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Should Cason Wallace start at PG over Sahvir Wheeler?

Without reading the comments I'm sure most people said yes. I think it's better with both on the floor. If Wheeler starts doing stupid crap set him on the bench.
 
So many coaches posting today. Just wondering how many of you actually coach basketball teams? I know Gromcat or Morg or whatever name he’s using today isn’t one. So if you’re a coach, please share your credentials with everyone. How many years have you coached? Where have you coached? Wins vs Loses? Who did you study under? Why aren’t you still coaching? Did you get fired? If so, why? After reading all the post it appears a lot of you have coaching experience, so please share your resume with us. This is your opportunity to gain more respect from the board, so when you post something everyone will stop what they’re doing and focus on you.
 
I am 100% in the belief that Wheeler is the problem with us grooving an offense that gels. He always plays like this is a pickup game. I'm fine with him coming in to use his speed to change tempo for ten minutes. but with him running point we're gonna always like like 5 guys who got picked from the crowd at Rucker park. (I'm a Cal guy but I do think he should realize this and fix it)
 
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It’s hard to understand how anyone could, at this point, argue in favor of wheeler running point with Wallace on this roster.

Most of us said it before the season started. Wheeler is a role guy with a great skill that can help when it’s needed. He shouldn’t be running the team and he shouldn’t be getting most minutes anywhere let alone PG. And I don’t need a statistic to know it, I watch the games.
^^^This X 100.
It’s absolutely, positively OBVIOUS to anyone with any knowledge of how an offense “should run”, that Savir Wheeler is NOT the best equipped on this roster to do so.

He should be nothing more than a “spot player” for foul trouble issues and possibly when the opposing team is pressing a lot - that’s IT.

For those that “take up for” Wheeler, start watching our possessions in the half court. If Wheeler has the ball when the shot clock reaches 10, which he does most of the time unfortunately, our scoring % on those possessions will be about 10-15% max. Those possessions most always end in one of three scenarios: a turnover; a wild crazy shot at the rim by Wheeler; an off balanced, rushed shot by whoever gets a pass from Wheeler at the very last second.

How it’s even still debated on here is amazing. There’s been debate on who Cal plays for years with the Twins, Quade Green, Briscoe, etc, but none are even close to as bad as this Wheeler fiasco has become. This team will absolutely go nowhere this season unless Wheeler is benched and the keys are given fully to Cason Wallace and, unfortunately, based on Cal’s previous handling of similar situations, that’s not going to happen.
 
So many coaches posting today. Just wondering how many of you actually coach basketball teams? I know Gromcat or Morg or whatever name he’s using today isn’t one. So if you’re a coach, please share your credentials with everyone. How many years have you coached? Where have you coached? Wins vs Loses? Who did you study under? Why aren’t you still coaching? Did you get fired? If so, why? After reading all the post it appears a lot of you have coaching experience, so please share your resume with us. This is your opportunity to gain more respect from the board, so when you post something everyone will stop what they’re doing and focus on you.
I have coached at the HS level (assistant) and coached Junior Pro for several years. I have studied the game, I have been to coaching clinics with Hubie Brown, Abe Lemons and Tubby Smith among others. I have been to UK practices (Tubby Smith years). I think I am fairly knowledgeable. I also believe that the really solid posters on this board are also very knowledgeable about the game, whether they coach or not.
 
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I have coached at the HS level (assistant) and coached Junior Pro for several years. I have studied the game, I have been to coaching clinics with Hubie Brown, Abe Lemons and Tubby Smith among others. I have been to UK practices (Tubby Smith years). I think I am fairly knowledgeable. I also believe that the really solid posters on this board are also very knowledgeable about the game, whether they coach or not.
Impressive you are. How many years did you coach in high school and where? How many Junior Pro and where. How many practices did you attend when Tubby was coaching? What years did you coach? How many solid posters do you believe post on Hob and RR? I’ve been watching UK basketball since 1966, and I love all things UK. I’ve never coached anywhere and I’m just a dedicated UK fan. Been posting here several years and prior to joining RR, I read Cats-pause for years. I’d guess we have 5 to 6 people posting that are really knowledgeable of the game of basketball. We have a lot more people that have a lot of knowledge about football. Most are like me and just love reading others post. I‘ve played the game, but was not very good. I was a really good baseball player, but never played after graduating from high school.
 
