"It's Not Your Money, So Who Cares...."

[FltDoc]

Just wanted to kick this around... Can't remember who posted this but find myself coming back to this interesting concept...

All of us fans want to "win", and we're all probably pretty competitive in our personal and (past) athletic lives... WE WANT TO WIN..

And enjoy watching our Bball's and Football CATS win... hell, even the Rifle Squad, Soccer, Tennis, Track & Field, and Cheer Team until they got reorganized.

Many of our Football and Bball complaints are surrounded around how much money our two coaches make & their now level of "averageness" (mediocrity)...

But, as someone posted.. who cares... Its not our money. It's the University's and sponsors' money. So why do we get so wrapped up in the $$ aspect?

On some level it just doesn't feel right, but I can't put my finger on it.

Someone convince me otherwise.

Go CATS!

p.s. I am a UK alum, family from KY, and currently with a daughter attending Centre, but living out-of-State.

 

[K_TIME]

Just wanted to kick this around... Can't remember who posted this but find myself coming back to this interesting concept...

All of us fans want to "win", and we're all probably pretty competitive in our personal and (past) athletic lives... WE WANT TO WIN..

And enjoy watching our Bball's and Football CATS win... hell, even the Rifle Squad, Soccer, Tennis, Track & Field, and Cheer Team until they got reorganized.

Many of our Football and Bball complaints are surrounded around how much money our two coaches make & their now level of "averageness" (mediocrity)...

But, as someone posted.. who cares... Its not our money. It's the University's and sponsors' money. So why do we get so wrapped up in the $$ aspect?

On some level it just doesn't feel right, but I can't put my finger on it.

Someone convince me otherwise.

Go CATS!

p.s. I am a UK alum, family from KY, and currently with a daughter attending Centre, but living out-of-State.

Now that Stoops is paid nicely, he can pay his best assistants (Marrow, Coen, etc...) top dollar...same with Calipari. He can go out and pay to get Orlando, Chin,....now Welch, etc... So if Cal made $4M vs. $9M....it doesn't really matter to me..and same with Stoops.

My only beef with how Mitch does his absurd contracts....is the university gets in a bind with not just the amount per year but also the way too many years they are for and the length of these contracts ties the program in a bind that we can't move away from a coach due to insane buyouts. I'd prefer 4-5 year deals and not 10+ year deals. The coaches have essentially vast majority of leverage.

 

[cat_in_the_hat]

The bottom line is some fans like to complain, or have a dislike for certain coaches or administrative employees. When UK didn't pay top dollar for football coaches, the criticism was always we could have a top football program if we would pay better. Now that we pay better, the criticism is we pay too much for what we are getting. Unless everything works out perfectly, someone is going to complain about it. Most of the people who complain have never managed anything beyond their checkbook and don't realize that almost any decision a manager makes can be criticized after the fact. They also don't realize that when their preferences are never tested in the real world, they can never be proven wrong about what the coach or the AD should have done. People wanting Stoops replaced, for example, would criticize the AD for the replacement hire if the program slipped. They would never consider the possibility that actually getting rid of Stoops was the mistake.

The bottom line is we pay what we have to pay to get quality coaches. I think Mitch is too quick to give out long term contracts, but I don't manage the athletic department so I'm not really qualified to judge those contracts. In any event, I'm not at all concerned with the money. I'm more concerned that we have enough flexibility to move out of the those contracts if we need to. I think that aspect could have been managed better, but we really don't know the specifics of the situation enough to say for sure.

 

[FltDoc]

I think Mitch is too quick to give out long term contracts, but I don't manage the athletic department so I'm not really qualified to judge those contracts. In any event, I'm not at all concerned with the money. I'm more concerned that we have enough flexibility to move out of the those contracts if we need to. I think that aspect could have been managed better, but we really don't know the specifics of the situation enough to say for sure.

