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Marvin Bagley III, the country's No. 1 basketball recruit, could skip senior year to play for Duke o

DFTT. Got it. Got it.

Giving myself a little pep talk.
 
According to KSR there doesn't seem to be much love for UK from Bagley. Doesn't sound like UK is in the mix to me. I never count out Cal but if he plays this year I don't see him wanting to join all our crowded roster. Hope it's USC if not us..

Man, it sucks how quick the momentum can seemingly change in a recruitment. From supposedly being a leader with a kid, to him apparently not being interested.
Spoiled to complain about usually having the #1 class and never lower than #2, but man, I miss how things were the first three years Cal was here. Where recruiting was getting boring because I knew we were going to get whoever we were really going after. Haha.
 
I wonder where those rumors that UK was in the lead came from?It really sounds like the kid is totally uninterested in UK.
 
Seems to me the least amount of pressure to do that is at UK. He won't have to play 35 min a game. Best team USC has fielded for a while. Add Bagley and you dont think there will be pressure at USC. Making a statement about getting to the pros quickest. That will happen at the same time no matter what school he goes to. He will be number one. He is eligible for the 18 draft no matter what. Easiest thing to do is play HS ball and dominate one more season. No the very fact he is thinking about reclassifying means he wants to be more prepared. Best place for that is UK.

No pressure at USC. It's a football school. It's on the West Coast. Students won't even realize he is on campus until February.

If USC struggles, no one out there will really care. Even with a great team around him, no one is going to pay much attention. They will be focused on what is going on with the Lakers. It's a pro basketball town.

BUT...

If he shines, he gets all the credit. If he takes them to the Final Four, he gets all the credit. It doesn't matter if he has good players around him, he is the star of the show.

He would be just another All-American at Duke or UK. If they lose, he faces major scrutiny. If they win, he is just another great player.

Now, to tell the truth, his best bet is to probably reclassify, skip college, go overseas or prep, and avoid being exposed in college. He is the number one pick, even if he never plays another minute, most likely.
 
You never can tell about recruiting.

We all thought Bamba was UK or Duke, then he goes to Texas.

Knox was Duke all the way, then came here. Murray was going to Oregon. Brown was UK or Michigan, then chose Cal-Berkley. Randle to KU. Wiggins to UK. Bam to NC State.

The recruiting gurus are just guessing, just like we are.
 
Everyone is basing this supposed disinterest in UK on the fact he has set up the first visit to Duke, then plans to visit the two local schools when he gets home.

He said himself though that the Duke visit was out of convenience. He's in SC this week at Peach Jam, plus his grandmother lives in Durham. I think they visit her every Summer as well.

I think it bodes well for Duke obviously, but this all got set up within the last two weeks while Cal was preoccupied with the U19 Team.

Duke's Fall semester starts in around a month. Within the next two weeks, if MB is serious about reclassifying, I expect well either hear a commitment or about additional scheduled visits. The fact Cal is still watching him tells me he is going to be lobbying hard for that visit.

I just hope Cal can swing getting him on campus for a visit with this current group of guys. They're all great kids and excited about playing at UK. Lot of energy and excitement around the program right now.
 
It doesn't make sense for Bagley to consider UK if he reclassifies considering the current roster. I am surprised that he isn't looking at UNC considering that they have a hole in the center for him.

Nonsense.

Like probably every school in the country he projects to a day one starter for us. Roster composition is a weird thing to focus on when discussing a player of such estimated value.
 
With Bagley, Duke has a first team All-American and are the prohibitive favorite to win it all. I hate Duke as much as anybody here but like it or not, if Marvin Bagley ends up there this season, they are an easy choice for preseason favorite.
 
Man, it sucks how quick the momentum can seemingly change in a recruitment. From supposedly being a leader with a kid, to him apparently not being interested.
Spoiled to complain about usually having the #1 class and never lower than #2, but man, I miss how things were the first three years Cal was here. Where recruiting was getting boring because I knew we were going to get whoever we were really going after. Haha.


If it was "boring" why do you miss it ?
 
You're missing the point. Seriously, not trying to be a jerk.