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I think he should be the primary point guard and get the most minutes, but Wheeler sets a pace that Wallace just can't. So really I think you start Wheeler to establish the tone of the game.
 
So many coaches posting today. Just wondering how many of you actually coach basketball teams? I know Gromcat or Morg or whatever name he’s using today isn’t one. So if you’re a coach, please share your credentials with everyone. How many years have you coached? Where have you coached? Wins vs Loses? Who did you study under? Why aren’t you still coaching? Did you get fired? If so, why? After reading all the post it appears a lot of you have coaching experience, so please share your resume with us. This is your opportunity to gain more respect from the board, so when you post something everyone will stop what they’re doing and focus on you.
This is a appeal to credential fallacy. Hopefully you can grasp the idea that just because some may not have coaching experience doesn't necessarily mean their opinion or view on something is wrong. I just wanted to point out your fallacious reasoning.
 
Impressive you are. How many years did you coach in high school and where? How many Junior Pro and where. How many practices did you attend when Tubby was coaching? What years did you coach? How many solid posters do you believe post on Hob and RR? I’ve been watching UK basketball since 1966, and I love all things UK. I’ve never coached anywhere and I’m just a dedicated UK fan. Been posting here several years and prior to joining RR, I read Cats-pause for years. I’d guess we have 5 to 6 people posting that are really knowledgeable of the game of basketball. We have a lot more people that have a lot of knowledge about football. Most are like me and just love reading others post. I‘ve played the game, but was not very good. I was a really good baseball player, but never played after graduating from high school.
Don’t really want to go into all that personal info. Nothing impressive, I can assure you.

As for other posters. There are several on here that know their stuff. Too many to name. I don’t want to leave people out.

Overall, when it comes to basketball knowledge, the long-time posters on this board are way above average, IMHO.

I don’t pay much attention to the newer posters who come here with an agenda, whether it be the “Cal is a saint” or “Cal is the devil” agenda.
 
This is an appeal to credential fallacy. Just because some may not have coaching experience doesn't mean their opinion or view on something is wrong. I just wanted to point out your fallacious reasoning.
This is true. And I pointed this out in my post.

But if someone wants to know a little bit about me, I don’t care to share.

I really didn’t read his question as an agenda post. I took it as genuine curiosity.
 
Ocornett needs to get some help for whatever his problems are.

My father was a basketball coach, I coached high school baseball and football for a while after college. I also played college baseball.

All things Ocornett has never done and never will. For the record, he would bat 0-0 .000 against me. I’d throw it straight between his eyes. You can have first.
 
Cason Wallace is a difference maker and pretty clearly the 2nd best player on our basketball team behind Oscar Tshiebwe. Wallace is an excellent defender, and he scores effectively from all three levels.

Sahvir Wheeler overdribbles into double teams and will never be an effective perimeter shooter. He isn't a bad player, but he is a ball hog. Wheeler is not one of the 5 best players on our team. Wheeler can be exploited on both ends of the floor by athletic opponents with length and a smart coach.

Any scheme in which Wheeler is taking 2x or 3x as many shots as Wallace from the floor is a bad game plan that leads to a suboptimal performance. Against MI in the London game, Wallace took 4 shots from the floor (and hit 2 of those) while Wheeler took 14 shots (and hit 5). Wheeler, who does not shoot well, cannot be among the most frequent shooters. That was part of the reason why the UK-MI game was close when it really shouldn't have been.

For UK to be an effective basketball team in the postseason, Wallace has to be taking 10-15 shots from the floor a game. If that can't be made to happen with Wheeler starting, then Wheeler should not be starting.
 
This is a appeal to credential fallacy. Hopefully you can grasp the idea that just because some may not have coaching experience doesn't necessarily mean their opinion or view on something is wrong. I just wanted to point out your fallacious reasoning.
I wasn’t trying to be fallacious, I was asking the guy a few questions, because I thought his post was interesting. It’s really getting difficult to post anything anymore without someone assuming it‘s, as you say Fallacious. Sad to say, that’s what our country as turned into these days. Sad but true. It appears you believe you know posters intentions when they post or reply. Who elected you the Savior Mod and the defender of innocent posters being attacked by other posters. If that‘s your position you‘er failing miserably really. Stay in your lane and know your place.
 
