: Owensboro (23-7)
vs.
16th: Ashland Blazer/Boyd County

7th: Trinity (26-8)
vs.
15th: Johnson Central (27-7)

9th: Covington Catholic (27-7)
vs.
11th: Scott County (32-3)

6th: Butler (25-7)
vs.
14th: Perry County Central (19-12)

12th: Lincoln County (23-12)
vs.
2nd: Madisonville-North Hopkins (29-5)

4th: Warren Central (20-11)
vs.
1st: McCracken County / Mayfield

* Covington Catholic v. Scott County is a rematch of last years championship game. I think SC gets this one.

* John Hardin enters the tournament 35-0. Anyone know when the last time a team entered the state tournament undefeated?

* I'm picking John Hardin vs. Scott County in the Championship game. Scott County wins their 3rd State Championship
Click to expand...
Scott County is being split up after this season. Will be interesting to see where they go from here.
 
Another little school to win the championship was Marion County in 1993. One of only two champions from Region 5
 
Roe07 said:
There was an article in the Herald Leader 2 years ago about the tournament format and how Edmonson County winning the state title in 1976 pretty much saved the 1 champion model. KHSAA was concerned that the Lexington and Louisville schools had been dominating the tournament over the previous 10-15 years and thought the rural county schools really had no chance to really ever win it again.

In '76 they wanted to see how the tournament played out and if another big city school won it, they were going to switch it to classes in 1977. Apparently Edmonson County came out of nowhere that year and beat Christian County for the state championship and KHSAA voted to keep the 1 champion format.

I'm only 34 and that was 8 years before I was born, but I gathered from that article that nobody expected EC to win a game in the Sweet 16, much less win the whole thing. I think it's great when the championship game is one of the big Louisville/Lexington area schools against a small school from the mountains. I can't imagine any other state has a format like Kentucky does to determine their state champions.
Click to expand...
Roe, who was the woman from the Board of Education that wanted to change to a class system back in the '80's or '90's? I've been away from about 35 years now but recall my sister telling me that she got booed out of Rupp when they introduced her during one of the state tournament games.
 
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Looking back through the record books since the 76 title, the “small and Non-Lexington/Louisville/Big NKY” (granted - consolidation in the counties has really changed the game since then) schools have held their own.

2017 - Bowling Green champ (3rd largest city now though, I’d include them close to Lex/Lou at this point)
2015 - Owensboro (see above)
2011 - Christian County
2010 - Shelby Valley
2008, 2003 - Mason County
2005 - South Laurel
2000 - Elizabethtown
1996 - Paintsville
1993 - Marion County
1992 - UHA (I debated whether they belonged on this list because some people want to split the private schools)
1987 - Clay County
1986 - Pulaski County
1985 - Hoptown
1984 - Logan County
1982 - Laurel County


Actually a pretty solid performance. Since 2000, Louisville and Lexington area (Madison Central, Scott County) schools have won 8 of the 19 titles. About what you’d expect given they have about 40% of the state’s population.
The area that’s really under performed has been Western Kentucky. Owensboro’s 2015 title and Logan County in 1984 are their only titles since Edmonson County.
 
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Roe07 said:
There was an article in the Herald Leader 2 years ago about the tournament format and how Edmonson County winning the state title in 1976 pretty much saved the 1 champion model. KHSAA was concerned that the Lexington and Louisville schools had been dominating the tournament over the previous 10-15 years and thought the rural county schools really had no chance to really ever win it again.

In '76 they wanted to see how the tournament played out and if another big city school won it, they were going to switch it to classes in 1977. Apparently Edmonson County came out of nowhere that year and beat Christian County for the state championship and KHSAA voted to keep the 1 champion format.

I'm only 34 and that was 8 years before I was born, but I gathered from that article that nobody expected EC to win a game in the Sweet 16, much less win the whole thing. I think it's great when the championship game is one of the big Louisville/Lexington area schools against a small school from the mountains. I can't imagine any other state has a format like Kentucky does to determine their state champions.
Click to expand...
I was at that game they were fun to watch.
 
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State tournament hasn’t been kind to undefeated teams.

A Fifth Region team hasn't won the Sweet 16 since eventual Kentucky guard Antwain Barbour lead Elizabethtown to the 2000 title.

