Sorry, but a team of mostly Mid-Major and bottom-tier p5 guys who've never played together, coached by a guy that has never won anything, and playing in possibly the toughest conference doesn't make me want to purchase a Final Four ticket.
Growing pains
- Thread starter FurdTerguson
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Considering all that you stated, our chances are higher with Pope than with Cal. Cal has been trending down for years, but it didn't stop fans from thinking every new season was the one when a has-been coach was going to turn things around.
We not only have a very good head coach, but we also have a coach who has surrounded himself with very capable assistant coaches. Pope basically achieved what Cal did at BYU with half the talent and much higher requirements to get into the university.
That's why I love this board. Every once in a while someone comes up with the perfect way to describe something.
Cal needed to go, there's no doubt about that. I think that if Pope makes the Sweet 16 next year, then that's a hell of a job in year one.
That's the big key. How long will it take. Probably not long with all the expirence. Might be a bump or two early in the season.
Worst case - It's a completely new roster comprised of some solid mid (although I consider SDSU and Dayton to be better than most P5 programs) and low major transfers, some role players from mid-tier P5 schools and a couple of high school guys who may be a year away from contributing. The only one familiar with Pope's system is Robinson. How long will it take them to gel, and will they all understand their roles? Maybe as important as anything, how will the majority of these guys adjust to life in the fishbowl that is UK basketball. Cal said UK isn't for everyone and Tony Delk once said in his Catpaw yearbook interview that the best thing about being at UK was the fans, and the worst thing about being at UK was the fans. Cal and Delk were both right. Can these guys adjust to that and adjust to the game after game upgrade in competition and athleticism of the SEC? If not, it could be a tough season. One that might result in no post season.
Best case - We have a roster comprised of mostly older, more physically and (hopefully) mentally/emotionally mature players who are hard workers, hungry and will play for each other and the coach who believed in them enough to give them the opportunity to play for the most storied program in college basketball. THAT team will win 20+ games and be a tough out in the NCAAT.
What will the actual result be? Probably something between those two things, and I'll be happy with it as long as we play hard.
Best case - We have a roster comprised of mostly older, more physically and (hopefully) mentally/emotionally mature players who are hard workers, hungry and will play for each other and the coach who believed in them enough to give them the opportunity to play for the most storied program in college basketball. THAT team will win 20+ games and be a tough out in the NCAAT.
What will the actual result be? Probably something between those two things, and I'll be happy with it as long as we play hard.
I believe that it will come together pretty fast, for a couple of reasons. One we will have a lot of experiences seniors. And the second thing is the fact we've got a coach from the Rick Pitino coaching tree that actually knows how to coach a half court offense & is willing to change from a man to man defense to a zone to stop the other team from getting straight line drives to the basket all game long.
Exactly. It will be interesting to see how it plays out because this is an unprecedented and fascinating situation.
Valid fear. I think it will happen. New staff, a new team full of guys who've never played with each other. A new coach trying to implement an offensive system new to everyone but one guy.
Some want to move the goalposts and set aside their expectations they called for Cal to follow. Because Pope played here 30 years ago and loves UK/the fans.
All that is great, but it's still win or get out.
These are grown men, six fifth year Seniors, a fourth year Senior, a Junior, a Sophomore, and a 21 year old Freshmen for our top 10.
They should adjust much more quickly than a team trying to incorporate several Freshmen into key roles.
They should adjust much more quickly than a team trying to incorporate several Freshmen into key roles.
My biggest concern with Pope is that not many coaches have succeeded at their alma maters. Hubert Davis and Scheyer are doing ok I guess.
This is a good point and is more than likely going to be the case. We are losing 7 this year, if everyone comes back.
A few players, particularly if some are contributors, full recruiting seasons, and a staff in place with their legs under them with connections in place is probably way less like starting over than actually starting all over than it may appear to fans.
One thing that is surely to make some difference is having several top assistants to help move things along faster. And also the time and effort Pope puts in makes me feel like he is a tireless worker that will get it right as quick as possible.
I have no idea how or when it will gel together. I just hope the fanbase gives it the time it might need.
Pope will actually discipline the players if they try that stuff. whether its running until they puke or sitting etc. we no longer have the worst disciplinarian let the players get away with selfish play coach
Looking at the roster and considering the changes in staff I expect this UK team to be similar to Mike Woodson's first IU team from 2021-22. The IU roster was likely a bit more talented with TJ-D returning to go along with transfers Xavier Johnson and Miller Koop. Race Thompson also added inside strength but otherwise everyone else was JAG. D1 mid-major talent or overrated freshmen. I could never figure who was going to do what from game to game other than TJD. Ten players averaged ten or more minutes.
However the result was not bad. 21-14, middle of conference finish and first four NCAA bid. The tough part was as the season progressed it was clear that (other than in the rivalry Purdue game) the team did not have enough stars to battle teams with top 25 talent. Result was 5 straight losses (4 to ranked teams) as part of 1-7 finish to end the regular season. Even with TJD when IU fell behind they did not have the NBA or almost-NBA level talent to make a huge run to come back from double digits down. That could also be an issue with UK this year.
Cal's final several teams had a knack for losing at the end, but with the NBA talent they seemed to never be out of a game. How many down 20 games did they close to get back into it in five amazing minutes (only to usually lose)? This roster cannot do that against the top talent like KU, Duke, UT, and others will put on the floor.
I am not predicting a 1-7 finish (unless the SEC back loads the schedule) but a 6th place SEC finish and possibly a slightly nervous selection Sunday can be expected with an 8-10 seed. From there you never know. But going long in the Big Dance without multiple NBA level players (or one 7-4 great college guy like Edey) happens rarely.
