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Seofblue writer says Diallo is gone

I've never understood this logic, because if we go 15-15, I can assure you we will not have 6 players drafted. And history shows that if we have 6 players drafted, we likely only lost a couple of games and ended up around an elite eight or final four.

Here is the thing, people can whine about the NBA draft all they want, but the last 8 years tells us that our season success and number of lottery picks, and even draft picks go hand in hand. In fact, there is an almost exact science to it, so much so that every Cat fan should actually hope that we get 6 players drafted with 3-4 in the lottery every year. I've posted it before, but here is the relationship between lottery players and season losses:

4 Lottos = 0-1 losses
3 Lottos = 2-3 losses
2 Lottos = 4-7 losses
1 Lottos = 8-11 losses
0 Lottos = NIT

Every team Cal has had at UK falls into this relationship. So everybody should want Diallo over Johnson, as Diallo is more likely to end up in the lottery next year. On the team right now is Knox and Vanderbilt who if they are consistent enough could be lottery. Richards and Washington would need to be surprises and really improve to reach lottery status. The problem is that it will be hard for 3-4 of the current guys to reach that. I do not think that both Washington and Vanderbilt can get there, and Richards is a crap shoot, as even though he has the measurables to get there, his skill level needs to improve big time. Diallo lessens the load for those guys a bit in terms of lottery picks, as he would be up there with Knox as most likely.


Classic example of figures don't lie, liars figure. You are comparing apples and oranges. How many of those lotto picks were guys that stayed more than one year? Diallo may get drafted and never play a game, you going to count him as well? How many on this team do you see getting drafted? How many wins did Skal contribute? And yet he got drafted.
 
Classic example of figures don't lie, liars figure. You are comparing apples and oranges. How many of those lotto picks were guys that stayed more than one year? Diallo may get drafted and never play a game, you going to count him as well? How many on this team do you see getting drafted? How many wins did Skal contribute? And yet he got drafted.

To answer you, no I would not consider Diallo a draft pick for this team, just like I didn't consider Kanter or Noel (albiet for different reasons). Facts are facts, and I didn't distort any of those. For your information, the key as I said is not just draft picks, but lottery picks. And of all of Cal's lottery picks, 2 were Juniors, 1 Sophomore, and the rest were freshmen. Not sure what class designation has, as there was no requirement that they all be freshmen, though I can't see anybody other than freshmen being able to do it next season.

And I'll ask you a very simple question, do you believe that we could go 15-15 and get 6 players drafted? I didn't say have 6 players leave, it's get 6 players drafted, and we can count them regardless of what round they are drafted in.
 
What level of play? I’ve only contended it’s possible he contributed on a smaller level within that time frame. You make it seem like I’ve argued that he’d be starting and playing 30 minutes/game.

I still think Diallo comes back. If he doesn’t, UK likely lands Johnson. I’m good either way and at the very least, UK gets another draft pick out of it (I don’t write that begrudgingly).
You want him to be at a level to contribute in the NCAA tournament, no? Or were you just wanting him to play for the sake of playing?
 
I've seen very few say that he should. But if he was going to take this route all along and do whatever he could in order to stay in the draft many of us feel he should of played last year. Last year or next year he should have played for UK. Otherwise what's the freaking point of it all?

Maybe his plan wasn't to stay in the draft, maybe he's just doing what every other person on the planet would do if they had the opportunity. He had a chance to come to UK early and get some experience playing against great players which I'm sure helped him more than playing against high school kids everyday. It's pretty simple to me, Cal took a top ten recruit early so we could lock him up and get him a head start for next year if he decides to play college basketball but Cal also knew he was the type of talent that could possibly go pro without playing a day of college ball. I think it's smart on Cal either way. You people saying he used UK and all this other nonsense are exactly why UK fans get the name we do. If it was your kid and he was a top ten recruit would you have told him not to go to UK givin the chance and practice with players of that caliber? Would you have told your kid not to go test yourself at the NBA combine?? If your kid went to the combine and got promised to be picked in the first round would you tell him to come back to school??? No you wouldn't!!!
 
