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Shouldn't have been fooled by Bamba decision

spotter34

spotter34

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I haven't posted much about Bamba's decision. I thought for sure he would end up at Kentucky. He had a bunch of friends here, Cal has proven he developes bigs better than anyone in college right now, and he would know he would win here and compete for a national championship.

That last part is what got my attention yesterday. When talking about how he came to his decision I never heard him say anything about the possibility of winning a championship, trying to knock off Kansas as the Big XII champ, or how he wanted to try and become the #1 draft pick next year.

Everything was about his relationship with Shaka, the culture at Texas and their big alumni base, the broad range of views of the professors, oh, and the weather. This is not a basketball first recruit. Our basketball program is a basketball first program. Most of the recruits we get, basketball is their way out. It's their main avenue for future prosperity. For some it's their only avenue. That's not the case for Bamba. I think he probably saw Kentucky as the easy way out. He would have liked it here and been successful but he probably thought he wouldn't be challenged, not academically necessarily, but in a variety of ways. He knows he's going to make a lot of money starting next year so why not go some place where I can better broaden my horizons after basketball. I think that was the main thing he was basing his decision on, where can I help myself more for life after basketball that doesn't involve anything about basketball.

I'm not demeaning anything about the University of Kentucky, it's a fabulous institution, but it's not for everyone. Somebody from New York probably views UK as a little conservative and traditional. Well that doesn't sound like what Bamba was looking for.

I don't want to simplify this too much but Cal is great at helping kids and their families reach their dreams and he will continue to do so. I don't think Bamba needs his help or wanted the appearance of getting his help. Cal needs and wants recruits who love basketball and view that as their ticket to financial independence. I want recruits who want to play basketball first and foremost. Sure I want them to do well in school but primarily so they stay eligible to play basketball or football. That's not Bamba and I don't think he wanted to even give the impression that that is him, even a little bit.
 
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excellent post, OP
very interesting observations

and, it's possible, maybe that he isn't an OAD? That he does want more of the education/non- basketball experience?
I'm interested in seeing how this develops. He seems like a good kid, very intelligent. Maybe it ISN'T all about basketball, for him.
 
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spotter34 said:
I haven't posted much about Bamba's decision. I thought for sure he would end up at Kentucky. He had a bunch of friends here, Cal has proven he developes bigs better than anyone in college right now, and he would know he would win here and compete for a national championship.

That last part is what got my attention yesterday. When talking about how he came to his decision I never heard him say anything about the possibility of winning a championship, trying to knock off Kansas as the Big XII champ, or how he wanted to try and become the #1 draft pick next year.

Everything was about his relationship with Shaka, the culture at Texas and their big alumni base, the broad range of views of the professors, oh, and the weather. This is not a basketball first recruit. Our basketball program is a basketball first program. Most of the recruits we get, basketball is their way out. It's their main avenue for future prosperity. For some it's their only avenue. That's not the case for Bamba. I think he probably saw Kentucky as the easy way out. He would have liked it here and been successful but he probably thought he wouldn't be challenged, not academically necessarily, but in a variety of ways. He knows he's going to make a lot of money starting next year so why not go some place where I can better broaden my horizons after basketball. I think that was the main thing he was basing his decision on, where can I help myself more for life after basketball that doesn't involve anything about basketball.

I'm not demeaning anything about the University of Kentucky, it's a fabulous institution, but it's not for everyone. Somebody from New York probably views UK as a little conservative and traditional. Well that doesn't sound like what Bamba was looking for.

I don't want to simplify this too much but Cal is great at helping kids and their families reach their dreams and he will continue to do so. I don't think Bamba needs his help or wanted the appearance of getting his help. Cal needs and wants recruits who love basketball and view that as their ticket to financial independence. I want recruits who want to play basketball first and foremost. Sure I want them to do well in school but primarily so they stay eligible to play basketball or football. That's not Bamba and I don't think he wanted to even give the impression that that is him, even a little bit.
Click to expand...
also @Bkocats
nice post(s)...but the overwhelming majority of 18 year olds are NOT that intuitive about life...valedictorians of their respective HS's are usually not that visceral.

