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Court Storming debate revisited

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preacherfan

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Oct 11, 2003
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Over the years, we have had a number of debates about court storming. Due to a recent injury, the debate is back in the news:

"The most severe court storming injury of all came in Feb. 2004 when an avalanche of Tucson High students spilled onto the court after 6-foot-6 senior Joe Kay clinched a rivalry victory with a two-handed breakaway dunk. The torn carotid artery and stroke Kay suffered that day left him paralyzed on one side and robbed him of many of the gifts that enabled him to become the valedictorian of his class, win awards for his saxophone skills and earn a volleyball scholarship to Stanford."

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaab...s-annual-court-storming-debate-173254881.html
 
I use to like them along time ago because it seemed like they only happened when a miracle happened or a true Goliath was knocked off. Now we have people storming after beating #19. It will take a death before they are outlawed, imo.
 
It's dangerous , there's just no need for it . People love every chance to be destructive , most titles in sports are accompanied by turning cars over or starting fires , fights and I think people use it as an opportunity to act out with limited chance of repercussions .
 
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I don't like them because Coach Clappy loves them. (Of course there will probably never be a time when the court is stormed because a team knocks off a Clappy IU team).
 
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Hoskins91 said:
Let'em do it. What a dumb thing to argue about. Who cares?
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Joe Kay and his family care , how many need to be injured for it to matter . What if your kid got paralyzed for winning a basketball game ? That's the rest of his life for a game while those who stormed the court go about their lives in normal fashion .
 
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Xception said:
Joe Kay and his family care , how many need to be injured for it to matter . What if your kid got paralyzed for winning a basketball game ? That's the rest of his life for a game while those who stormed the court go about their lives in normal fashion .
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How many have been? Sucks for the kid, but it was a freak occurrence. Certainly not enough to warrant ruining it for everybody else.
 
Supafuzz75 said:
I'd say the ones that are for it and don't care if they do it,, wouldn't care at all if a family member or friend was seriously injured or killed.. I mean,, it was all in good fun they were injured or killed..
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I tend to agree with this.

When a member of the media gets his leg broke due to it, I have an issue with that. Those guys/gals have a job to do, and these idiots put them at risk when they do it.
 
They are very played out. In the past few years we've seen teams like UNC and IU storm the courts, blue bloods storming the court is just lame. It was something when a mid major got a top team at home, but now beating unranked teams warrants court storming.

In this day and age I just don't trust people storming the court.
 
Either security was doing a good job at our loss to UCLA or the crowd felt indifferent about it. That was one of the most half-assed court storming I've ever seen.
 
LetsHang#9 said:
Either security was doing a good job at our loss to UCLA or the crowd felt indifferent about it. That was one of the most half-assed court storming I've ever seen.
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They shouldn't storm the court. It is freakin UCLA. Idc if they are so 1960s-70s in terms of bigtime national title winning relevance, they are still a blue blood.
 
Supafuzz75 said:
I'd say the ones that are for it and don't care if they do it,, wouldn't care at all if a family member or friend was seriously injured or killed.. I mean,, it was all in good fun they were injured or killed..
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That is taking it too far. Being pro court storming says nothing about your empathy towards people who have or will get injured.

People do things all the time, purely for fun, that leads to injuries. Court storming just happens to be one of those things. I think there should be less court stormings in college, but not because of the injury factor, but rather because now a days people court storm for any ole victory.
 
WSU/UKfan said:
That is taking it too far. Being pro court storming says nothing about your empathy towards people who have or will get injured.

People do things all the time, purely for fun, that leads to injuries. Court storming just happens to be one of those things. I think there should be less court stormings in college, but not because of the injury factor, but rather because now a days people court storm for any ole victory.
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Okay, let's run with that line of thinking....What other "fun" activities can we compare this to? Elderly, handicapped and children are definitely in harm's way with a court storming. Some of the kids doing the storming lack ANY basic common sense and can easily cause serious injury.

What do we compare it to? What is "purely for fun that leads to injuries" that is comparable?
 
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UK doesn't storm the court for any reason in basketball. Other teams storm courts when they beat UK. UK storms the field in football when we accomplish a rare feat(I was there & did after the South Carolina game in 2010). Bama doesn't storm the field in football but others do when they beat them.
 
Any student who storms the court should be suspended for an entire calendar year, prosecuted, and fined a base rate + more to cover any medical expenses and/or damages incurred. Any non-student who does it should be prosecuted and fined significantly a base rate + more to cover and medical expenses and/or damages incurred. Can't pay the fine? Community service at the federal minimum wage rate until you "pay off" the fine.
 