I'm not saying that freshmen are costing us titles. I'm not saying that freshmen are making mistakes and therefore losing championships. I'm saying that they need more help. I'm not saying throw out recruiting the top high school players. I'm not saying abandon the one and done. I'm saying you need it AND contribution from a veteran player.
No apparently your missing the point I'm saying they dont and highlighting the reason why. We will have a couple soph and a redshirt freshman Diallo who went against future lottery pros in practice everyday. We are fine we are in position to win it all more often than not. Nervs at the line because they were young isn't what cost us a game in 14. We mature by the end of the season the. Upperclassmen make the same mistakes. Like what if are experienced upperclassman Willis had of stayed with his man and was there to defend on the last second shot vs UNC we could be talking about number 10 not number 9. I have given my reasons why I disagree. What is your basis for ur argument? or is it just because that's why?
 
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Man, it sucks how quick the momentum can seemingly change in a recruitment. From supposedly being a leader with a kid, to him apparently not being interested.
Spoiled to complain about usually having the #1 class and never lower than #2, but man, I miss how things were the first three years Cal was here. Where recruiting was getting boring because I knew we were going to get whoever we were really going after. Haha.
When did it change? Oh because some biased writer says it did? Yeah might want to look at their batting percentage. Funny thing is Cal claimed they were changing how they recruited after the Bolten bs from Duke. Pay attention and see if anything actually changed or not. Because if not then we are being suckered in.

Here is what a writer sees. Omg he might re class and he is about to visit duke. A little research shows the re class story has been out a while and he already visited UK and Cal just went and watched Him. Writers say UK is crowded and Duke is loaded. Well Only coach who has proven he can make things like this work is Cal. cal preaches position less ball and there is plenty of room for Bagley. A writer sees coach k wants the kid so he will go to duke. Why? If your a 6ft11 guy under K ur gonna get planted in the paint. K excels with hybrid 3/4 type guys. Cal excels with hyprid 4/5 type kids which is what Bagley is. Since Bolten name one kid Cal really wanted he didn't just take from K. Knox was a statement. Even Dukes guys were shocked. Only one not shocked was Cal
 
It doesn't make sense for Bagley to consider UK if he reclassifies considering the current roster. I am surprised that he isn't looking at UNC considering that they have a hole in the center for him.
I do agree with this. I never have thought Bagely would leave the west coast though so the Duke talk doesn't worry me in the least. He ain't coming to Uk or Duke regardless . But I could care less really as we will add guys like Zion and Reddish who are almost as good as him and I kinda think Zion is just as good . Different type of player but insane none the less. But our roster next season as zero need for PF which Bagley is .
 
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No apparently your missing the point I'm saying they dont and highlighting the reason why. We will have a couple soph and a redshirt freshman Diallo who went against future lottery pros in practice everyday. We are fine we are in position to win it all more often than not. Nervs at the line because they were young isn't what cost us a game in 14. We mature by the end of the season the. Upperclassmen make the same mistakes. Like what if are experienced upperclassman Willis had of stayed with his man and was there to defend on the last second shot vs UNC we could be talking about number 10 not number 9. I have given my reasons why I disagree. What is your basis for ur argument? or is it just because that's why?

What is my reasoning for the importance of having an upperclassmen contribution? Simple: no team has ever won the national title without it. ITS NEVER HAPPENED. Yet you keep acting like I'm the ignorant one. It's amazing really. Like I have some incredibly crazy theory.

You're sitting here trying to tell me how stupid I am for wanting an upperclassmen contribution. You literally have zero argument. All you've come up with is, "we almost won it in 2014". And you're exactly right. We ALMOST won it
 
I like these kind of threads, sans the obvious troll.

I have no idea where Bagley will end up, he gets his minutes at any school he goes to, period. He's that good.

I "liked" a post from morgousky on page 2 because, by and large, I agree with his premise that with the teams Cal constructs, having a truly elite player on each year's team would be an obvious boon in the team's chances at bringing home a NC. I agree with this premise mainly because of the fact that our teams aren't built to allow very skilled upper classmen to hang around.

By and large I've stopped following recruiting very closely simply because NOBODY knows anything about the recruits and their plans; everything is a guess. The "crystal ball" is a joke.

Like nearly all of us, I've learned to sit back, relax, and let Cal work his magic. I fully realize we're living in the middle of a truly wondrous time in the glorious history of UK basketball, and I love it.

