Any thoughts on next commit(s)?
- Thread starter gamecockcat
- Start date
Man, how do you know? All it takes one time. One game. It could be this year. You don’t know!
No, our football “program” will never be Bama or GA. So what? You think Mark Stoops gives a shit. He’s made quite a career beating teams with way more 5*s than he’s got.
People pull up these stats on Twitter, showing jist how awesome Mark Stoops is…In the last 5 years, we are the third best SEC team behind Bama and GA. That is unbelievable.
AND WE’RE STILL JUST GETTING STARTED BRO. Our talent gets better every single year. We just got a QB and offense last year. Give Mark 5 years with an NFL style offense and NFL type talent, good lord we’re bound to beat GA once!
He's just stating it's more than just beating UGA once in a blue moon. The program won't catch elite SEC teams until we take another jump in recruiting over multiple years. To be honest, has UK really even jumped Tennessee in terms of SEC east pecking order or Florida? Sure we've beaten them twice in Stoops tenure, but we've lost a ton more than we've won in all honesty.
This year's recruiting is just simply a step back and it's in all likelihood a NIL step back combined with losing Clinksdale/Sumrall and other key assistants. We need to get Mitch past this NIL mindset and get Buffano/Collins/Stoops brother/Woodward/Yenser/Scangerallo, etc..better at getting us in on recruiting. it's not the end of the world, but we can't drop down to beating some "meh" bottom P5 teams for all of our kids...and that is what this class will boil down to.
By any objective measure or analysis Knoxville and Florida have much more talented rosters than UK in 2022. And did in previous yrs as well. The wins we have gotten over them & finishing in front of them in the division is due to our consistency and their turmoil.
It is why it is so depressing we are not building on our 2022 top 14 recruiting class. but instead taking a giant step back with a class that might get into the late 30s nationally. And that is only if we pull in several 4*s.
Dan Mullin beat Georgia & won the SEC East. He was fired a year later, because his recruiting was taking Florida farther away from Georgia, not closer. They hired a guy who's only goal is to recruit a roster to compete with Georgia & Alabama. And we all know what our Knoxville friends are doing with NIL.
Adapt, or die. Standing still is going backwards.
I’m an optimist but don’t think it’s realistic to expect as much improvement from years 10-15 as you get in years 1-5 or even 5-10. There’s kind of naturally a diminishing return of improvement as time goes on with a staff. After so many years, it’s your program. There will be deviations up and down, but in Stoops tenth year I think I know about what to expect.
Agree but let's not overlook Stoops' track record of development, which, to my eyes, seems much better than recent UT's higher-ranked roster. And, Mullin certainly didn't seem to bring out the best of his talented roster his last few years. Landing talented HS players is very important, no doubt. Putting them in the best position to succeed, improving their bodies and technique and getting the most out of every player has been accomplished more consistently under Stoops than at UT and UF in the past several years, imo.
Of course, I'd like a few more 4*, very high 3* kids to come on board and, if recent history is any indication, I wouldn't sell the staff short. I think we'll still end up around 30 or better, which is not a huge step back as the difference between #30 and #17 is pretty small most years. Sometimes, it can come down to a school landing 2 highly recruited QBs. which, as everyone knows, one won't be there in 3 years. With the explosion of NIL, it's anyone's guess if any of this year's commits will stick it out more than their first year. It appears to me that teams will have to recruit both HS seniors and their current roster (or at least the key components of the roster) every year in order to avoid mass transfers.
A month ago, yours was a common view. I didn't see things that way, but a lot of people did. Then Avery Stuart and Anthony Brown came aboard. Now, Grant Godfrey.
If all one does is read Rivals class rankings, I could see how the observer could be lured into thinking it is a disappointing class.
I think it just rankles some UK fans that UL's class "outranks" ours so far. This leads to hyperbole. But when you consider that UK beats the snot out of UL on the football field every year, that should ground one's thinking about such things.
Let's stipulate that Stuart, Godfrey, Brown, and Porter are strong commitments. No one in their right mind will dispute that. Then, the question becomes, are any of our so-called "three stars" underrated? I would submit that Austin Ramsey, Koby Keenum, and Malachi Wood are quality football players with the bodies and aggressive mindsets needed to become outstanding linemen. As a rule of thumb, all young offensive linemen are projects. It is good to remember that Bunchy Stallings and Logan Stenberg became All Americans at UK after being lightly recruited coming out of hs.
In coming to terms with UK's recruitments of Wood, Kaden Moorman, Khalifa Keith, Jakob Dixon, Tommy Ziesmer, and Ty Bryant, we should remember that UK's coaches offered them after close observation at UK camps in Lexington. This is the same way Eli Cox, Kenneth Horsey, and Luke Fortner were discovered and signed.
