How many “cylinder “ fouls did South Carolina commit?
If Mitchell’s was a “cylinder “ foul
- Thread starter yoshukai
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If that was a cylinder foul then there is 4 of those on every possession.
2nd game in a row with very bad officiating. This one wouldn't have mattered though, we couldn't score if all you had to do was bounce the ball off the floor.
I have saw dozens and maybe hundreds of guys get elbowed in the face over the years and last night was the first time I have ever saw a ref call it on the guy who got elbowed because his hand was on the guys hip. What is to keep a guy from throwing an elbow into the defenders face every time they hand check them? Also, how can who the foul is called on be changed in that instance? It can't be changed in any other instance that I am aware of.
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Also first time I have ever heard a tv announser use that term. Did the refs hear him?!?
First of all 90% of our problems is because our defense is putrid currently. That's the biggest issue. Cal said in his post game presser we have to learn handle physical play and protect ourselves somehow. So that got me to thinking about a couple different situations.
Around the time of the collapse of our defense in the Georgia game Big Z takes a shot to his ribs running down the court. No call. He goes for a rebound. The elbow he threw could be argued. Probably the right call.
Last night Mitchell's cylinder foul.
My question is this: Georgia and SC were allowed to be extremely physical with us with minimum fouls called. So when we decided to by physical back we weren't giving the same leash. Why is our physical play frowned upon but Georgia and SC rewarded? What's the difference?
Around the time of the collapse of our defense in the Georgia game Big Z takes a shot to his ribs running down the court. No call. He goes for a rebound. The elbow he threw could be argued. Probably the right call.
Last night Mitchell's cylinder foul.
My question is this: Georgia and SC were allowed to be extremely physical with us with minimum fouls called. So when we decided to by physical back we weren't giving the same leash. Why is our physical play frowned upon but Georgia and SC rewarded? What's the difference?
Roles reversed and the UK player gets thrown out for a flagrant 2. That sh*t was intentional to create space. Hand on hip or not, it was deliberate and FLAGRANT. Stupid rule IMO.
I think a lot of it is the officials get caught up in the atmosphere in the arena.
South Carolina was hacking and slapping dribblers like crazy and their first foul was called with 11 minutes to go in the first half. They were definitely letting them be physical and our guys didn't respond well to it. They like to play finesse basketball and not be roughed up.
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Total garbage call - and you could tell it was being screamed into the announcer's earpiece because he wouldn't shut up about it. Decision was made before the officials even looked at it.
Thing is - that call NEVER gets made. Can anyone remember a "cylinder foul" being called in any SEC game like ever?
Thing is - that call NEVER gets made. Can anyone remember a "cylinder foul" being called in any SEC game like ever?
I had never heard of it and didn't even know it existed. I sure have never saw them switch who a foul is called on.
Easy. We are Kentucky. They’ve hated us for years.
I remember a potential cylinder call earlier with Oscar. Oscar hit the guy with elbow and they reviewed and refused to call a cylinder foul I believe. Oscar got a flagrant.
I have never seen ANY foul called on one guy and the swithced to the other by review or otherwise. And I thought the elbow to the face thing was mandatory once called. Cylinder or not, the call made on the court was due to an elbow to the face of the defender. Reviewed and it was like it never happened. Just toughen up kid.
Let me ask this: would Kansas or Duke get that call reversed? Any blueblood for that matter? Home or away?
Dane Bradshaw and the other dude sure were pushing it, never mind the elbow to the face.
Rule 4, Section 39, Article 1c. The space that a player may legally occupy is defined by an imaginary cylinder surrounding the player and which extends from the floor to as far above the player as he can jump or extend his arms and body. The diameter of the cylinder shall not extend beyond the hands/arms on the front (the arms bent at the elbow), the buttocks on the back and the legs on the sides. These dimensions may vary according to the height and size of the player.
Rule 4, Section 39, Article 1k. The offensive player must be allowed enough space to make a normal basketball play. The defense may not invade the vertical space of the offense and make illegal contact when the offensive player is attempting a normal basketball play. A normal basketball play in this context includes shooting, passing, dribbling or pivoting.
So according to this rule if a defender is closer than bent arms length they are in the cylinder and it's a foul on the defender? Sounds like a lot of fouls aren't getting called then because I see defenders bodying offensive guys on every play.
Rule 4, Section 39, Article 1k. The offensive player must be allowed enough space to make a normal basketball play. The defense may not invade the vertical space of the offense and make illegal contact when the offensive player is attempting a normal basketball play. A normal basketball play in this context includes shooting, passing, dribbling or pivoting.