IMO, he is not as smart as everyone is giving him credit for...he will not be there more than two years...he will not be taking 300 level courses...he may or may not hurt his draft stock...he will not compete at high level (and that is what, I think it came down too).
He did not have the heart, desire, (balls) to be an alpha, within an alpha program and with alpha coach AND with other multiple alpha players...he took the path of least resistance.
I think this will show in his play...JMO
 
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At the end of the day, we probably got the more important recruit in Knox over Bamba. This team was sorely in need of a wing scorer and Knox fills that nicely. I fully expect SKJ to show MAJOR improvement and be a very serviceable 5 for this team. Richards will probably be slow to develop but is super athletic and reminds me a lot of Cauley-Stein. Get Diallo back and we will be poison!
 
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Blueaz said:
also@Bkocats
nice post(s)...but the overwhelming majority of 18 year olds are NOT that intuitive about life...valedictorians of their respective HS's are usually not that visceral.

IMO, he is not as smart as everyone is giving him credit for...he will not be there more than two years...he will not be taking 300 level courses...he may or may not hurt his draft stock...he will not compete at high level (and, that is what, I think it came down too).
He did not have the heart, desire, (balls) to be an alpha, within an alpha program and with alpha coach AND with other multiple alpha players...he took the path of least resistance.
I think this will show in his play...JMO
Click to expand...

Yeah, he's obviously smart, but I don't think he's as smart as he wants everyone to think he is.

At the end of the day, this felt a lot like Jaylen Brown picking California.
 
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Blueaz said:
also@Bkocats
nice post(s)...but the overwhelming majority of 18 year olds are NOT that intuitive about life...valedictorians of their respective HS's are usually not that visceral.

IMO, he is not as smart as everyone is giving him credit for...he will not be there more than two years...he will not be taking 300 level courses...he may or may not hurt his draft stock...he will not compete at high level (and, that is what, I think it came down too).
He did not have the heart, desire, (balls) to be an alpha, within an alpha program and with alpha coach AND with other multiple alpha players...he took the path of least resistance.
I think this will show in his play...JMO
Click to expand...

Relationship with coach > Relationship with players
He's going to be an alpha at Texas if he lives up to his hype.
I just wonder why he waited so long to decide since Allen declared awhile back.
 
Aike said:
Yeah, he's obviously smart, but I don't think he's as smart as he wants everyone to think he is.

At the end of the day, this felt a lot like Jaylen Brown picking California.
Click to expand...

Jaylen Brown or Ivan Rabb- we'll see a year from now. One is in a good spot , the other is questionable in year two of NBA draft.
 
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I was surprised, but not shocked. I think it's as simple as.....

* He really, really likes Shaka Smart.

* He's going to spend 9 months or so on campus wherever he went.

* Austin is an awesome city and a nice place to spend those 9 or so months.
 
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Blueaz said:
also@Bkocats
nice post(s)...but the overwhelming majority of 18 year olds are NOT that intuitive about life...valedictorians of their respective HS's are usually not that visceral.

IMO, he is not as smart as everyone is giving him credit for...he will not be there more than two years...he will not be taking 300 level courses...he may or may not hurt his draft stock...he will not compete at high level (and, that is what, I think it came down too).
He did not have the heart, desire, (balls) to be an alpha, within an alpha program and with alpha coach AND with other multiple alpha players...he took the path of least resistance.
I think this will show in his play...JMO
Click to expand...

I agree with a lot of this. I wasn't trying to say that Bamba is some genius, I just think he's a well rounded kid that understands he won't play basketball for the rest of his life and he wants to broaden his horizons.

I kept waiting to see something special when watching the all-star games and I never really saw it. Don't get wrong he's a great prospect but I think it's clear basketball is not the most important thing to him.

ThroughBlue said:
I have a feeling things may be a little conservative in Austin, Texas too
Click to expand...

I'm not sure how familiar you are to Austin, TX but it is one of the more liberal cities in America.
 
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I said over a month ago that this recruitment was trending more and more towards being about his relationship with Shaka.
but don't kid yourself… The kid wants to win, and a big part of Shaka's sales pitch was him being the centerpiece of a class that changes the direction of Texas basketball.
 
Great original post. Also, the Jarrett Allen relationship may have been underestimated in our thoughts. Further, if he was looking from the perspective of a small sample size (last year), A case could be made that Texas develops their big men better. I would have never dreamed Allen was going to go as high as the mocks now demonstrate.
 
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Cal constantly says: "UK is not for everyone."
Bamba is one of them. That's not a slight to us or a compliment to Texas.
I hope he does well. He's a sharp kid, no doubt.
 