 

[Nuke99m]

The bottom line is some fans like to complain or have a dislike for certain coaches or administrative employees. When UK didn't pay top dollar for football coaches, the criticism was always we could have a top football program if we would pay better. Now that we pay better, the criticism is we pay too much for what we are getting. Unless everything works out perfectly, someone is going to complain about it.

It seems to be a group of about 15-20 posters who spout the same thing over and over. Same on the basketball board. You can just look at who started the posts. I usually just ignore and never open those posts.

 

[Dddjdd]

I think for me it’s about willingness to spend. We’re willing to pay him a top salary and we get mediocre results for it. So hypothetically if he left that top salary could attract a better coach.

 

[RDF922]

FitDoc

I posted in another thread about this

It’s not our money and the athletic department basically prints money so who cares how much our coaches make?

And at least in Cal and Stoops case most of their payment comes NOT from the University.

Get on them about their performance, but no reason to admonish them for what they earn.

I’ve got a friend who HATES that coaches have buyouts but that’s a story for another day!

 

[FltDoc]

I think for me it’s about willingness to spend. We’re willing to pay him a top salary and we get mediocre results for it. So hypothetically if he left that top salary could attract a better coach.

Am trending this way more and more....it's what all the great teams do... keep swinging until they hit a home run.

 

[cathouse]

Most of the posts I have read by UK fans, the complaint is not about the amount of money the coaches are making.

The complaint is about the # of wins, competitiveness of our teams against the other top programs/coaches who make close to the same or lessor salaries and have their teams consistently playing at a championship level.

Keep our programs at or near the top and competitive against other top programs, just winning our share head to head, and you will hear nothing about the salaries of coaches from UK fans.

 

[FltDoc]

FitDoc

I posted in another thread about this

It’s not our money and the athletic department basically prints money so who cares how much our coaches make?

And at least in Cal and Stoops case most of their payment comes NOT from the University.

Get on them about their performance, but no reason to admonish them for what they earn.

I’ve got a friend who HATES that coaches have buyouts but that’s a story for another day!

I agree with ya'.... can't hate them for the salary, as it doesn't appear to be passed along to the students (ala UK one of the few Universities where the sports program is self-sufficient,... and gives back to the University)

Its becoming clear to me that the $$ support is there (NIL not-withstanding), so are we gonna' be content with what we have, or expect more...

 

[Tskware]

Other than possibly Kirby Smart and Jim Harbaugh, I think all the money paid to these top coaches is obscene and a reflection of how off kilter the priority of sports has become in our society.

That being said, UK is paying Stoops along the lines of a number of other peer universities, so I can't say that we are way out of line.

 

[jeffky]

Just wanted to kick this around... Can't remember who posted this but find myself coming back to this interesting concept...

All of us fans want to "win", and we're all probably pretty competitive in our personal and (past) athletic lives... WE WANT TO WIN..

And enjoy watching our Bball's and Football CATS win... hell, even the Rifle Squad, Soccer, Tennis, Track & Field, and Cheer Team until they got reorganized.

Many of our Football and Bball complaints are surrounded around how much money our two coaches make & their now level of "averageness" (mediocrity)...

But, as someone posted.. who cares... Its not our money. It's the University's and sponsors' money. So why do we get so wrapped up in the $$ aspect?

On some level it just doesn't feel right, but I can't put my finger on it.

Someone convince me otherwise.

Go CATS!

p.s. I am a UK alum, family from KY, and currently with a daughter attending Centre, but living out-of-State.

Wrong the state pays these college institutions so yes people should care our tax dollars pay these institutions including college athletics salaries

 

[JHB4UK]

Wrong the state pays these college institutions so yes people should care our tax dollars pay these institutions including college athletics salaries

Jezus H Christ

Who wants to tell him?