Brewers (1948) was the last unbeaten boys Sweet 16 champ, while Henderson (1948) and Ashland (1928) also accomplished the feat. - CJ
 
ukalum1988 said:
There have been some other close calls over the years. Back in the early / mid 80s, Carlisle County from the 1st Region took Henry Clay to 3OT vs Henry Clay in the Title Game but lost. Back in the late 80s / early 90s Wayne County made to the title game against a big city school but lost.

I really like the one-class format and hope it never changes.
Click to expand...

PRP beat Wayne Co. in '89

Love the random draw for this tournament. Eliminates any human biases factoring in. Wish the NCAA Tournament would do that in some form
 
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STL_Cat said:
Can’t figure out why Henderson doesn’t make more appearances or better showings in the Sweet 16. Demographically it should be the favorite in the 2nd region most of the time, I would think.
Click to expand...

The second region is a tough region to come out of with traditional powers like Christian County, Hopkinsville, Madisonville and Henderson County. Those are all big schools with a lot of tradition, then you have University Heights that is always tough. Henderson has had it's share of second region championships. They are the largest school in the second region and 5th largest in the state, based on that you would think they would be regional champs more than they have been though.
 
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Lincoln Co. has a freshman pg (Jaxon Smith) worth watching. Son of friends of mine. Used to play a lot of ball with his dad.
 
Aike said:
Lincoln Co. has a freshman pg (Jaxon Smith) worth watching. Son of friends of mine. Used to play a lot of ball with his dad.
Click to expand...

I didn’t realize he’s a freshman.

That Lincoln vs. Wayne game was something else.
 
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Roe07 said:
State tournament is pretty much set. 1st and 16th region championship games take place later today. Bracket sets up like this...

13th: Knox Central (30-4)
vs.
8th: Walton-Verona (27-6)

5th: John Hardin (35-0)
vs.
10th: Campbell County (29-4)

3rd: Owensboro (23-7)
vs.
16th: Ashland Blazer/Boyd County

7th: Trinity (26-8)
vs.
15th: Johnson Central (27-7)

9th: Covington Catholic (27-7)
vs.
11th: Scott County (32-3)

6th: Butler (25-7)
vs.
14th: Perry County Central (19-12)

12th: Lincoln County (23-12)
vs.
2nd: Madisonville-North Hopkins (29-5)

4th: Warren Central (20-11)
vs.
1st: McCracken County / Mayfield

* Covington Catholic v. Scott County is a rematch of last years championship game. I think SC gets this one.

* John Hardin enters the tournament 35-0. Anyone know when the last time a team entered the state tournament undefeated?

* I'm picking John Hardin vs. Scott County in the Championship game. Scott County wins their 3rd State Championship
Click to expand...
Thanks for that. My dad started pulling me out of school every year from 4th grade on so he, a friend of his, and I could go. It was always played in Freedom Hall at that time, the late 69’s through ‘75. Some great memories and games. Do they still play the final four early Saturday, and the title game that evening? That’s tough playing two very meaningful games in one day.
 
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warrior_SW said:
Looking back through the record books since the 76 title, the “small and Non-Lexington/Louisville/Big NKY” (granted - consolidation in the counties has really changed the game since then) schools have held their own.

2017 - Bowling Green champ (3rd largest city now though, I’d include them close to Lex/Lou at this point)
2015 - Owensboro (see above)
2011 - Christian County
2010 - Shelby Valley
2008, 2003 - Mason County
2005 - South Laurel
2000 - Elizabethtown
1996 - Paintsville
1993 - Marion County
1992 - UHA (I debated whether they belonged on this list because some people want to split the private schools)
1987 - Clay County
1986 - Pulaski County
1985 - Hoptown
1984 - Logan County
1982 - Laurel County


Actually a pretty solid performance. Since 2000, Louisville and Lexington area (Madison Central, Scott County) schools have won 8 of the 19 titles. About what you’d expect given they have about 40% of the state’s population.
The area that’s really under performed has been Western Kentucky. Owensboro’s 2015 title and Logan County in 1984 are their only titles since Edmonson County.
Click to expand...


Christian County, Hopkinsville and UHA are all farther West than Owensboro man. So that’s 5 champions in that time not 2
 
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