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preacherfan said:
Over the years, we have had a number of debates about court storming. Due to a recent injury, the debate is back in the news:

"The most severe court storming injury of all came in Feb. 2004 when an avalanche of Tucson High students spilled onto the court after 6-foot-6 senior Joe Kay clinched a rivalry victory with a two-handed breakaway dunk. The torn carotid artery and stroke Kay suffered that day left him paralyzed on one side and robbed him of many of the gifts that enabled him to become the valedictorian of his class, win awards for his saxophone skills and earn a volleyball scholarship to Stanford."

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaab...s-annual-court-storming-debate-173254881.html
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That's a really tragic story, but at the same time, there are tons of recreational or even semi-useful items, activities, and behaviors that have a relatively low risk of serious injury which would not make sense to ban.. aside from the fact that they're already technically banned at every event I know of. But just speaking in theory.
 
preacherfan said:
Okay, let's run with that line of thinking....What other "fun" activities can we compare this to? Elderly, handicapped and children are definitely in harm's way with a court storming. Some of the kids doing the storming lack ANY basic common sense and can easily cause serious injury.

What do we compare it to? What is "purely for fun that leads to injuries" that is comparable?
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It's a pretty regular thing for people to take small risks for the sake of enjoyment. We let our kids play sports or go to a playground, despite the fact that there is risk of injury. We go swimming, despite the risk of drowning or shark attacks (depending on where you live). We smoke cigarettes and drink, despite the risks associated with that. We do it because often times what you enjoy can potentially hurt you. Court storming is one of those potentially dangerous things that people continue to want to do because the very small risk is worth it for the payoff of tradition and enjoyment.
 
WSU/UKfan said:
It's a pretty regular thing for people to take small risks for the sake of enjoyment. We let our kids play sports or go to a playground, despite the fact that there is risk of injury. We go swimming, despite the risk of drowning or shark attacks (depending on where you live). We smoke cigarettes and drink, despite the risks associated with that. We do it because often times what you enjoy can potentially hurt you. Court storming is one of those potentially dangerous things that people continue to want to do because the very small risk is worth it for the payoff of tradition and enjoyment.
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Sending your kid to the playground does not put the safety of anyone else in risk unless your child is a sadist or the parents elected to make him into a suicide bomber.

Swimming doesn't unwillingly put the safety of others at risk. Even the lifeguards willingly have signed up to put their life and safety on the line to save someone from drowning. I frankly don't know who is responsible for saving someone from a shark attack, but whoever has that job has willingly elected to sign on to a job where putting their life and safety on the line is part of the job duties.

A large group (relative to the size of the court) of people stampeding the court with no regard for the welfare of other people or property puts other people and property directly in risk of harm despite not wanting to participate in the court storming. No where in the "job" description of players, coaches, or any other game-day personnel (other than security) or fan behavior rules/laws does it state you have to be willing to put your personal welfare on the line just to work or attend the game.

Alas, you bring up drinking. When you do something while under the influence of alcohol that harms others or has the potential to harm others that have not willingly agreed to put their welfare at risk, like drinking and driving, there are legal consequences to be had. What are the consequences when some moron harms someone at a court storming? Nothing, basically.

Smoking, kind of hard to prove someone smoking a cigarette is directly harming another person since the effects aren't witnessed until years down the road, and after that long a period of time, it's impossible to prove that one time around a cigarette smoker was the direct reason for the cancer.
 
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Accidents happen. If you're swimming with a group of friends, playing a sport with others, or even on the playground with someone else, you are at a small risk of being injured whethe it's your fault or the fault of the people around you. It happens. Sometimes when you engage with others, your personal welfare is on the line. It's not something you sign up for, it's just life.

Your description of court storming is not accurate. A large group of people stampeding without regard to the welfare of others is a description of Black Friday shopping, not court storming. If your description was true, why aren't there more injuries?
 
Um
WSU/UKfan said:
That is taking it too far. Being pro court storming says nothing about your empathy towards people who have or will get injured.

People do things all the time, purely for fun, that leads to injuries. Court storming just happens to be one of those things. I think there should be less court stormings in college, but not because of the injury factor, but rather because now a days people court storm for any ole victory.
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Um,, no.. I still stick 100% behind what I said.. The ones saying it's ok have never had anyone close to them get hurt.. So long as it's not any of their family or friends,, who cares.. It's just fun and games and fans enjoying a victory.. :)
 
There are inherent risks with almost any activity but more often than not the risks are known and agreed to . Like there being a risk of drowning when swimming , that's a very real possibility and everybody who swims knows what could happen . A basketball player getting paralyzed by a rushing crowd is not agreed to , there are risks of injury through playing that every player accepts but they also didn't sign up for a mosh pit either . You don't play a game to get injured afterwards by moronic idiots . Court rushers should be arrested , that would curb the act .
 