So at the end of the day, one has to decide whether one trusts online player rankings or evaluations by UK's coaching staff. Judging by Stallings, Fortner, Cox, Benny Snell, Chris Rodriguez, and Josh Allen, all having been lightly recruited, I see a lot of reasons to trust UK's coaches. They have won four straight bowl games. FWIW.
Mullen should not have left Miss St. Florida is trying to keep up with Bama and now UGA. It's not an easy game to play. High risk. Now he's going to be an analyst for a year.
He probably pops up around December for another gig. Likely on par with Miss St, who renewed the Pirate with a worse record than they fired Moorhead for.
Anyone who has taken a close look at the actual talent and abilities of the players we have committed knows this class is no where near a GIANT step back.
Sure it is....
I've heard this "our kids are under the radar types" for decades by UK fans in terms of recruits. I heard what a steal Allen Dailey was out of Alabama, how Nic Scalzo was a gamer and only rated low due to height, Abdule Fitzgerald was amazing potential, etc...I could do this for pages. Sure Stoops/Marrow can identify good players and UK does a really good job of player development in most positions...so we can point to Josh Allen, Benny Snell, Eli Cox looks to be way better than rated as well. But in the end, 90% of the time our best players are our highest rated players as recruits. Wandale, Bowden, Kinnard, McCall, Paschal, Corker, Landon Young, Drake Jackson, Lonnie Johnson, etc... This isn't rocket science.
- We are whiffing left and right on the DL and edge pass rush kids in this class. Tommy Zeismer, IMO, aint going to cut it. That is a massive step back from guys like Wade Twin.
- I have no idea why need 2 power RB in this class....Khalifa Keith and Kadeen Moorman are the same mold. But I'll give UK this much...we do a great job with low rated RB like Benny and CRod...so maybe these guys fit the mold of how we want to run the ball. But after 2 all time RB at UK....I'd hope we beat out more than Cincy, Ga Tech and a bunch of C-USA schools for RB in 2022.
- We'll see how the DBs pan out in this class. We need a bunch for sure. Avery Stuart is a step in the right direction. But Ty Bryant and Nassir Addison....we whiffed on a bunch of kids before taking back on Addison is what I saw.
I'll give UK a year to adjust to NIL...and I'm sure we'll be portal player for sure at QB and as this NIL plays out...I'm sure kids will get a huge dose of reality and UK can be second chance U for many talented kids. But we need to step it up in NIL or we'll fall back to Music City/Belk Bown type program IMO.
K,
I hear ya but, as history reflects, judging what type a player will be based on HS achievements is a crapshoot. Admittedly, as you said, our best players have generally been more highly-rated in HS. But, the cycle isn't over and we're still in on some potential difference makers. If we don't land any of them, we may have to rely on the portal to fill in roster gaps next year. While I don't love the strategy, other schools have done OK relying on transfers to keep a bowl-eligible team from backsliding.
NIL is a game-changer for everyone. UK seems to have been a laggard in jumping on board but, with just a couple of higher rated kids we're in the top 5 for committing, we'll end up around 30 in rankings, which, for a HUGE step back, isn't catastrophic.
I, too, am disappointed thus far that we've missed on a couple of kids I thought, in previous years, we would've landed. But, it's not over and Stoops has done well in the transfer portal and that may be the MO going forward until we fully embrace NIL.
I hear ya but, as history reflects, judging what type a player will be based on HS achievements is a crapshoot. Admittedly, as you said, our best players have generally been more highly-rated in HS. But, the cycle isn't over and we're still in on some potential difference makers. If we don't land any of them, we may have to rely on the portal to fill in roster gaps next year. While I don't love the strategy, other schools have done OK relying on transfers to keep a bowl-eligible team from backsliding.
NIL is a game-changer for everyone. UK seems to have been a laggard in jumping on board but, with just a couple of higher rated kids we're in the top 5 for committing, we'll end up around 30 in rankings, which, for a HUGE step back, isn't catastrophic.
I, too, am disappointed thus far that we've missed on a couple of kids I thought, in previous years, we would've landed. But, it's not over and Stoops has done well in the transfer portal and that may be the MO going forward until we fully embrace NIL.
To each their own
Seems hypocritical to 7 months ago celebrate and brag at signing a top 14 national HS class....to now retreat back to the old "i trust our coaches evaluations over Rivals & 24/7!! Our 3 star commits are underrated, ought to be 4 stars!!".