 

[WildcatforLife1965]

I don’t care what any coach is paid in any sport. Our fans are no different than fans of any other school. They wanna win. They want to be in the conversation. The fact that salaries are public knowledge just adds fuel to the fire for some. I understand completely why we can’t compete for the top spot in football. It’s talent. Pure and simple. You bring Kirby Smart to Kentucky we would still finish 7-5, 8-4, 6-6. Will we ever reach the top? I have no idea. I’m a 45 year football and basketball fan. I’ve seen the highs and lows of both sports.

 

[MrHotDice]

If you have kids wanting to go to UK, then it is your money. Asked anyone before 2000 and you could then go to UK and work your way through school. Now that is a distant memory

 

[Mulder14]

Jezus H Christ

Who wants to tell him?

You can

 

[Deeeefense]

The bottom line is some fans like to complain, or have a dislike for certain coaches or administrative employees. When UK didn't pay top dollar for football coaches, the criticism was always we could have a top football program if we would pay better. Now that we pay better, the criticism is we pay too much for what we are getting

During the course of a season I've seen people worried that team X would try to pouch Stoops and a few weeks later the same people wanting Stoops fired. go figure.

 

[Grumpyolddawg]

Other than possibly Kirby Smart and Jim Harbaugh, I think all the money paid to these top coaches is obscene and a reflection of how off kilter the priority of sports has become in our society.

That being said, UK is paying Stoops along the lines of a number of other peer universities, so I can't say that we are way out of line.

Kirby is my coach, I can't think of anyone else I would rather have leading the program, but I think he alone with every other coach at a big program are overpaid. But if UGA isn't paying him top dollar, and very likely more if it had to. Someone else would.

 

[satcheluk]

Just wanted to kick this around... Can't remember who posted this but find myself coming back to this interesting concept...

All of us fans want to "win", and we're all probably pretty competitive in our personal and (past) athletic lives... WE WANT TO WIN..

And enjoy watching our Bball's and Football CATS win... hell, even the Rifle Squad, Soccer, Tennis, Track & Field, and Cheer Team until they got reorganized.

Many of our Football and Bball complaints are surrounded around how much money our two coaches make & their now level of "averageness" (mediocrity)...

But, as someone posted.. who cares... Its not our money. It's the University's and sponsors' money. So why do we get so wrapped up in the $$ aspect?

On some level it just doesn't feel right, but I can't put my finger on it.

Someone convince me otherwise.

Go CATS!

p.s. I am a UK alum, family from KY, and currently with a daughter attending Centre, but living out-of-State.

I would love to hear the political philosophies of anyone complaining because this is a free market. You pay what the market requires to hire and maintain a good staff. We pay what would be expected. As an historically mid program competing in the toughest league, we have to pay a bit more to entice a competent staff just like any corporation would.

The money aspect is just a convenient issue to hang on the program when fans are disappointed. IMO we are not paying enough for an SEC Championship, especially when you consider NIL. Last couple of seasons have been slightly below expectations, but overall I'd say Stoops & Co have performed over their salaries, but they need to adjust to the new landscape of NIL and I'm afraid Mitch isn't showing enough leadership to support those efforts, so the recruiting staff are having to overcome unnecessary hurdles.

 

[sefus12]

I think for me it’s about willingness to spend. We’re willing to pay him a top salary and we get mediocre results for it. So hypothetically if he left that top salary could attract a better coach.

This is where I think some people are missing the point on Stoops’ salary:

1) His salary was built up over time as he continued to win at a place that coaches have traditionally had an incredibly hard time winning. It’s not like he was given his current salary in year 1.

2) Part of the reason Stoops is paid so well is that UK is, whether we like it or not, not a top-tier college coaching destination. We have limited in-state talent and NIL money, both of which hinder the type of talent that the program attracts. So a school like UK probably has to overpay for results compared to a place like Georgia or Bama, which have more talent and resources available to them. To put it in other terms, UK has to pay $10MM for $7MM results (simplifying, of course) because coaches know it will be much harder to win at UK in the SEC.