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To answer you, no I would not consider Diallo a draft pick for this team, just like I didn't consider Kanter or Noel (albiet for different reasons). Facts are facts, and I didn't distort any of those. For your information, the key as I said is not just draft picks, but lottery picks. And of all of Cal's lottery picks, 2 were Juniors, 1 Sophomore, and the rest were freshmen. Not sure what class designation has, as there was no requirement that they all be freshmen, though I can't see anybody other than freshmen being able to do it next season.

And I'll ask you a very simple question, do you believe that we could go 15-15 and get 6 players drafted? I didn't say have 6 players leave, it's get 6 players drafted, and we can count them regardless of what round they are drafted in.
Drafted. Lotto. Are two different things.

Yes I believe we could go 500 and have 6 drafted as the NBA drafts as much on potential as anything else, why did Skal get drafted otherwise?
 
Drafted. Lotto. Are two different things.

Yes I believe we could go 500 and have 6 drafted as the NBA drafts as much on potential as anything else, why did Skal get drafted otherwise?

Yes Skal did get drafted, 1 of 3 players drafted off that team. Was that team above, below, or at .500?

And I'll go back to facts, UK has twice had 6 players drafted, one team went 38-2, and the other went 38-1. The split on those 12 players were 1 senior, 1 junior, 4 sophomores, and 6 freshmen, not that it has anything to do with it.
 
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Drafted. Lotto. Are two different things.

Yes I believe we could go 500 and have 6 drafted as the NBA drafts as much on potential as anything else, why did Skal get drafted otherwise?


You think Cal and KP would draft 6 Skal's in one season?

Not to mention Skal would have been very good at the 4, but we needed a 5.

Also not to mention, those returning players (that so many say we never have) played like little girls in the paint.

Had Lee and Alex stepped up who knows what could have happened.

I dont blame Cal for putting the team first forcing Skal in the post, but it wasnt going to happen, Skal is showing what he is capable of in the NBA now.


Rookie Power Rankings

2

Skal Labissiere
SACRAMENTO PF
Last week: 5

Labissiere broke out Wednesday with a 32-point, 11-rebound performance in a win over the Phoenix Suns, shooting 11 for 15 from the field and 9 for 11 from the line. There were plenty of positive signs before that, though -- he had four blocks against the Magic on Monday, eclipsing his previous career high of one and showing that he has tons of upside on both ends. It appears Sacramento is going to try to get him lots of minutes next to Willie Cauley-Stein before the end of the season. That should be the team’s starting front court of the future, as long as they are given the opportunity to develop properly.
 
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Maybe his plan wasn't to stay in the draft, maybe he's just doing what every other person on the planet would do if they had the opportunity. He had a chance to come to UK early and get some experience playing against great players which I'm sure helped him more than playing against high school kids everyday. It's pretty simple to me, Cal took a top ten recruit early so we could lock him up and get him a head start for next year if he decides to play college basketball but Cal also knew he was the type of talent that could possibly go pro without playing a day of college ball. I think it's smart on Cal either way. You people saying he used UK and all this other nonsense are exactly why UK fans get the name we do. If it was your kid and he was a top ten recruit would you have told him not to go to UK givin the chance and practice with players of that caliber? Would you have told your kid not to go test yourself at the NBA combine?? If your kid went to the combine and got promised to be picked in the first round would you tell him to come back to school??? No you wouldn't!!!

All of that is well and good but you didn't refute a thing I said. If he knew he was going to make a serious run at the draft he should have played last year. I would have been fine with that. He should have played last year or
Next year. Or is it just about protecting the draft stock? I'm all for kids bettering themselves. But does it have to be completely about them? Is there no love of team anymore? Maybe I'm following the wrong sport.
 
You think Cal and KP would draft 6 Skal's in one season?

Not to mention Skal would have been very good at the 4, but we needed a 5.

Also not to mention, those returning players (that so many say we never have) played like little girls in the paint.

Had Lee and Alex stepped up who knows what could have happened.

I dont blame Cal for putting the team first forcing Skal in the post, but it wasnt going to happen, Skal is showing what he is capable of in the NBA now.


Rookie Power Rankings

2

Skal Labissiere
SACRAMENTO PF
Last week: 5

Labissiere broke out Wednesday with a 32-point, 11-rebound performance in a win over the Phoenix Suns, shooting 11 for 15 from the field and 9 for 11 from the line. There were plenty of positive signs before that, though -- he had four blocks against the Magic on Monday, eclipsing his previous career high of one and showing that he has tons of upside on both ends. It appears Sacramento is going to try to get him lots of minutes next to Willie Cauley-Stein before the end of the season. That should be the team’s starting front court of the future, as long as they are given the opportunity to develop properly.