7-5 arguements, dudes. Not gonna apologize if my expectations have been raised and y'alls haven't. This program has shown they can get top 20 classes. I find backsliding recruiting after a 10 win yr & a top 20 ranked team in the 2022 polls quite frustrating.
Maybe it is just an NIL & Barnhart's handcuffs thing, maybe it is losing top level recruiters and replacing them with inexperienced ones. The results need to be figured out and improved, period. 10th in the SEC isn't gonna cut it, 38th in the nation isn't gonna cut it, not with 9 SEC games soon a reality.
Seems hypocritical to 7 months ago celebrate and brag at signing a top 14 national HS class....to now retreat back to the old "i trust our coaches evaluations over Rivals & 24/7!! Our 3 star commits are underrated, ought to be 4 stars!!".
7-5 arguements, dudes. Not gonna apologize if my expectations have been raised and y'alls haven't. This program has shown they can get top 20 classes. I find backsliding recruiting after a 10 win yr & a top 20 ranked team in the 2022 polls quite frustrating.
Maybe it is just an NIL & Barnhart's handcuffs thing, maybe it is losing top level recruiters and replacing them with inexperienced ones. The results need to be figured out and improved, period. 10th in the SEC isn't gonna cut it, 38th in the nation isn't gonna cut it, not with 9 SEC games soon a reality.
Stoops came on KSR and made the pronouncement that UK is now supporting booster efforts to raise NIL funds and they are now allowed to broach the subject with recruits, which Barnhardt had forbidden before. They are going so far as to offer inducements like aTm and UT, but it is clear that they are now able to dangle the carrot and are cooperating with the booster's efforts.
I've read that it isn't likely a committable offer, at this point, but if some other prospects don't bite then he's a take.
When did he say this.? Recently?
A few weeks on KSR it was anything but this commentary from Stoops own mouth.
So don't think Zeismer will cut it, yet UK turned away at least two 4 star in state guys and chose him. Sorry but that tells me they think he is who they want. He isn't tall but had greta length. Avery was a project but has great size, he wasn't as good as the guys last year. Who is that would have been the answer there? Burns? Who the experts have ranked below him and main offer was UC where he went. Who is they should have went after
If you're talking about Micah Carter and Harkless....
- Harkless is a DT/NG...so totally different position. And I'm not sure I get his high rating to be honest.
- If the other is Carter...UK offered from what I can tell. But he goes Purdue's way.
My main comment is this....Does Ziesmer really dominate the LOS in Ky high school football in central Ky? I just don't see it.
Everything I have heard is he dominates in HS. They also said he was dominant in the camps he went to I was talking about Carter, UK quit recruiting him months prior to him going to Purdue, and they also quit recruiting Clements at DE that also went to Purdue. Clements may be a 3 star. Everything I have heard is the coaches love Zeismer
Idk what position Zeismer will play but some believe he will be an OLB instead of a SDE
I love that....I'll get out and see Zeismer. I know Carter is a load in Louisville but maybe i'm wrong. I just didn't hear he was a dominate Ky high school player. let's see how he does his Sr year.
Carter was hurt and sit out last year. Is supposedly healthy, but UK backed off and most assumed that is why
I hear ya KTime, but you didnt see the words "under the radar" at all in my post. I ask you again, go look at the kids we committed right now YOURSELF and analyze them and then come back and tell me what you think of them . . . thats what the coaches have done and what I did and they like them and I do too.
I understand the star system but stars arent even fully cooked yet and its way to early to early for your panicky description of this class.
I'm not saying they are on pace with last year at all but I'm saying the term "GIANT SETBACK" is a gross overreaction. Simple as that.
I hear you Soupbean and your perspective is very sound.
Honestly, I can't look at most of the kids committed and analyze them....nor did I in years past. I'm not a recruiting expert at all and can't see them at UK summer camps. I do have the insights into some of the Ky kids....but in the end, star ratings and especially "other offers" is a very strong gauge of how good a class will be in college. And this class simply is a step back today...and we are whiffing left and right on the DL trenches and rush Lbers spots.
I can see both sides of the argument ,, The Kids we are getting fill a need and are a bit better then what they are ranked but to take the next step our classes have to get exponentially better ! It is Stoops fault ,,, he made us Hungry to win when before we didn't think it was possible
This may be a popular point of view. I do not think it is accurate. I do not even think it is valid reasoning. I am sure Mike Stoops has more recruiting experience than any coach Kentucky has lost, and Mike fills a void in Florida that needs filling. Collins, Woodward, and Yenser are already having recruiting successes. I do not see any significance to assessments of the recruiting class in August. Kentucky just got another big commitment yesterday. I think we get Kirkland and Spencer. When December comes, let's look at the class then. It could be a nice class and I think it will be.
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