Wallace doesn’t necessarily handle the pressure that gets thrown at him. I’m backing off a little. They need to play a lot together. I think to be our best, Wallace needs to play point. So, he needs to fix that. Then, yes.
Defeating defensive pressure naturally reflects on the PG but is not the sole responsibility of the PG. Wheeler is a ball hog with speed, so he looks reliable against defensive pressure. But what happens then, after the ball crosses midcourt? Wallace is not a ball hog. If Wallace has trouble at times with pressure (which IMO is less factual than is being made out here), then his teammates are supposed to go get the ball. That's basic basketball. But while Wallace does not have the straight ahead speed of Wheeler, Wallace has a much more productive understanding about what to do with the basketball after he crosses midcourt. And Wallace also defends at the point much more effectively than Wheeler does.

Under no circumstances should Sahvir Wheeler be taking >10 shots a game for this team when that cuts into the opportunity for Tshiebwe, Wallace, and Reeves to shoot and score in our offense.

Does anyone actually believe this team can beat ranked opponents by scoring 60-70 points a game? Get the basketball into our best shooters' hands. Wheeler is a poor shooter and a ball hog.
 
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So let’s ignore assists, defense, TO and everything else to pick the best point guard. The hottest shooter is NOT the best player. Dohhh!!!!!
Just out of curiosity I'll ask ... How can one "pick the best point guard" without considering assists and turnovers ? (And of course -- also setting aside defense ... there's the fact that Wheeler can't shoot it into the ocean !)
 
Also comparing a Freshman to a 3 year vet. Yet the turnovers are comparable.

When we compare the two, it’s not really fair, because Wallace has 9 games experience compared to Wheeler’s three years.

Wallace needs the ball. He needs to play through mistakes. He needs experience. Wheeler already has experience. Let’s have two experienced PGs by March.
One turns the ball over by being overly aggressive which is how his coach wants the game played to compensate for no offensive and the other one just turns the ball over passing the ball around the perimeter. I prefer the one who is playing up tempo attacking the goal.
 
I just think, like most things in life, it's not really that simple. Wheeler does some things quite well. His speed and ability to attack the defense are a plus. It can often lead to easy shots for us early in the shot clock on offense. It's when it doesn't, that he can become a liability (leading to him taking bad outside shots towards the end of a shot clock or turning the ball over trying to make a play near the end of the shot clock). That's why I'd like to maximize his potential and have him defer to Wallace later in the shot clock. I'm not saying it will ever happen but that would be my ideal usage of him.

Otherwise, if you take Wheeler off the court, you have to put someone else in. Who are you having on the court instead of him? Wallace and Reeves, sure. But who is that third guy? Fredrick has many issues of his own right now. Don't think we really want either Toppin or Livingston at the 3.
Adou Thiero
 
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there is only one metric

we're failing with Wheeler as our point guard.

We're not playing the season to be a .750 team, get a bye in the SEC tourney and get to the round of 32 in the tournament.

But that is our ceiling at the moment.

You want to say that isn't on Wheeler, we can have that discussion. But at the end of the day the PG is the QB of the team, a team can win without a center, a team can win without a wing. A team can't win without a PG.
 
We dont really have a good point guard on the team thats Cows fault he should have recruited one or found one in the tranfer portal.
 
It’s hard to understand how anyone could, at this point, argue in favor of wheeler running point with Wallace on this roster.

Most of us said it before the season started. Wheeler is a role guy with a great skill that can help when it’s needed. He shouldn’t be running the team and he shouldn’t be getting most minutes anywhere let alone PG. And I don’t need a statistic to know it, I watch the games.
It's about all aspects of the game, not just scoring. A line up like you want gets killed, Frederick and reeves are below average defenders.
 
Absolutely! Wheeler to come in off the bench.
You are obviously advocating for another Cason Wallace and not the one on this team who can't get the ball past the key. There is no way Wallace should ever start at point in front of Wheeler. Even with his turnovers, this team would be even worse without him pushing the ball up the court to reduce the number of set defenses this non scoring team has to face.
 
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