No, probably not, but it would still exist. However, the brightness of a tactical nuke or low yield nuke wouldn't last as long as that explosion did. The article I linked is very helpful.
The Ukraine war. (Yes, we'll mind our manners)
- Thread starter BigBlueFanGA
- Start date
Actually, he says a lot but it's usually pretty superficial. He said an EMP effect would not be created by this type nuke explosion. That is incorrect and isn't a technicality. Much of the gamma would have gone into the ground but not all of it. You're welcome to believe what you want but this was not a nuclear explosion.
Don't you think we'll be flying tanks into Poland and then using whatever system they choose to move them through Ukraine? I wouldn't think we would be flying into the war zone or Ukraine in general.EMP effect is generally generated by detonating a higher yield device in the upper atmosphere - the ionosphere i think
This wouldn't have produced an EMP effect
And a lower blast yield wouldn't be picked up as
anything unique within an active theater of conflict -
If one or our smaller devices were detonated - we WOULD make sure that it was explained as a conventional explosion -- and (assuming you saw the same video Im thinking about) -- that is pretty much EXACTLY what it would look like -- and also a perfect example of the type of target selected for a micro/tac nuke
(also -- its an area of the world where NO ONE is really going to be investigating and gathering forensic evidence of such a detonation)
Again - not trying to grandstand on this issue --
....and I'm not seeking to convince you it was a non conventional device -- but I do believe that one was used in that conflict and in at least two other occasions
Hopefully we don't have to worry about escalation in Eurasia that would open the door to such a thing happening again
BUT - for the British, American & German battle tanks that are going to be supplied ..:and the ENORMOUS monthly quantities of artillery shells planned for near term delivery - the planes delivering those munitions are legitimate targets for Russia to eliminate
The airport (s) where those airlift missions will arrive (likely USAF C17s) --would present an ideal set of circumstances where Russia could use one of their nuclear cruise missiles to strike the infrastructure, cargo planes and incoming weapons simultaneously
.... those shipments will be considered fair game for destruction and any massed concentration of assets will present the exact set of circumstances that would provoke a heavy handed response (same goes for any sea going vessels)
--->> quickly ref the idea of Putin being possibly liquidated -- that may result in even worse circumstances if a more radical figure takes his place -- really hard to know how an operation like that will turn out
Sounds like CIA / Mossad / MI6 type works where they also sponsor an intended replacement to the targeted individual -
Shady stuff & not my swim lane at all🎩
I was reading his response in context with your claim that:
Second, its difficult for me to believe that camera survived fully when there would have been a significant EMP.
Doesn’t really seem hard to believe a nuclear explosion could be recorded on video when we’ve seen plenty of video recordings of nuclear explosions.
From many, many miles away with much older cameras. Modern equipment is very sensitive to EMP's but I already said I'm probably incorrect that the camera should have shown some effects.
If you mean the EMP effect that is
associated with widespread power grid damage - then -
No, there wouldn't be that type of impact fm a small localized ground burst -
I've always heard of EMP being referenced in a singular context - high altitude detonation and widespread power outages
Maybe a ground burst tac-nuke would knock out power within a small radius?
I've never heard of that being an effect-- but I dont mind admitting that it could occur -- maybe its the mission specific references to each type of bomb that resulted in me not realizing a localized effect occurs --?
So - I really come across as a bullshitter?
Like a deliberate liar?
Why?
I mean Im not a drive by poster - been on here for decades -
A couple of ppl on this site could corroborate my references to career background -- but -- I'm also not in the business of building myself up or ensuring that ppl see me any certain way
I've always led with facts where I can
And make an effort to separate my opinions fm those
I realize the career stops I've had aren't typical
And someone who DID want to appear as 'big man in the thread for such topics' -- may list list out a stream of experiences like that
But I'm an eastern kentucky guy and I didn't come fm people that put on airs or attempt to
don stolen valor -
I enjoy the conversation on here and I love Kentucky and Kenruckians - posting here
has helped me vent and retain a little extra sanity over the years
But I hope you and I continue to dialogue
Is there anything specific that I've said that you
want to question?
Military bases or squadron locations?
Facts regards organizational structure and functional areas fm CDC, Raytheon, Lockheed or anything you're curious about?
Do you live near Lexington by
chance?
i am in Winchester the past 3 yrs
Really?
Damn -
I WAS posting with little sleep and its overly wordy maybe - I went back and tightened it up a bit
appreciate the feedback
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Yeah I tried to allude to that by mentioning that we may not drop ship very directly into UKR
Still , that list of weapons represents a hellacious escalation and the tanks / armor units will eventually wind up in relatively close proximity
And ultimately were helping create a scenario where possible escalation to Russian nuke use occurs -- that was my main point I believe
Ramstein's 86th Airlift Wing is a likely destination - killer doner kebabs down in K-Town ⚡
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Oh, I never mentioned stolen valor and never would without 100% confirmation. I dont see the same escalation that you perceive.
Nah, not a deliberate liar, something just seems off to me. Could just be me.
Tanks fm 3 nations and F16s aren't an escalation over the current situation?
They are a literal, measurable degree of escalation - not only in terms of higher levels of military hardware arriving - but also a clear increase in firepower & strike range
And that stuff will be coming with some degree of training personnel fm the host nations providing the weapons
So - you're saying 'you dont feel like its an escalation' -- why?
Maybe you actually DO understand the obvious escalation of weapons pouring in - but you're saying you don't belittle Russia will escalate their military response as a result?