He should've benched Briscoe this season and put the team first imo.
 
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All of that is well and good but you didn't refute a thing I said. If he knew he was going to make a serious run at the draft he should have played last year. I would have been fine with that. He should have played last year or
Next year. Or is it just about protecting the draft stock? I'm all for kids bettering themselves. But does it have to be completely about them? Is there no love of team anymore? Maybe I'm following the wrong sport.
But you're assuming he came in with the expectation he was going to stay in the draft this year. That's likely not the case at all. The plan when he decided to come early was to sit out and practice the rest of this year, then test waters for feedback. Well, he tested the waters and is receiving positive feedback that he could be drafted first round this year. Of course he has to consider that, it's millions of dollars on the line. Sure he can come back and have a chance to get more next year, but when someone is dangling a million in front of you I would think you have to think long and hard about it. I know I would.
 
I've seen very few say that he should. But if he was going to take this route all along and do whatever he could in order to stay in the draft many of us feel he should of played last year. Last year or next year he should have played for UK. Otherwise what's the freaking point of it all?

And how do you know with such certainty that he knew he would go pro? By the sounds of it even he don't know and is still weighing his options but somehow you do?
 
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I think he returns.... really do! I think he's Ben Wise and really taking this process seriously and if the right opportunity came up he would go. It hasn't and he'll be back

He's lost nothing trying
 
But you're assuming he came in with the expectation he was going to stay in the draft this year. That's likely not the case at all. The plan when he decided to come early was to sit out and practice the rest of this year, then test waters for feedback. Well, he tested the waters and is receiving positive feedback that he could be drafted first round this year. Of course he has to consider that, it's millions of dollars on the line. Sure he can come back and have a chance to get more next year, but when someone is dangling a million in front of you I would think you have to think long and hard about it. I know I would.

Wonder what info he will have tomorrow that he didn't have today, yesterday,day before,2 days ago. You guys are giving him way too much rope. My opinion(everybody has one), is he never intended to play not one game. His game has huge holes in it, he knows it and did not want to show it, instead he is hoping that some NBA team will take a chance on him because he can jump and run. I wish him the best of luck and hope he realizes his dream, make a ton of money and help out his folks. I wish the young man no ill will, but I can also dislike him for how he handled this.
 
Wonder what info he will have tomorrow that he didn't have today, yesterday,day before,2 days ago. You guys are giving him way too much rope. My opinion(everybody has one), is he never intended to play not one game. His game has huge holes in it, he knows it and did not want to show it, instead he is hoping that some NBA team will take a chance on him because he can jump and run. I wish him the best of luck and hope he realizes his dream, make a ton of money and help out his folks. I wish the young man no ill will, but I can also dislike him for how he handled this.
Again, complete assumption. He was always going to test the draft, which was said by him, his previous coaches and Calipari. You can definitely choose not to listen or believe them if you don't want, but that seems pretty naive. I've never seen a college player who's game didn't have holes in it. Hell, very few NBA players have perfectly well-rounded games and skill sets. Also, he was already known as being a superb athlete with very raw skills and talent. It was also already known he wasn't a great shooter. How is he trying to hide that from NBA scouts by not playing when they are already well aware? Did you honestly not think they would want to see some of his skills and shooting during a workout? If that was the case, it would have been smarter for him to play very minimally against shittier SEC teams this year and show some growth and development. The argument he hid on the bench not to show his lack of skills and shooting is literally one of the most ignorant arguments a person can make about the situation. It was literally already known by all long before he came here.

Also, why would he need to get more information? Having information doesn't always give you an immediate answer to your questions. Sometimes you need to take the time to sit and digest the information to make the most informed and educated decision for yourself. You might go look at a house and get all the specifications, but does that mean you must make an immediate decision about purchasing it? Or would you want to think about it some and discuss it with those closest you?
 
