Serious question here. I’ve seen various references on this board and in the media to Stoops building the program “the right way”. I’m not disputing that. In fact, I really can’t dispute it because I’m not sure I really even know what it means. Does that just mean we aren’t cheating? Or is it something more? And, if so, what? And what would be an example of doing it “the wrong way” (other than cheating, of course)?
The right way?
- Thread starter gojvc
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My first thought would be taking in every low character player in the country. College kids do stupid things and every team has their disciplinary issues, but we are unloading these kids instead of onloading them for quick victories.
We’ve had issues with a couple of kids ourselves, can’t weed ‘em all out, My personal view of the right way is building a solid core of two or three deep and getting a coaching staff in place that gels.
Basically the opposite of what Lane Kiffin and Bobby Petrino does.
You can't rely on recruiting 7 - 10 Juco's every year. Or having a bunch of players leaving every year, though everyone will have some leave, mostly due to playing time or academic issues.
The right way is bringing in good kids, who wait their turn to shine. Work hard and get bigger and stronger until its time to start. Develop into big time players by their junior and senior years..
With that said, you still want to get as many top notch stars as you can. Players who can start and be very good as freshmen. Then become stars as sophomores and juniors.
That is why some on here says it takes time to build a program. Unfortunately, your not going to hit on every kid you recruit, some will never become big time talent even in their senior years.
GO BIG BLUE!!!
The right way is bringing in good kids, who wait their turn to shine. Work hard and get bigger and stronger until its time to start. Develop into big time players by their junior and senior years..
With that said, you still want to get as many top notch stars as you can. Players who can start and be very good as freshmen. Then become stars as sophomores and juniors.
That is why some on here says it takes time to build a program. Unfortunately, your not going to hit on every kid you recruit, some will never become big time talent even in their senior years.
GO BIG BLUE!!!
A cheater is going to get busted and a superstar is going to get snatched. Stoops is kind of a best bast scenario. Making a winning team out of Kentucky in the SEC is a 10-15 year project. We need to get to the point to where a coach can leave and another good coach wants to replace him. Not be like Vandy, where Franklin takes them to greatness for a year or two and they're back to bottom feeding, or Louisville that relies on crime at other schools to fill the roster.
A very good but tricky question. IDK. But to even take a stab at it I would have to first ask: "What is the standard for having built the program and who are some examples of same".
Peace
For the sake of discussion I’m thinking something along the lines of what Bill Snyder did at Kansas State or what Frank Beamer did at Virginia Tech. Maybe even what Barry Alvarez did at Wisconsin. I’m assuming these were built the right way. Compared to where they were, they’ve demonstrated some staying power to varying degrees.
Not being a one-year wonder. Backing up a good year with several more. I.e. Rich Brooks.
Agreed, the short answer is not to cut corners. Such as...
Relying on Juco’s to build a program (hit and miss and only here 2 years) academic risks, morale risks, and doing anything that might get you handed penalties that could devastate what you are trying to build.
Retention, training, no juice, nutrition, yada yada...
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OK, all good calls. We got something to talk about now. I'm sure every school has had occasional "player problems". My definition of "doing it the right way" is not getting hit with any serious NCAA penalties.
Snyder/KSU (1989-2005; 2009-Now): IMO, the greatest building job ever. I think KSU had like 1 winning season in the previous 20 or 25 years when Snyder took over. The 2 things that jump out here are he scheduled absolute wins in the OOC games and leaned very heavily on the JUCO system. On the latter point, KS has a pretty good JC system so they could follow the JUCO programs pretty closely. The other big in state school was a basketball power just like UK and, for whatever reasons, never really went in for Big 8 football. Snyder won early and never really stopped. This guy is just a damn good coach that knows how to practice and prep a football team.
KSU was hit with some NCAA minor penalties in 1999
Beamer/VPI (1987-2015): I'm not going to "research this again" but, IIRC, VPI was pretty damn good under Beamer's predecessor but got hit with some penalties that resulted in his ouster. Beamer had a pretty rough go his first 5 or 6 years at Tech. I think they played as an independent early in his career but took off and never looked back after a couple of years in the Big East. Aside from developing a great defensive identity with long time DC Bud Foster I think Beamer was first to figure out that HS football in VA was pretty good, especially in the VA Beach/Tidewater areas. Maybe VA's ACC membership kept them thinking more about basketball than football further opening the door for VPI? IDK.
To my knowledge no NCAA penalties during Beamer's tenure
Alvarez/WI (1990-2005): Good call. I had forgotten about his work at WI. He took over a pretty bad program and had 4 losing seasons before going 10-1-1 with a Rose Bowl win in his 5th year. Only 2 losing seasons in the next 12. I really don't know how he did it but it sure as Hell worked. I'm not sure I can "characterize" what Alvarez did to build the program but I always think of WI football as BIG RBs running behind VERY BIG OLs.
WI was hit with some NCAA minor penalties in 2001
Probably the only common denominator is these guys proved to be very good coaches.
Peace
Good synopsis. I like what you said about Bill Snyder. The younger fans will not remember just how bad that program had been for a LONG time. K-State made UK look like Alabama. IIRC they were 3-40-1 in the four years prior to him taking over as coach and had won like five bowl games in seventy years. They were a joke. Like you said, he’s just a damn good football coach. I guess there a lot of “right ways” if you find one of those. I hope we have one.
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