So according to this rule if a defender is closer than bent arms length they are in the cylinder and it's a foul on the defender? Sounds like a lot of fouls aren't getting called then because I see defenders bodying offensive guys on every play.
Typical FN BS call on Uk that other teams don’t get held to same standard. I’m so tired of the Bias…Sickening!!!
I must still do way lots of drugs because Id never heard of that called until last night.. Swear they make up shit just for UK..
Your exactly right n only UK gets called for those BS type plays..
That was unfortunately the technically correct call as the rule is currently written. The cylinder rule isn’t meant to say that it’s an automatic foul every time a defender comes into the cylinder, but comes into effect when the offensive player makes contact in the head area. After we had a rash of incidents where defenders were basically sticking their face in on the ball and then flopping on contact trying to steal points late in close games, it’s meant to discourage defensive players from trying to purposely draw flagrant fouls by getting in the offensive player’s space as they’re moving. That really wasn’t what Mitchell was doing last night, so he got the short end of the stick, but the rule was correctly enforced.
I get why the rule was made but Mitchell's face and body was in the cylinder when he swung his elbow. According to Dane Bradshaw it was because any part of his body (his hand) was in the cylinder.
So basically, you only get called for that foul if you get elbowed in the mouth, lol .
Because we have better players and it's the only way to make the game competitive. Refs absolutely, whether consciously or subconsciously, make calls with that on consideration.
The call didn't surprise me because it took over half of the first half to call a foul on them. And I saw plenty of fouls from the get go that weren't called. Seems games are called differently. Some are called tighter and some there has to be blood or a knockdown to get a call.
Unfortunately, the vols are one of the most physical teams as is auburn. Our guys better find some toughness. Need Adou badly in my opinion.
Unfortunately, the vols are one of the most physical teams as is auburn. Our guys better find some toughness. Need Adou badly in my opinion.
Accurate. Dude was basically French kissing Oscar he was so close. Oscar tried to clear and gets him. Review, flagrant on O. Bullshit last night.
Teams will continue to foul at an alarming rate, as they know we can’t play through it. It’s been a primary philosophy with Cal coached teams here because
1. We are young
2. We are rarely physical at all
3. Refs can’t call them all
4. Cal can’t do anything about it
5. When we try to respond with similar play, coaches know we will be hammered with fouls
You joke, but basically yes, the rule is meant to take most of the judgement call out of situations where that kind of contact occurs.
For those of you saying this never gets called against anyone else of significance, it was easy to find an article with Roy Williams complaining after a UNC player got teeth knocked out by an elbow in a tournament game, and this rule was invoked. I’m not sure it’s a perfect solution as currently written, but that call wasn’t some kind of invented on the spot conspiracy.
So it was called once...almost 5 years ago? 😂
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I don't get why officials feel the need to even things up. Just because you are taller getting boxed out and just reach straight up (not over a guy) that isn't a foul. It's not fair just because you are smaller/and not as athletic you get to foul more to even things up. Now if you game plan and you win that way so be it. But you shouldn't be allowed to hack someone all night just because it evens things out.
They can review the monitor to make sure a foul is assessed to the right player if there is some confusion, but to completely overturn an on the court call like that is and should be wrong.
It is what it is. No sense crying over it now. I don't agree with it because it doesn't get called consistently. Doesn't matter. We gotta play and win. I don't see worrying about it helping. Adjust to how the refs are calling the game is all I can say.
Yes that is the only time you will ever see it called
I've never seen it called but it would benefit us if it was called...consistently.
I am surprised that so many people are saying that they never heard of this rule. I know there was a time several years ago when it was being enforced and called fairly often. Having said that, I haven't seen it called in a long while.
Article from 2016 on enforcing this rule:
College hoops players must mind the 'cylinder' this season
Defenders that invade offensive players' start of basketball plays will be called for fouls
www.cincinnati.com
But the defender only commits a foul when he takes an elbow to the face, apparently.
I knew there was a "cylinder" but didn't know that A) if your hand was in the cylinder and a guy swung an elbow and hit you in the face it was a foul on you for having a hand in the cylinder and B) that they could go to the monitor and switch who they called a foul on the floor on.
Yeah apparently you can be in the cylinder as long as he doesn't elbow you in the face.
Except at Rupp, but I think it’s because Cal is on them all the time