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Mo Bamba just became Myles Turner 2.0 and that's fine. He is 100% OAD. He decided to give up the chance to be a number 1 pick by not going to UK (and to keep it real, Duke). That's his choice and he has a great relationship with Shaka who is a great person who is in over his head. Bamba will go about 8th in the draft now and he won't even have to compete with other great players every day in practice. He could have done a lot worse.
 
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I think the OP is a well thought out post, but I disagree. I think this was entirely a basketball decision. When you read the part where he talks about how Allen was used at UT, and where he was positioned on the floor, I think he made a direct comparison between Allen and Bam, and favors how he will be used at UT as compared to UK. Hard to knock a kid for that.

The reality is we live in a "now" world - and that's true 100 times over for teenagers. If you look at the last two centers at UK, both have underachieved compared to expectations, though the reasons differ. Skal underachieved because he was soft and couldn't take tough coaching; Bam was the exact opposite and was overly coachable, to the point he sacrificed individually for the betterment of the team.

Bamba was 10 or 11 when Cousins was at UK. He was 12 or 13 when Davis was there. He was 15 or 16 when KAT was here. He likely wasn't paying much attention to those guys. The guys he did see, Skal and Bam, were forced into being "back-to-the-basket" guys when it either didn't fit their game or the needs. Skal just wasn't capable of doing that. And while Bam certainly was, in today's NBA, a 6-10 guy who hasn't shown much more than the ability to dunk is not that desirable. Looking at it purely from a pro perspective, he needed to show a face-up game, and he never got the chance to do that at UK.

That's not a knock in any way on Cal. He did what was best for the team, which he should. He has stated "any team without a post presence is a fraud" and he really doesn't like his big guys venturing far from the paint. But that is not how Bamba envisions himself.
 
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It is interesting that a young man of his obvious talents would choose to go to a program that has little chance of making a serious run for the NCAA tournament title. If he is looking for a college experience and a good education along with high class basketball, there are several places that he could go that would have been far and above anything he could get at Texas. But if that is what he wants then I am happy for him and hope he goes on to be very successful. From a very selfish point of view, I am glad he went to Texas where he will probably have a good year but will not be a threat to UK.
 
TheAnonymous13 said:
I said over a month ago that this recruitment was trending more and more towards being about his relationship with Shaka.
but don't kid yourself… The kid wants to win, and a big part of Shaka's sales pitch was him being the centerpiece of a class that changes the direction of Texas basketball.
Click to expand...

Bamba may want to win but it will be a lot harder at Texas than at Kentucky. They will seriously struggle to make the NCAA tourney. They lost 6 players off an 11 win team. Two of those 6 players gone were their 2 leading scorers (3 of their top 5) and their top 3 rebounders. How much more productive will Bamba be than Allen? How much more productive will Coleman be than Mack? Who knows it may all click and they double their win total from last year and they win 22 and make the tourney but thats still a 9-12 seed. We'll see how it goes. If they win more than that and they stay in the top 20 all year and go beyond the sweet 16 then Bamba will have to show more passion and development than I've noticed in him and we can pencil Shaka Smart and Texas in as future competition for elite recruits.
 
4UK said:
I think the OP is a well thought out post, but I disagree. I think this was entirely a basketball decision. When you read the part where he talks about how Allen was used at UT, and where he was positioned on the floor, I think he made a direct comparison between Allen and Bam, and favors how he will be used at UT as compared to UK. Hard to knock a kid for that.

The reality is we live in a "now" world - and that's true 100 times over for teenagers. If you look at the last two centers at UK, both have underachieved compared to expectations, though the reasons differ. Skal underachieved because he was soft and couldn't take tough coaching; Bam was the exact opposite and was overly coachable, to the point he sacrificed individually for the betterment of the team.

Bamba was 10 or 11 when Cousins was at UK. He was 12 or 13 when Davis was there. He was 15 or 16 when KAT was here. He likely wasn't paying much attention to those guys. The guys he did see, Skal and Bam, were forced into being "back-to-the-basket" guys when it either didn't fit their game or the needs. Skal just wasn't capable of doing that. And while Bam certainly was, in today's NBA, a 6-10 guy who hasn't shown much more than the ability to dunk is not that desirable. Looking at it purely from a pro perspective, he needed to show a face-up game, and he never got the chance to do that at UK.

