Eric Korem's program

[seccats04]

Serious question and I'm not trying to bash here but has anyone seen any evidence that his program is nothing more than a marketing gimmick? Both of our lines are still getting dominated 3 years later and we looked totally gassed in the 4th quarter against ULL. I know ULL dominated the TOP but it was the FIRST GAME OF THE YEAR and we looked really out of shape. I was expecting to see us dominate late game because of our superior conditioning program but it was the complete opposite. I'm really disappointed.

 

[CCSteamRoller]

Serious question and I'm not trying to bash here but has anyone seen any evidence that his program is nothing more than a marketing gimmick? Both of our lines are still getting dominated 3 years later and we looked totally gassed in the 4th quarter against ULL. I know ULL dominated the TOP but it was the FIRST GAME OF THE YEAR and we looked really out of shape. I was expecting to see us dominate late game because of our superior conditioning program but it was the complete opposite. I'm really disappointed.

No. Eric Korem deserves no blame for this near-loss. The D-line was getting gassed because they played 90 plays with little rest. If anything, I saw some dead legs, but not players who were out of shape. I suspect the manhandling was more technique-related than strength and conditioning-related.

 

[domino79]

We're relatively injury-free. That's a testament to the strength and conditioning program's effectiveness.

 

[K_TIME]

The marketing hype over his program was a nice gimmick but simply put...I highly doubt UK is doing more (or less under Stoops) to develop kids compared to other programs.

I have no issue with Korem but neither will I listen that his program is earth shattering in results...look to Matt Elam as an example...kid is still a ways away from being the best player he can be.

 

[Johnfarrel]

The game was 4 hours long and the D played 90 snaps. the weather was warm and the tension was high. I don't think conditioning was the problem.

 

[seccats04]

I just thought his program would give us that extra edge to push us over the top. If anything, I've seen just the opposite. See the last six games last year as proof. We kept hearing over and over that we were gassed the last 6 games of the year. I heard announcers say "tired legs" in the 1st quarter of games. I don't care how much a lack of depth may affect legs but being tired in the first quarter of a game is totally unacceptable regardless of how many games into the season we are. So far I see no difference in his program and Rock Oliver's and we have better players now.

 

[BigBlueFanGA]

Just looking at Elam makes me curious about Korems results. The kid should easily be down to the 340 playing weight they want, but he is still at 360. From reading on here it was like Korem cornered the market with conditioning. I don't see it. Elam is still too heavy and slow. I just expected more I guess.

 

[Devils58]

Korems program had ZERO to do with the meltdown Saturday. It was a combination of focus and youth. When the game was tied and UK had to get the stops they did. All of a sudden, a lethal ULL offense became non existent because each player starter doing their jobs again. On offense, Towels sucked I'm the second half or UK would've padded the scoreboard some more.

Dont do this people. We got a gem with Erik Korem. Our guys are bigger faster and stronger. Have you not seen Josh Forrest? The guy was a freakin wide receiver a couple of years ago. Now he looks like a SEC line backer and a big reason for that is Erik Korem.

As Stoops continues to build UKs depth and talent the likelihood of meltdowns will continue to decrease.

 

[Dallas-Wild]

The marketing hype over his program was a nice gimmick but simply put...I highly doubt UK is doing more (or less under Stoops) to develop kids compared to other programs.

I have no issue with Korem but neither will I listen that his program is earth shattering in results...look to Matt Elam as an example...kid is still a ways away from being the best player he can be.

So you're taking one player from the entire team and system to make this point?

One that was roughly pushing 400lbs and has lost roughly 50 lbs in a year as a failure?

A player who is naturally just BIG who has worked to lose the weight he has....it's just marketing hype.

Can you provide a few more examples please?

 

[SaguaroCat]

I think people are really underestimating the effort it takes to lose 35 pounds in one year and still keep a 500 pound bench and 700 squat.

And no, that time you went on Atkins is not a similar example.

 

[Boyz_N_Blue]

Korem helped design many of the features in the new training facility. The guy is ahead of the curve in his discipline. Pick something else to complain about, we performed when we had to at the end of the game, conditioning was not an issue.

 

[bigblueinsanity]

We're relatively injury-free. That's a testament to the strength and conditioning program's effectiveness.

In years past, UK was basically a walking triage. We were down to putting in waterboys by the end of the season. Korem turned all that around.

I think people are really underestimating the effort it takes to lose 35 pounds in one year and still keep a 500 pound bench and 700 squat.

And no, that time you went on Atkins is not a similar example.