I am quirky - little ADDish
And I pretty much talk like i post
which is good for honesty - but probably taxing to others on occasion when my train of thought turns into 10-12 small go-carts
No big deal I guess
Im asking in case there's something specific that I am doing that i may be able to change and improve on
If I pretend Im listening to me list all that stuff
out ...i can see how i come across as maybe a
bit too much at once
And that could give the impression that
Im trying too hard to establish credibility i guess
No, it's an escalation on the Ukraine side. I don't believe it will lead to a nuclear escalation from the Russians.
If we know what’s good for us we’ll let Putin have his way with Ukraine. He has those Soviet era ICBMs, after all, and he’s said over and over that he’ll use them if he loses in Ukraine.
I’m going to add. Americanization comes at the expense of many. It cannot happen without the majority being have nots. This is why there will never be a global acceptance of American policy. The people will stand behind their autocratic leaders to prevent it.
Well, they don’t exactly have a choice in an autocracy.
And again, it isn’t American policy that’s swamping other countries, it’s culture. We were the first large society to have, basically, too much of everything.
Everyone wanted to be like us. To have luxuries and opportunities that were available to everyone who wanted to work for them.
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Well the haves aren’t in the Congo chiseling out cobalt from the day their little toddler hands can hold a hammer until they die to keep my iPhone running.
True but that takes me back to Wildcats statement again. Those people and the majority of people in the world are already "have nots". But Wildcats said Americanization would create "have nots". I simply don't understand. Even our "have nots" live pretty darn well compared to most of the world.
We are, in fact, the first society to have fat poor people.
Yeah and for 100 years the usa built the nation on the backs of the black population. Opportunists to get rich off the weak. For Americanism to exist there have to be the weak who cater to this country and Europe. The world isn’t buying it. And yes there is a choice. Just like there was a choice under king George. The swamping of other countries as you say has been American policy since ww2. For shits sake we have fought many wars to “change hearts and minds” losing every time: that’s not assimilation as you suggest. It’s imperialism. It’s America being opportunistic at every turn to impose its values: this war in Ukraine is no different. Do people like technology? Sure. But you are conflating that with Americanism which has very little to do with tech other that the USA using bombs to change regimes all over the world. The 4 biggest wars fought by the USA since ww2 weren’t because people wanted liberation. It’s because the USA wanted its policies to prevail. The kicker is this. The USA lost all of them. What do you have now? A sectarian Iraq. A taliban lead Afghanistan, a massive loss of American life in Vietnam for nada and a nuclear armed north korea. Yep the rest of the world is pining for US values.
You haven’t been anywhere out of the “western world” if you think countries want to be like us. Those that want to “be like us” leave their country and go to America or Europe. Have you been to Asia, Egypt, Eastern Europe, South America, Somalia, Southern Africa any places like this? I have and the people have no desire to live like Americans. No one likes our government. Every one of these places think our government impose values. Are there some things they like? Sure but I’ll tell you when the Arab spring arrived I heard nothing but how bad it was going to be from people I know throughout the Mid East especially Egypt where my family is from. Sure enough. They elected the most oppressive of governments and the military overthrew a short time later. You don’t know what you’re talking about. Go ahead think that imposing our will leads to cultural change an acceptance of American values. Japan wouldn’t have accepted it if we hadn’t bombed them into submission. Eastern Europe? The USA was an opportunist. Hell listen to bbga he rattles off all these eastern european leaders and calls the pro Russian shills. Croatia, Bulgaria, Hungary, turkey. lol. You been to Greece? They despise the American way. They would rather be poverty stricken than accept Americanism.
You asked and BC answered. As globalization has proliferated so has poverty and oppression. The world rejects it or they would go running for it. I’m not saying Americanization would create have nots I’m saying it already has! The USA has exploited the worlds resources for its personal gains and you guys think these countries are pining to be like America. If we were one global entity as catemus sugggests is happening most of the world will end up slaves to the American way of secularism, consumerism, social engineering, globalization, cultural assimilation, etc. It’s not happening unless through force. That’s why you hawks want direct war with Russia and china. If we can take them down our system will prevail. At least that’s what you believe. And what is good for you shouldn’t be imposed on to others. Hell that’s what the argument against communism has been. 2/3-3/4 of the world absolutely do not want cultural assimilation. The USA and what’s been imposed in Europe is it. Even Japan rejects it but the USA uses weapons of war and economic weapons to get countries to buy in. The weapons didn’t work in Japan so now economic pressure, maybe that will get them to crack. This is why we are headed toward world war. Autocratic leaders and their people believe America have no place to lecture. Slavery, genocide of indigenious people, they see what America wants to bring.
That's an idiotic statement. GDP per capita did not decrease at all when slavery was outlawed (even during the Civil war). Instead it continued to rise. Slaves primarily performed low-value agriculture and house work. The country wasn't built on their labor. Instead, the country was worse off because a) we enslaved people and it's morally reprehensible and b) we did not allow these people (the slaves) to get educated and do higher value work or go where the value of their labor be maximized (i.e., industrial north).
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Would you say, then, that you are anti-American?
It can be said that Britain and the Netherlands brought slavery to the American colonies and that the USA fought a civil war to end it.
More cotton was produced in America in 1870 than in 1860. America wasn't built on the backs of slaves. Slave-owning Americans (1.4% of the population was a slaveholder, or, if you want to not downplay the number, something like 20% of households in slave-legal states) exploited slaves for personal gain. Freeing the slaves unlocked economic value of America.
Must be kidding, try getting into the 21st century and quit whining about the 19th century. Its hard to take you seriously with that drivel.
I'm sure that upsets Putin. He planned to conquer Ukraine in a matter of weeks.
Maybe! Maybe not now because someone gave him back the Merchant of Death. It Makes perfect & logical sense!!
America is the greatest country on earth. But I do not agree with American expansionism through military conflict. We need to mind our own business.
I think GW was very prescient when he warned of foreign alliances and political parties
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