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Wonder what info he will have tomorrow that he didn't have today, yesterday,day before,2 days ago. You guys are giving him way too much rope. My opinion(everybody has one), is he never intended to play not one game. His game has huge holes in it, he knows it and did not want to show it, instead he is hoping that some NBA team will take a chance on him because he can jump and run. I wish him the best of luck and hope he realizes his dream, make a ton of money and help out his folks. I wish the young man no ill will, but I can also dislike him for how he handled this.



How should he have handled this?

He hasnt said anything negative about UK.

He just had his last workout a few days ago and according to Zag talking to 6 different teams.

He knew what everyone was saying prior to declaring, and it wasnt positive, most likely playing at UK next season.

He was probably shocked with all the positivity early in this process and came to the decision that he is staying in for sure. Cal was saying dont show em and talking lottery... I'm sure HD was getting excited.

Then the workouts and the negativity... and now he's really unsure and is taking the last couple of days to decide.


What he could have done differently as it pertains to the combine?
 
To answer you, no I would not consider Diallo a draft pick for this team, just like I didn't consider Kanter or Noel (albiet for different reasons). Facts are facts, and I didn't distort any of those. For your information, the key as I said is not just draft picks, but lottery picks. And of all of Cal's lottery picks, 2 were Juniors, 1 Sophomore, and the rest were freshmen. Not sure what class designation has, as there was no requirement that they all be freshmen, though I can't see anybody other than freshmen being able to do it next season.

And I'll ask you a very simple question, do you believe that we could go 15-15 and get 6 players drafted? I didn't say have 6 players leave, it's get 6 players drafted, and we can count them regardless of what round they are drafted in.
How are you ignoring Noel?
 
Bryan Fonseca (Nets reporter) says on twitter that a source tells him Diallo will stay at Kentucky for another year. Hopefully it's a good source!

Geez, now Zags with the counterpunch source saying that nothing is solidified :chairshot:

They really don't want UK fans to breathe easy with this one.

 
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I've never understood this logic, because if we go 15-15, I can assure you we will not have 6 players drafted. And history shows that if we have 6 players drafted, we likely only lost a couple of games and ended up around an elite eight or final four.

Here is the thing, people can whine about the NBA draft all they want, but the last 8 years tells us that our season success and number of lottery picks, and even draft picks go hand in hand. In fact, there is an almost exact science to it, so much so that every Cat fan should actually hope that we get 6 players drafted with 3-4 in the lottery every year. I've posted it before, but here is the relationship between lottery players and season losses:

4 Lottos = 0-1 losses
3 Lottos = 2-3 losses
2 Lottos = 4-7 losses
1 Lottos = 8-11 losses
0 Lottos = NIT

Every team Cal has had at UK falls into this relationship. So everybody should want Diallo over Johnson, as Diallo is more likely to end up in the lottery next year. On the team right now is Knox and Vanderbilt who if they are consistent enough could be lottery. Richards and Washington would need to be surprises and really improve to reach lottery status. The problem is that it will be hard for 3-4 of the current guys to reach that. I do not think that both Washington and Vanderbilt can get there, and Richards is a crap shoot, as even though he has the measurables to get there, his skill level needs to improve big time. Diallo lessens the load for those guys a bit in terms of lottery picks, as he would be up there with Knox as most likely.
I've never understood this logic, because if we go 15-15, I can assure you we will not have 6 players drafted. And history shows that if we have 6 players drafted, we likely only lost a couple of games and ended up around an elite eight or final four.

Here is the thing, people can whine about the NBA draft all they want, but the last 8 years tells us that our season success and number of lottery picks, and even draft picks go hand in hand. In fact, there is an almost exact science to it, so much so that every Cat fan should actually hope that we get 6 players drafted with 3-4 in the lottery every year. I've posted it before, but here is the relationship between lottery players and season losses:

4 Lottos = 0-1 losses
3 Lottos = 2-3 losses
2 Lottos = 4-7 losses
1 Lottos = 8-11 losses
0 Lottos = NIT

Every team Cal has had at UK falls into this relationship. So everybody should want Diallo over Johnson, as Diallo is more likely to end up in the lottery next year. On the team right now is Knox and Vanderbilt who if they are consistent enough could be lottery. Richards and Washington would need to be surprises and really improve to reach lottery status. The problem is that it will be hard for 3-4 of the current guys to reach that. I do not think that both Washington and Vanderbilt can get there, and Richards is a crap shoot, as even though he has the measurables to get there, his skill level needs to improve big time. Diallo lessens the load for those guys a bit in terms of lottery picks, as he would be up there with Knox as most likely.
I'm confused. First, I don't count Kanter since he never played. I do count Noel since he played in nearly 75% of our games. Assuming we have 2 lottery picks this year then I only get your formula to work 5 of 8 seasons.