This. The only people questioning Korem are people that know nothing about physical fitness. They cite Elam as an example of failure, when in fact hes a success story. He lost alot of weight, and maintained/improved his strength. Thats an extraordinarily tough thing to do. In fact, I noticed he played much lower, much longer vs ULL. And not surprisingly he had the best game of his career.

The issues with dead legs, etc is more about quality depth than conditioning. Other SEC teams can cycle in 4 and 5 star players at every position. We cant. We're closing the gap. But theres still a depth issue when we face SEC teams.

 

[optimus-blue]

Knee jerk reactions about things are silly, Ky players look physical better and by the way the played the last couple series on Defense they are in better shape, we played a team that we should have beaten by 3 touchdowns but due to our mistakes we didn't and let them back in the game. ULL will be 9-2 10-1 ,this game will look a lot better in 5-6 weeks than it does now.

 

[willymakit63]

Did anyone even see Mikel Horton? All you need to see to know if it's working or not

 

[CCSteamRoller]

I just thought his program would give us that extra edge to push us over the top. If anything, I've seen just the opposite. See the last six games last year as proof. We kept hearing over and over that we were gassed the last 6 games of the year. I heard announcers say "tired legs" in the 1st quarter of games. I don't care how much a lack of depth may affect legs but being tired in the first quarter of a game is totally unacceptable regardless of how many games into the season we are. So far I see no difference in his program and Rock Oliver's and we have better players now.

Before responding to your follow up post, will you share what your background in physical fitness - college and Olympic athletic training and fitness in particular? Have you trained with successful top-level athletes or read much on the subject? This is not an attack, I just want to know how to reply to your questions.

 

[Charger_Pride]

To think any of the top 30 programs in the nation have a qualitative advantage in strength and conditioning is foolish. Nebraska ended that with their biggest faster stronger program.

 

[ukalumni00]

Folks, there is no magic pill that all of the sudden makes players never tire, get massively huge (except steroids), shed blockers, etc. That comes from recruiting the type of talent that has the ability and size to do those things. In the past, KY has recruited guys who were too small, limited in their ability, and limited genetic makeup to be the typical SEC freak size that beat up KY players on a weekly basis.

Where Korem's results come into play is how often the players are being injured. Not talking about ACL tears, broken bones, separated shoulders, etc. The human body can only take so much and in a serious collision sport like football those injuries are going to happen. What I am talking about are muscle pulls and tears, proper nutrition, having the energy to train and practice at an optimal level, etc. I would love to see the stats since he arrived, but I would bet the house there are far less smaller injuries than there used to be.

As for Elam, obviously a lot of you folks have never trained much in your life. Let's say he was 400 when he arrived and he is in fact 360 now. How do you know that he did not put on 20+ lbs of muscle since he arrived? He could have very well lost 75 lbs of fat since he arrived. He easily played his best game this past Saturday. I saw tons of improvement in him. If you can't see it then I do not know what to tell you.

Mikel Horton looked completely different and you could tell a mile away has made significant improvement in his speed and agility in the offseason.

Point blank, the skill players all look to be in tremendous shape. The big guys looked like SEC caliber guys. Try playing in very hot and muggy conditions weighing over 230+ lbs, play the number of snaps the defense had to play, and see how long it takes for you to get gassed. The best part is (as far as I know) there were no significant injuries.

 

[ukalumni00]

To think any of the top 30 programs in the nation have a qualitative advantage in strength and conditioning is foolish. Nebraska ended that with their biggest faster stronger program.

Nebraska was well known for their steroid program back in the day when they had monsters all over their roster (especially the lineman).

 

[ktbug]

Our lines got dominated?

 

[Bluuu]

He has a young team, however after watching the Ohio State preseason series it's obvious their players are physically more mature than ours. Their linebacker are all huge, their running backs are as well. Their OL all look like men. We are getting there but we are not there.

 

[homerblue]

Korem's High Peformance Program is by far the best in the world in any sport at any level. If you dont know this, you are not a UK fan!!

 

[tmuck]

Korem's High Peformance Program is by far the best in the world in any sport at any level. If you dont know this, you are not a UK fan!!

Your team lost Saturday. GTFO kid.

 

[UKCatnNC]

We will be better with Johnson, Flannigan and Hatcher out there!! More depth and more skills. Go Cats!!

 

[homerblue]

Im not a Stoops hater like you Tmuck. Sorry if that bothers you!!

 

[K_TIME]

So you're taking one player from the entire team and system to make this point?

One that was roughly pushing 400lbs and has lost roughly 50 lbs in a year as a failure?

A player who is naturally just BIG who has worked to lose the weight he has....it's just marketing hype.

Can you provide a few more examples please?