Not saying Stoops is the best we can do, but you’re taking a gamble if we fire him. If top-tier coaches are turning down the AM and Bama gigs, UK isn’t going to lure them to Lexington, so you’re hoping that someone up-and-coming will be able to outdo what Stoops has done. I don’t know if Stoops can get 10 wins again (I certainly don’t think it’s impossible like some on here seem to think it is), but I also really don’t want to go back to 3 or 4-win seasons again either.

 

[Rockfly78]

No one is ever overpaid. If someone is willing to pay a person a certain amount of money then they are getting exactly what they deserve based on supply and demand. No one overpaid.

Oh, and its not my money and I don't care. But I get why people bitch about the salaries when the team loses. People often times equate money to success....or intelligence, or talent, or looks, etc. It also could be that some folks just aren't sure who actually does pay these salaries (it's not us). The whole thing is similar to entitlement towards politicians. "we voted for you, you work for us" mentality. But these coaches owe us nothing really.

 

[gobigblue812]

The university pays for some of Stoops contract. I'm not sure what the breakdown is. Maybe someone can find it and post it.

 

[Tskware]

Oh, and its not my money and I don't care. But I get why people bitch about the salaries when the team loses. People often times equate money to success....or intelligence, or talent, or looks, etc. It also could be that some folks just aren't sure who actually does pay these salaries (it's not us). The whole thing is similar to entitlement towards politicians. "we voted for you, you work for us" mentality. But these coaches owe us nothing really.

Well, if the coaches owe us nothing really . . . then what do we owe them? I don't agree with that take at all.

To me, the question is easier for politicians, although we voted for them, sometimes they should take positions unpopular with their constituents, because the position is the best for the country, or state, or city, which is really their job.

 

[optimus-blue]

Mitch is failure to embrace NIL, will be the reason he retires early before he wants to. He will not be fired, but he’ll be forced out in my opinion it’s put UK behind eight ball for a lot of different reasons.

 

[IrishPokerDog]

The university pays for some of Stoops contract. I'm not sure what the breakdown is. Maybe someone can find it and post it.

The last I remember, the state pays for about $400,000 of his salary - rest comes
from k-Fund/IMG $$$$

 

[JHB4UK]

The last I remember, the state pays for about $400,000 of his salary - rest comes
from k-Fund/IMG $$$$

Yup....and almost all of that "rest" comes from the SEC TV deal, paid by ESPN. ESPN gets the cash from cable/satellite subscriptions, and commercial advertisements.

Which proves the whole point of this tread.....his salary ain't y'alls money. Mark Stoops getting a paycut to $6M/yr wouldn't result in a refund of $3M to fans who buy tickets.

Your ticket money pays the small base salary. Your K fund donations pay the salaries of field hockey & soccer & softball.

 

[Tskware]

The last I remember, the state pays for about $400,000 of his salary - rest comes
from k-Fund/IMG $$$$

Fans like me pay into K Fund

 

[Rockfly78]

Well, if the coaches owe us nothing really . . . then what do we owe them? I don't agree with that take at all.

To me, the question is easier for politicians, although we voted for them, sometimes they should take positions unpopular with their constituents, because the position is the best for the country, or state, or city, which is really their job.

We owe them nothing as well. This is a business. The coaches can say the right things and go on about doing it "for the fans" but they are really doing it for their careers and reputations. Many of them may do it for the adoration of the fans because it feels good to be adored. The fans go to the games because they choose to. If the team performs well, then more people will choose to go to the games. Perhaps the atmosphere aids in victory as it often does. Everyone is happy. But the fans are not beholden to these coaches and players. Simply put, they are entertainers. They're sole job is to play a game to entertain the fans so that hopefully we spend our money on the product in one way or another. It's a business, it's the entertainment business. But in the eyes of the fans it's easy to romanticize.

fair point about politicians.