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Guys/girls who rush the court or field seem to be ones who have never been invited to a party and are now trying to make up for it in a passive aggressive way.
 
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Hoskins91 said:
Let'em do it. What a dumb thing to argue about. Who cares?
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Who cares? The people who are supposed to be on the floor who get injured by idiots running in a herd. Storming the court is ridiculous and does nothing positive, but has plenty of room to cause harm. Identify all you can. If they go to the school, give them a mild sanction with the "do it again and you'll really be punished" speech. If they aren't students, give them a decent fine with the same warning.
 
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WSU/UKfan said:
It's a pretty regular thing for people to take small risks for the sake of enjoyment. We let our kids play sports or go to a playground, despite the fact that there is risk of injury. We go swimming, despite the risk of drowning or shark attacks (depending on where you live). We smoke cigarettes and drink, despite the risks associated with that. We do it because often times what you enjoy can potentially hurt you. Court storming is one of those potentially dangerous things that people continue to want to do because the very small risk is worth it for the payoff of tradition and enjoyment.
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Okay, but you missed one vital point. In all of your examples, we take the risk of hurting ourselves. In court storming, it is the innocent player or by-stander who often gets hurt.

I even thought about going to baseball games and car races, but even in those cases, we are assuming risks for ourselves because we know flying parts and baseballs are going to happen. I'm not sure the guy in the wheelchair or the guy who takes his young children is assuming that he is risking injury by people stampeding to the floor.
 
I have a pretty simple stance on this.

Players stay on the field of play.

Fans stay in the stands.

Hosting university is responsible for enforcing 1 and 2.

Fine for failure to enforce is $1000 per individual. Minimum $100K fine.


End of problem.
 
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WSU/UKfan said:
Accidents happen. If you're swimming with a group of friends, playing a sport with others, or even on the playground with someone else, you are at a small risk of being injured whethe it's your fault or the fault of the people around you. It happens. Sometimes when you engage with others, your personal welfare is on the line. It's not something you sign up for, it's just life.

Your description of court storming is not accurate. A large group of people stampeding without regard to the welfare of others is a description of Black Friday shopping, not court storming. If your description was true, why aren't there more injuries?
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I have been in arenas and gyms that had court stormings. I agree that 98% of the ones doing it are actually doing it safely. But, in every single one, there are a few idiots who push people out of the way. The article above talked about several incidents that should never have happened but they did.
 
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preacherfan said:
Okay, but you missed one vital point. In all of your examples, we take the risk of hurting ourselves. In court storming, it is the innocent player or by-stander who often gets hurt.

I even thought about going to baseball games and car races, but even in those cases, we are assuming risks for ourselves because we know flying parts and baseballs are going to happen. I'm not sure the guy in the wheelchair or the guy who takes his young children is assuming that he is risking injury by people stampeding to the floor.
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As a fan, you willingly take a very minor risk by going to a game where there is likely to be court storming. Court storming is not a new or secret phenomenon so if you're a school like Virginia Tech playing at home against Duke or a Northwestern playing at home against Mich St., as a fan you are assuming the risk of being in the middle of a court storm if your team wins the same way you are assuming a risk in your baseball and car race analogies because you know what could possibly happen. Now again, that risk is minor. You speak of the kind of people who usually get hurt but it's worth noting that nobody usually gets hurt.

When it comes down to the players, the arena just needs to make sure security is good. We've seen schools where the security has done a great job of blocking off the players from the students. It would even be fair to say that we need to make sure all players are off of the court before security allows people to storm. There are measures to take to make it safer without eliminating the practice all together. And given that it is a relatively safe practice anyway (court storming is obviously not as bad as it looks; if it were, there would be more injuries), it shouldn't be too hard to make minor adjustments to make it even safer.
 
I wouldn't have any desire to storm the court and get myself entangled in that mob, just stay in your seat, not much of anything more dangerous than a mob. I was at one game when the court was stormed and they just overwhelmed the security no way to hold them back, about all you can do is start taking names and fine them or prohibit them from attending a event for a period of time.
 
kybassfan said:
I have a pretty simple stance on this.

Players stay on the field of play.

Fans stay in the stands.

Hosting university is responsible for enforcing 1 and 2.

Fine for failure to enforce is $1000 per individual. Minimum $100K fine.


End of problem.
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How is that the end of the problem? I agree that the school should face penalties f they haven't taken strong enough action, but they can't stop it on their own short of making the place look like a police state. In fact, I think that jst entices the juvenile mind to try harder. Punish the actual violators, or as many as possible. If their actions don't have unpleasant consequences, they have little incentive to stop the behavior. Schools and venues could face incredible liability for not doing everything possible to prevent court storming.
 
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