Ignoring Noel allows you to force 13 into your formula, but it doesn't really fit. But more importantly, your proportional relationship between lottery picks and success doesn't hold up. I dont pay much attention to the NBA or the draft so correct me where I'm wrong.

Year,losses,lottery picks,final game

10,3,3,EE
11,6,1,F2
12,2,2,Winner
13,12,1,NIT
14,11,1,F2
15,1,4,FF
16,9,1,Rd32
17,5,2,EE

We have made the championship game twice with only 1 going in the lottery. We won with 2 in the lottery, we made the NIT with 1 in the lottery.
 
I'm confused. First, I don't count Kanter since he never played. I do count Noel since he played in nearly 75% of our games. Assuming we have 2 lottery picks this year then I only get your formula to work 5 of 8 seasons.

Ignoring Noel allows you to force 13 into your formula, but it doesn't really fit. But more importantly, your proportional relationship between lottery picks and success doesn't hold up. I dont pay much attention to the NBA or the draft so correct me where I'm wrong.

Year,losses,lottery picks,final game

10,3,3,EE
11,6,1,F2
12,2,2,Winner
13,12,1,NIT
14,11,1,F2
15,1,4,FF
16,9,1,Rd32
17,5,2,EE

We have made the championship game twice with only 1 going in the lottery. We won with 2 in the lottery, we made the NIT with 1 in the lottery.

We most likely would not have been in the NIT if Noel played that whole season, so understandable to toss out that result.
 
I'm confused. First, I don't count Kanter since he never played. I do count Noel since he played in nearly 75% of our games. Assuming we have 2 lottery picks this year then I only get your formula to work 5 of 8 seasons.

Ignoring Noel allows you to force 13 into your formula, but it doesn't really fit. But more importantly, your proportional relationship between lottery picks and success doesn't hold up. I dont pay much attention to the NBA or the draft so correct me where I'm wrong.

Year,losses,lottery picks,final game

10,3,3,EE
11,6,1,F2
12,2,2,Winner
13,12,1,NIT
14,11,1,F2
15,1,4,FF
16,9,1,Rd32
17,5,2,EE

We have made the championship game twice with only 1 going in the lottery. We won with 2 in the lottery, we made the NIT with 1 in the lottery.

Well, 2011 lost 9 games, so that is one. And I would agree with you about Noel, if it was the last 75% that he played, but it wasnt. UK was a fringe top 25 team, with Noel, and was 4-6 to end the season without him. So I didn't force anything. And 2012 had 3 lottery picks, not 2. Davis, Gilchrist, and Jones.

Edit: Sorry, just looked it up, and Jones wasn't in the lottery, so there is one outlier.
 
Well, 2011 lost 9 games, so that is one. And I would agree with you about Noel, if it was the last 75% that he played, but it wasnt. UK was a fringe top 25 team, with Noel, and was 4-6 to end the season without him. So I didn't force anything. And 2012 had 3 lottery picks, not 2. Davis, Gilchrist, and Jones.

Jones went 18th.
 
Well, 2011 lost 9 games, so that is one. And I would agree with you about Noel, if it was the last 75% that he played, but it wasnt. UK was a fringe top 25 team, with Noel, and was 4-6 to end the season without him. So I didn't force anything. And 2012 had 3 lottery picks, not 2. Davis, Gilchrist, and Jones.

Edit: Sorry, just looked it up, and Jones wasn't in the lottery, so there is one outlier.
Yeah, I picked up the conference losses for 11. I hate doing this on my phone. But the bigger issue is actual success. There is no direct correlation.
 
Yeah, I picked up the conference losses for 11. I hate doing this on my phone. But the bigger issue is actual success. There is no direct correlation.