 

[Tskware]

Yup....and almost all of that "rest" comes from the SEC TV deal, paid by ESPN. ESPN gets the cash from cable/satellite subscriptions, and commercial advertisements.

Let me try to expand on my previous post about K Fund. If your point is that coaches compensation does not come SOLELY from direct purchases by fans in the form of tickets and K Fund, then I agree with you.

But at the end of the day, OF COURSE fans pay for Stoops and other coaches compensation. There is no printing press at ESPN churning out 100 dollar bills. From where do you think ESPN gets all that revenue to pay the SEC contract? From fans like us who pony up hundreds of dollars a month for cable TV and internet subscriptions, pay extra for B10 and SEC network, and buy the products the advertisers hawk constantly on ball game broadcasts. Without us buying all those cable packages and other products, there would be no ESPN, et al, to pay coaches.

It is the same in pro sports, the Reds don't have a money tree planted in the bullpen, from which they can harvest cash to pay all those relievers who can't get me out when the games are on the line (sorry, call me a cynical and hopeless Reds fan). They get it from ticket sales, concessions, local cable like Bally Sports, and the typical cable packages for which we fans pay, that is how they stay in business. Tesla and Microsoft aren't funding CFB or MLB, we are.

Consider the opposite. Why do Div III coaches make so little? Because there is no ticket revenue, no K Fund, no cable package. Nobody would pay 10 cents to watch Centre play Hanover on TV. Thus, they make very little, i.e., whatever Centre/Hanover choose to pay.

Having said all the above, that is just capitalism, Grumpyolddawg and I both think ALL coaches are way overpaid, compared to the impact on society . . . but that is what the market commands, thus that is what they get paid.

But they definitely get paid by us fans, one way or the other, so it absolutely is our money.

 

[FirewithFire]

Because they don't deserve it, that's why.

The old complaint about UK football was that the admin wasn't willing to pay anyone to come here. Now we have the ninth highest paid coach in the country, along with one of the highest paid staff, and we are barely in the middle of the SEC. So either money wasn't the problem or Stoops is not the solution.

None to pleased about paying Cal a crap ton to turn UK into his own NBA farm team/ personal legacy either. He has also severely underperformed during his time here.

 

[JHB4UK]

Now we have the ninth highest paid coach in the country, along with one of the highest paid staff, and we are barely in the middle of the SEC.

Where were we before?

Where have we been most of the last 60, 70 yrs?

Because they don't deserve it, that's why.

He's literally winning est coach in school history

Perfect response why this thread is needed. It isn't your money! You don't have any right to declare anyone not deserving of their paycheck! Unless you own your own business, or are a CEO, or an AD!

Stoops making $10M a yr doesn't make your life worst! Or him getting paycut to $1M/yr makes your life better? Are you frustrated by your own financial situations that it angers you to see someone earn life-changing money?

 

[jeffky]

The university pays for some of Stoops contract. I'm not sure what the breakdown is. Maybe someone can find it and post it.

Thank you awesome post that university you are referring too is a state ran institution and our tax dollars are used to support this institution back when Adolph Rupp did not want to retire he was 70 and all state government employees which included Rupp was forced into retirement so yes your dollars and mine dollars pay these coaches salaries 20 million a year is a lot and what are we getting in return for it

 

[JHB4UK]

Tax dollars don't fund the UK athletic dept. UK athletics pays for itself- and then transfers money it earned to help pay general University expenses. Including most recently a $65M science building in 2015-16.

UK sports and Mark Stoops are REDUCING the tax burden of the citizens of the Commonwealth of Kentucky by paying for stuff taxpayers would otherwise have to foot the bill for.

tell me when I'm tellin lies....

 

[3632]

I don’t care what we spend but I do care how we spend it. If stoops deserved 9m okay, otherwise let’s take 1.5 to 2m of that and use it toward program things that will help the structure of the program regardless of who is coaching which makes it a more attractive job for new hires when it comes. If they had given him a 500k raise and extension last time instead of 2m they could’ve used the other to increase the recruiting budget to be 2nd only behind uga and ahead of UT…or whatever program enhancements outside of the head coach pocket book we can use.