1. Again...I've never said Korem is a failure...all I believe is he brings no extra advantage that any other S&C program brings to any other program. He is not a failure...but he doesn't give UK an advantage that UL doesn't get out of their S&C leadership.
2. Elam isn't a failure...but he came in reportedly at 380 (not over 400 lbs) and he's done about 20-25 lbs. Totally concede he's shed more fat and added muscle. I'd argue the entire OL has been in 3 years of this program and Toth, Swindle, West, Ramsey Meyers for 2, etc. aren't freakishly different than any other OL in 3 years of UK's past S&C programs. Farrington has been in the program for 3 years...is he an incredible physically fit DL?

The person with the point that we'll see less ACL/muscle injuries...I can concede that may be an advantage of Korem's program. But to those that were googly-eyed that we'll be turning Mister Cobble into a way better DL in Korem's program vs the past S&C guys....I think you're dead wrong.

 

[KendallCat]

Korem's program focuses on constant testing and monitoring of certain key bodyparts to help prevent soft tissue injuries, and also uses heart rate monitoring and tracks expenditure and output during practices - example now many pass patterns does a wide receiver run until they start noticing a decline in speed or increase in heart rate. His program is based off of a rugby training program protocol based in New Zealand I believe. Does his program do a good job with that aspect - yes. Does it necessarily mean we will have a bunch of monsters on the oline and dline who bench 500 and squat 750? No.

I think a good S&C program utilizes various methods to get players faster, stronger, bigger, more explosive, more agile, and decreases injuries. A good S&C program like a good football program has a culture about it, an expectation about it. I was around the Miami programs in the late 80's and that culture had leadership, expectations, players who drove the other players, and did not accept losing. Our basketball program has the same expectations, and when our football program has it we will see the results. When our lineman are expected to be over 310 lbs, bench 450, and squat 600 each we will see different results. If a S&C coach tells a player you don't lift "x" then you don't play they will find a way.

 

[Levibooty]

The marketing hype over his program was a nice gimmick but simply put...I highly doubt UK is doing more (or less under Stoops) to develop kids compared to other programs.

I have no issue with Korem but neither will I listen that his program is earth shattering in results...look to Matt Elam as an example...kid is still a ways away from being the best player he can be.

OK lets compare Elams progress with his weight issue compared to say Jared Lorenzen. Elam lost about 40 LBS his first year.

 

[Dallas-Wild]

1. Again...I've never said Korem is a failure...all I believe is he brings no extra advantage that any other S&C program brings to any other program. He is not a failure...but he doesn't give UK an advantage that UL doesn't get out of their S&C leadership.
2. Elam isn't a failure...but he came in reportedly at 380 (not over 400 lbs) and he's done about 20-25 lbs. Totally concede he's shed more fat and added muscle. I'd argue the entire OL has been in 3 years of this program and Toth, Swindle, West, Ramsey Meyers for 2, etc. aren't freakishly different than any other OL in 3 years of UK's past S&C programs. Farrington has been in the program for 3 years...is he an incredible physically fit DL?

The person with the point that we'll see less ACL/muscle injuries...I can concede that may be an advantage of Korem's program. But to those that were googly-eyed that we'll be turning Mister Cobble into a way better DL in Korem's program vs the past S&C guys....I think you're dead wrong.

Yea you're right dude... Those over hyped coaching statements are just a sales pitch.

 

[CatsFanGG24]

1. Again...I've never said Korem is a failure...all I believe is he brings no extra advantage that any other S&C program brings to any other program. He is not a failure...but he doesn't give UK an advantage that UL doesn't get out of their S&C leadership.
2. Elam isn't a failure...but he came in reportedly at 380 (not over 400 lbs) and he's done about 20-25 lbs. Totally concede he's shed more fat and added muscle. I'd argue the entire OL has been in 3 years of this program and Toth, Swindle, West, Ramsey Meyers for 2, etc. aren't freakishly different than any other OL in 3 years of UK's past S&C programs. Farrington has been in the program for 3 years...is he an incredible physically fit DL?

The person with the point that we'll see less ACL/muscle injuries...I can concede that may be an advantage of Korem's program. But to those that were googly-eyed that we'll be turning Mister Cobble into a way better DL in Korem's program vs the past S&C guys....I think you're dead wrong.

Elam came in at 392, so many would say that is "pushing" 400. He is down to 355 - 37 pounds while adding muscle. He has done well.

 

[K_TIME]

Yea you're right dude... Those over hyped coaching statements are just a sales pitch.

You asked for other specific instances...I just gave you 4 DL/OL that have been here the past 3 years...and their bodies and performance as just as ho-hum past UK DL/OL.