Just my thoughts.
However the result was not bad. 21-14, middle of conference finish and first four NCAA bid. The tough part was as the season progressed it was clear that (other than in the rivalry Purdue game) the team did not have enough stars to battle teams with top 25 talent. Result was 5 straight losses (4 to ranked teams) as part of 1-7 finish to end the regular season. Even with TJD when IU fell behind they did not have the NBA or almost-NBA level talent to make a huge run to come back from double digits down. That could also be an issue with UK this year.
Cal's final several teams had a knack for losing at the end, but with the NBA talent they seemed to never be out of a game. How many down 20 games did they close to get back into it in five amazing minutes (only to usually lose)? This roster cannot do that against the top talent like KU, Duke, UT, and others will put on the floor.
I am not predicting a 1-7 finish (unless the SEC back loads the schedule) but a 6th place SEC finish and possibly a slightly nervous selection Sunday can be expected with an 8-10 seed. From there you never know. But going long in the Big Dance without multiple NBA level players (or one 7-4 great college guy like Edey) happens rarely.
Just my thoughts.
So you think we'll end the regular season roughly ranked 32-40? That's ridiculous.
Did I say that? Quite twisting things around. The person said we'd be an 8-10 seed in the tournament and I said that was ridiculous. I don't have a floor or a ceiling because nothing is guaranteed, but I see a 3-5 seed as very reasonable at this point.
Just my opinion. But you see UK top 12 with no NBA caliber players on the roster while likely going thru one of the toughest schedules in the country? Maybe I am underestimating the roster but I do not see an NBA level guy on the team and neither do 2025 mock drafts.
And don't think I am a Cal apologist. I was against Cal from day 1 the way he left Memphis bare was a bad omen of things to come at UK. But UK fans now expect to see great high levels players that just needed coaching that Cal did not provide. This team may have better coaching but not yet the players. It takes both. Give it a couple of years.
Happy to see it’s no longer winning games on paper with a ballyhooed freshmen class ultimately destined to fail.
Hopefully there’s a real alpha or two on the roster who are serious about winning basketball games.
Hopefully there’s a real alpha or two on the roster who are serious about winning basketball games.
This is why I feel like although people killed Cal for creating that whole one and done nature, you cannot go from one extreme to another here.
Obviously Pope came in a bit late to have a serious recruiting class this season. But going forward, he'll have to grab his fair share of top guys (and hit on the right ones obviously). FWIW even Pope realizes this and he's saying all the right things here. But saying and actually being able to do are two entirely different things.
It's really just a wait and see here with all this. At least from my perspective.
I could easily see us 3-5 seed.
I could also easily see us outside the top 25 and being like 6-8 seed range.
It just depends. There's talent on this team. Lots of these transfers are really good players. It's just how long does it take all of them to gel together.
I could also easily see us outside the top 25 and being like 6-8 seed range.
It just depends. There's talent on this team. Lots of these transfers are really good players. It's just how long does it take all of them to gel together.
I'm giving him two games and then I'll be all over his ass if we're not good. You'll just have to wait and see if I'm being serious. Hopefully it will be a moot point. Or mute point, whichever your preference...
Pope said they are trying to implement a pro style system and recruits are very receptive to that. He also said it is a system that is different than most in college basketball and that helps. Sounds as if we are on the right track to be entertaining, recruit great players and then reap the rewards of building it this way.
Utilizing talent to maximize each player is a new concept around UK.
It will work wonders and Pope will demonstrate what real "coaching" is all about.
such a concept has been missing for far too long at UK.
rr
It will work wonders and Pope will demonstrate what real "coaching" is all about.
such a concept has been missing for far too long at UK.
rr
On this board is you’re not convinced Pope is the greatest head coach ever then apparently you’re a hater and a miserable person.
Some of us are actually talking a wait and see approach. Personally, I hope he succeeds but I feel like it’s far from guaranteed.
I don't see anything wrong with being positive about Pope. Everybody has a choice of being positive, negative or just not say anything. Negative surely does not help anything. And fans that are excited for the program getting back to the way it should be run is a good thing. Fans moral is important to this program.
Gonna be interesting. We're about to learn the difference between a team loaded with NBA level talent but short on experience vs. a team loaded with experience but lacking NBA level talent.
The good news is that doesn't we lack talent, just we fans have to learn the days of having 3-5 guys getting drafted off a single team are probably over. Welcome back to the real world. But after 2-3 years to complete the massive roster turnover, we might get back to someday watching a kid develop from skinny freshman project into at least a strong Junior before he jumps to the NBA.
As for this season, we have 9 guys that should be playing balls to the wall all season. In college, what's that worth?
I'm going with another 4th place finish in the SEC, a 2nd place in the SEC Tourney (to 'Bama), a 4 seed, and an unexpected Elite Eight run for the Cats. Like Pitino's Cats, we're a tough out by the EOY.
The good news is that doesn't we lack talent, just we fans have to learn the days of having 3-5 guys getting drafted off a single team are probably over. Welcome back to the real world. But after 2-3 years to complete the massive roster turnover, we might get back to someday watching a kid develop from skinny freshman project into at least a strong Junior before he jumps to the NBA.
As for this season, we have 9 guys that should be playing balls to the wall all season. In college, what's that worth?
I'm going with another 4th place finish in the SEC, a 2nd place in the SEC Tourney (to 'Bama), a 4 seed, and an unexpected Elite Eight run for the Cats. Like Pitino's Cats, we're a tough out by the EOY.
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