But there is, minus the one outlier. It probably isn't the success that many want or see, as with many fans it's all about the finish. On that point I agree. But the original post was about us going 15-15, and getting 6 players drafted. I contend that if we go 15-15, we will not get 6 players drafted.
 
But there is, minus the one outlier. It probably isn't the success that many want or see, as with many fans it's all about the finish. On that point I agree. But the original post was about us going 15-15, and getting 6 players drafted. I contend that if we go 15-15, we will not get 6 players drafted.
Ultimately, success is how we finish. As for your theory, as losses go up fewer guys will get drafted should hold but it isn't necessarily 100%
 
Gonzo was one of the guys who bashed anyone who tried to tell people that this was the reality and now he's doubling down to try and save face and not eat crow that he was wrong.

Being a fan seems to get people to turn off their brains and try to defend things based off of emotion and ignore the evidence that would suggest you are wrong.

Diallo is a liar and it's easy to see.

- In Diallo's own words, he said Cal was under the impression he was going to play when he came. He also said that he chose not to play.
- He suggested that he wanted to focus on school and for next season with the incoming class.
- Then declares for the NBA Draft two months after saying the above quotes.

Then remember he chose to not participate in five on five scrimmages to yet again hide himself, which is why he chose not to play here. I'm supposed to believe this guy didn't have this planned all along?
Tell me more...
 
Ultimately, success is how we finish. As for your theory, as losses go up fewer guys will get drafted should hold but it isn't necessarily 100%

Well, as I originally stated, the relationship was between losses and lottery picks. And as for how the relationship works, it's a little chicken and egg routine. Ultimately, as you win, players get noticed, but it takes really good players to win.
 
You want him to be at a level to contribute in the NCAA tournament, no? Or were you just wanting him to play for the sake of playing?

Call me crazy, but I believe that most top 10 players are talented enough to contribute something positive relatively quickly.

And although I support Diallo either way, I'm a fan of watching great players play for Kentucky. Again, I know, crazy, right?
 
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Call me crazy, but I believe that most top 10 players are talented enough to contribute something positive relatively quickly.

And although I support Diallo either way, I'm a fan of watching great players play for Kentucky. Again, I know, crazy, right?
Crazy!

Well by even their accounts he helped Fox and Monk get better, so it sounds like you got your something positive there. So why all the harping?

So the past 8 years haven't brought you enough great players to be content? What about the top 5 guys that were already on the team? Seems a bit odd you needed Diallo to play to fill that void.
 
Crazy!

Well by even their accounts he helped Fox and Monk get better, so it sounds like you got your something positive there. So why all the harping?

So the past 8 years haven't brought you enough great players to be content? What about the top 5 guys that were already on the team? Seems a bit odd you needed Diallo to play to fill that void.



Actually, those who know my post history will attest to the fact that I fully embrace OAD, and have for years. I think having as many great players as possible associated with Kentucky’s program can only help. That’s why I almost always favor the new OAD over the returner, if given the choice. I don’t find much of a difference from a talent level, and it’s debatable as to whether second year returners perform better in the NCAA tournament than elite freshmen. All things being equal, send a frosh on his way to the lottery and bring in a new guy to replace him. Rinse and repeat.

I’m looking forward to Kentucky having 40+ guys in the league within the next few years (I think it can be done by 2021). It will only help future recruiting, and I was among the first who brought attention to that fact on this message board four or five years ago. Some are just now catching up when it comes to the possibilities of future Kentucky recruiting. The best days are ahead of this program, and that’s a scary proposition for opposing fans.
 
Actually, those who know my post history will attest to the fact that I fully embrace OAD, and have for years. I think having as many great players as possible associated with Kentucky’s program can only help. That’s why I almost always favor the new OAD over the returner, if given the choice. I don’t find much of a difference from a talent level, and it’s debatable as to whether second year returners perform better in the NCAA tournament than elite freshmen. All things being equal, send a frosh on his way to the lottery and bring in a new guy to replace him. Rinse and repeat.

I’m looking forward to Kentucky having 40+ guys in the league within the next few years (I think it can be done by 2021). It will only help future recruiting, and I was among the first who brought attention to that fact on this message board four or five years ago. Some are just now catching up when it comes to the possibilities of future Kentucky recruiting. The best days are ahead of this program, and that’s a scary proposition for opposing fans.



Troll....
 
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