We go thru this stuff every year with coaches...it isn't that Korem is a bad S&C..he just isn't getting crazy results that many hyped him when he first got here. The same "negative nancy labels" occur when you question DJ Elliott, Brumbaugh, Schlarman..or even early in Joker's tenure when we were dissapointed in how Randall Cobb's final year went down the drain.

It doesn't make you less of a UK fan to have reserved judgements/criticisms at time any more than guys on other side of the fence that hardly ever see a criticism of a single coach/player.

 

[Dallas-Wild]

You asked for other specific instances...I just gave you 4 DL/OL that have been here the past 3 years...and their bodies and performance as just as ho-hum past UK DL/OL.

We go thru this stuff every year with coaches...it isn't that Korem is a bad S&C..he just isn't getting crazy results that many hyped him when he first got here. The same "negative nancy labels" occur when you question DJ Elliott, Brumbaugh, Schlarman..or even early in Joker's tenure when we were dissapointed in how Randall Cobb's final year went down the drain.

It doesn't make you less of a UK fan to have reserved judgements/criticisms at time any more than guys on other side of the fence that hardly ever see a criticism of a single coach/player.

K Time, one thing I would NEVER do is say you're less a UK fan than anyone!

 

[johnnyrockets]

1) Every P5 team has a legit S&C program. There's no way UK is doing things that differently than anyone else. Thinking Korem is going to fix all of our personnel problems is silly.

2) End of game fatigue, for our team the past 3 years (at least), has more to do with lack of bodies, not with the bodies being out of shape. JMO.

 

[cawood12]

I think we should blame it on the water boy

 

[truebluewildcat]

Technique, positional development, scheme, and play execution...this is where there is still much room to improve...

 

[NCukcat62]

I don't get how anyone can blame Saturday on korem. Lol

 

[seccats04]

1) Every P5 team has a legit S&C program. There's no way UK is doing things that differently than anyone else. Thinking Korem is going to fix all of our personnel problems is silly.

2) End of game fatigue, for our team the past 3 years (at least), has more to do with lack of bodies, not with the bodies being out of shape. JMO.

Ok I can buy that but if you look back at the last 6 games last year we looked tired in the 1st Quarter of games. Now I know that we didn't rotate a lot because of a lack of depth, ok I can buy that. But we should not have tired legs early in games.

 

[UKBrassowTipIN]

Just looking at Elam makes me curious about Korems results. The kid should easily be down to the 340 playing weight they want, but he is still at 360. From reading on here it was like Korem cornered the market with conditioning. I don't see it. Elam is still too heavy and slow. I just expected more I guess.

Maybe Elam doesn't work hard

 

[southindycat]

Did anyone even see Mikel Horton? All you need to see to know if it's working or not

Agree with this 100%.

More generally, It is obviously lost on a lot of people that we did not play our best in all three phases of the game in the second half, and still won, against a legitimate football program, even when it seemed we had really let it slip away from us. Sorry, but that is not your older brother's UK football team.

Why? I'm going with SECOND WIND. Our kids on defense got some good work done when the chips were down, even after they had been gassed and given up what they should not.

Quit looking for scapegoats, people, and get ready for Saturday. It was the first game.

 

[fuzz77]

1) Every P5 team has a legit S&C program. There's no way UK is doing things that differently than anyone else. Thinking Korem is going to fix all of our personnel problems is silly.

2) End of game fatigue, for our team the past 3 years (at least), has more to do with lack of bodies, not with the bodies being out of shape. JMO.

This pretty much sums it up.

The thing that Korem has brought to UK that differentiates the program from others is data. Data doesn't make you stronger or faster but it gives measures to validate that hard work pays off. Effort can be measured...etc.
In the end the difference in Korem's program and other tried and true S&C programs best case is that a player is 1 or 2% stronger, faster that he otherwise would have been. Still, every human has a limit of potential. If you've been lifting weights for years and have a max bench press of 225, no amount or method of training is going to allow you to ever bench 300. You may reach 250 with optimum training.

IMHO, the biggest thing Korem's program does is that it's a recruiting tool. Kids like the sports science stuff.

 

[southindycat]

Ok I can buy that but if you look back at the last 6 games last year we looked tired in the 1st Quarter of games. Now I know that we didn't rotate a lot because of a lack of depth, ok I can buy that. But we should not have tired legs early in games.

You can't train up physical maturity. You either are, or you are not, 20 years old. We played even more youth last year than this year. He is doing a good job, and seems to be getting kids really ready to play at this point. This is year three. If a red shirt sophomore is physically ready to compete against our conference opponents as a starter, that is called being ahead of schedule.