That's not a knock in any way on Cal. He did what was best for the team, which he should. He has stated "any team without a post presence is a fraud" and he really doesn't like his big guys venturing far from the paint. But that is not how Bamba envisions himself.
Click to expand...

That's a good point but I'd still argue that the basketball part of his decision was secondary. He never mentioned the opportunity of winning the Big XII, a possible national championship, or trying to be the #1 draft pick in next years draft. He mentioned his trust and relationship with Shaka and the development of Allen, that still only produced 11 wins last year.
 
shidler said:
Great original post. Also, the Jarrett Allen relationship may have been underestimated in our thoughts. Further, if he was looking from the perspective of a small sample size (last year), A case could be made that Texas develops their big men better. I would have never dreamed Allen was going to go as high as the mocks now demonstrate.
Click to expand...

Last summer, Draft Express already had Allen going top 10. Today, they have him at 17.

To be fair, Bam has also dropped.

If anything, Allen is projected higher than Bam because of physical dimensions. No real evidence that Shaka's development has anything to do with it.

Of course we will know more after the actual draft.
 
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Wow! I did not remember that Allen was projected that high. I stand corrected. I should have wanted him more! :)
 
Good for the kid. I hadn't paid much attention, so I had no idea about his relationship with Smart. Had I realized that I probably would have known a long time ago.

I also agree with what was said above that Knox was the more important recruit for us. We have a lot of big guys (not necessarily as good as Bamba, but good), but had no player like Knox. If Diallo comes back we are going to be really, really good. Without him we will still be good.
 
spotter34 said:
I agree with a lot of this. I wasn't trying to say that Bamba is some genius, I just think he's a well rounded kid that understands he won't play basketball for the rest of his life and he wants to broaden his horizons.

1. I kept waiting to see something special when watching the all-star games and I never really saw it. 2.Don't get wrong he's a great prospect but I think it's clear basketball is not the most important thing to him..
Click to expand...
1. I agree 100%
2. I think he (or those close to him) is trying to play that persona
 
I know it is kind of corny but looking back on his recruitment now the thing that sticks out to me is that video the Kentucky players made that had Bamba in it. When you hit play Bamba looked away as if he wasn't that interested. Looking back now I can't help but to think that was some type of sign that he did the little video because he is friends with several of the UK players but he looked like he was blowing it off for his Texas buddies.
 
He gave away millions of dollars. That's cool, it's his call, and realistically he's going to make more than enough millions anyway.
 
I wonder how much Bamba will like the NIT? I'm fine with his decision, but it had nothing to do with basketball. Go enjoy the weather and hanging out with Shaka Smart for 9 months. That's basically what the decision boiled down to.

Honestly I'd rather just have the dudes that come here because they want to win before getting drafted.
 
I think it might also be that he wanted to be the main guy.He can jack up threes and do what he wants at Texas.Here he would have other talent around and have to play in a system.No Final 4 worries there.
 
Honestly I do question the kid's desire to win by going to Texas.I mean Fox and Bam crying their eyes out after the North Carolina loss stands out to me.Those kids really cared about going to a Final 4 and winning a championship.He's too smart not to know Texas is an NIT quality team and spending 9 months at a school would make me choose a winner. JMO
 
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Mike-D said:
I wonder how much Bamba will like the NIT? I'm fine with his decision, but it had nothing to do with basketball. Go enjoy the weather and hanging out with Shaka Smart for 9 months. That's basically what the decision boiled down to.

Honestly I'd rather just have the dudes that come here because they want to win before getting drafted.
Click to expand...
look at Fultz...some just don't care
 
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Some have said Bamba chose Texas of UK due to the development of Allen vs Bam. Bam and Allen had identical stats last season. Both average 13pts 8reb 1.5blks accept Allen average 2 more minutes/gm while Bam shot a little better (60% vs 56%). To me, it looks like Bamba was just reaching for a basketball reason as to why he chose Texas over UK.
IMO he wanted to go to a place where he can take a nine month vacation while hanging out with his buddy who happens to be a coach.
 
It makes me wonder if Cal's decision, even though he truly had little choice, to try to make Skal a back to the basket player to no avail was used against him. I'm sure his slip to the bottom of the first round didn't help either. Offensively I think it is clear Bamba does not want to play like that and may have felt that was how he was going to be used.
 
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