 

[jeffky]

Tax dollars don't fund the UK athletic dept. UK athletics pays for itself- and then transfers money it earned to help pay general University expenses. Including most recently a $65M science building in 2015-16.

UK sports and Mark Stoops are REDUCING the tax burden of the citizens of the Commonwealth of Kentucky by paying for stuff taxpayers would otherwise have to foot the bill for.

tell me when I'm tellin

280 million a year from our tax dollars fund Kentucky lol there would not even be a athletic department if it was not for this funding so yes we do pay these coaches

 

[FirewithFire]

Where were we before?

Where have we been most of the last 60, 70 yrs?

He's literally winning est coach in school history

Perfect response why this thread is needed. It isn't your money! You don't have any right to declare anyone not deserving of their paycheck! Unless you own your own business, or are a CEO, or an AD!

Stoops making $10M a yr doesn't make your life worst! Or him getting paycut to $1M/yr makes your life better? Are you frustrated by your own financial situations that it angers you to see someone earn life-changing money?

Enough with your white knight shit. It is my opinion on whether they are deserving or not and if you don't like it tough shit. I am so sick of you Stoops nut huggers.

Where are we now? Near the bottom of the SEC as always. We paid someone nine million, before bonuses, to finish below USCjr and Florida. Both of whom pay their coaches significantly less. idgaf whose money it is, that is just bad decision making.

And beating your chest about being the winningest coach at Kentucky isn't a great idea. It wasn't exactly a high bar to reach.

 

[UKWildcats1987]

Where were we before?

Where have we been most of the last 60, 70 yrs?

He's literally winning est coach in school history

Perfect response why this thread is needed. It isn't your money! You don't have any right to declare anyone not deserving of their paycheck! Unless you own your own business, or are a CEO, or an AD!

Stoops making $10M a yr doesn't make your life worst! Or him getting paycut to $1M/yr makes your life better? Are you frustrated by your own financial situations that it angers you to see someone earn life-changing money?

He also has the most losses in UK history. Longevity usually results in both but we only ever hear about the winning part.

On the thread, idc about their salaries. I want them to win at the levels expected of them. Overall, Stoops has done that but if he stays til 2030 don't see another 9 or perhaps even 8 win regular season n new sec and NIL era. As for cal I've already said on bball board we won't win the SEC or sec tourney or make another final four or win 9th title until he's gone.

 

[cat_in_the_hat]

Thank you awesome post that university you are referring too is a state ran institution and our tax dollars are used to support this institution back when Adolph Rupp did not want to retire he was 70 and all state government employees which included Rupp was forced into retirement so yes your dollars and mine dollars pay these coaches salaries 20 million a year is a lot and what are we getting in return for it

You're incorrect. UK pays somewhere around $400,000 of Stoop's contract. They would pay the same $400,000 if he made half as much in total.

 

[cat_in_the_hat]

280 million a year from our tax dollars fund Kentucky lol there would not even be a athletic department if it was not for this funding so yes we do pay these coaches

That's really perverted logic to suggest that because the state bonds some of UK's athletic facilities, that tax money somehow pays for coaches' salaries. On top of that, UK's athletic department pays the bond payments. Tax payers do not. UK's athletic department is self sufficient. It doesn't rely on tax money to pay its obligations.

 

[jeffky]

That's really perverted logic to suggest that because the state bonds some of UK's athletic facilities, that tax money somehow pays for coaches' salaries. On top of that, UK's athletic department pays the bond payments. Tax payers do not. UK's athletic department is self sufficient. It doesn't rely on tax money to pay its obligations.

Base salary paid by the university supplemental pay comes from endorsements and revenue generated by the department so yes we the tax payer pays these coaches salaries