God help the coach that follows Cal; maybe he, along with UK, will allow Cal to be cloned if we can get the science down pat. :)

Peace. WW.
 
No pressure at USC. It's a football school. It's on the West Coast. Students won't even realize he is on campus until February.

If USC struggles, no one out there will really care. Even with a great team around him, no one is going to pay much attention. They will be focused on what is going on with the Lakers. It's a pro basketball town.

BUT...

If he shines, he gets all the credit. If he takes them to the Final Four, he gets all the credit. It doesn't matter if he has good players around him, he is the star of the show.

He would be just another All-American at Duke or UK. If they lose, he faces major scrutiny. If they win, he is just another great player.

Now, to tell the truth, his best bet is to probably reclassify, skip college, go overseas or prep, and avoid being exposed in college. He is the number one pick, even if he never plays another minute, most likely.
Then why not just stay in prep school and have no pressure and still go 1? If thats what its about? Their has been no credible info saying this kid is like that other than what Ben Simmons did. i understand your thinking your a long time poster whose fandom is above reproach. better to be pessimistic and then hopefully presently surprised. I am not sure we get Bagley but I have watched this Merry go round to much lately not to know that after Bolden Cal changed some things in recruiting to keep the negative recruiters out of the mix. We all know Capel had bolden slow play us. If we had of known Bolden was going elsewhere and we had of gone all in for Allen or talked Lee into staying we cut down the nets this past season. You add an athletic shot blocker to this past seasons roster we would have been freaking scary. Cal said he was gonna take care of that kinda negative recruiting. I believe that is why the gurus are batting such a terrible percentage in regards to predicting UK recruits. He feels like he has a guy locked up. while I dont think he has them put out negative info I think he tells em to just be quiet. I see nothing about Bagley's recruitment that could change how he feels about us.

with the silence a lot of assumptions take hold. People see Bagley not on the U19 team well they just assume Cal didn't invite him so he must be sour on UK. Seems to me based on the rumor Bamba was told Bagley might reclass that Cal knew Bagley would be working towards reclassifying and couldn't play on the U19 Team. Makes perfect sense. If that is the case that means Cal has been aware of a possible re class be for everyone else.
 
No apparently your missing the point I'm saying they dont and highlighting the reason why. We will have a couple soph and a redshirt freshman Diallo who went against future lottery pros in practice everyday. We are fine we are in position to win it all more often than not. Nervs at the line because they were young isn't what cost us a game in 14. We mature by the end of the season the. Upperclassmen make the same mistakes. Like what if are experienced upperclassman Willis had of stayed with his man and was there to defend on the last second shot vs UNC we could be talking about number 10 not number 9. I have given my reasons why I disagree. What is your basis for ur argument? or is it just because that's why?
I just got done watching the Sweet 16 game against louisville from '14, and free throws actually was what won that game for us. We hit over 80% and ul couldn't throw it in the ocean. I'm not sure what his final #'s were, but at one time in that game russ smith was 4/10.
 
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What is my reasoning for the importance of having an upperclassmen contribution? Simple: no team has ever won the national title without it. ITS NEVER HAPPENED. Yet you keep acting like I'm the ignorant one. It's amazing really. Like I have some incredibly crazy theory.

You're sitting here trying to tell me how stupid I am for wanting an upperclassmen contribution. You literally have zero argument. All you've come up with is, "we almost won it in 2014". And you're exactly right. We ALMOST won it

The problem with the argument is the same as it always is. People tend to relate things that really have no relation. Just because there are instances where the two things appear to be related, doesn't necessarily mean they are. Like every time I plan to mow the yard it rains. That doesn't mean that me planning to mow the yard actually makes it rain. They are not actually related just because there is a correlation between the two items. There is no actual evidence that freshmen are not as steady as upperclassmen.

There is a reason it hasn't been done before, because only a couple of teams have actually tried to do it. Just playing the percentages says that you are unlikely to find a team that has done it. Most teams are comprised of upperclassmen because they don't have the luxury of recruiting at a high enough level to attempt an all freshmen team capable of winning it all. It should be noted that it was also said you couldn't win it with mostly freshmen, until someone did. It was also said you couldn't do it with a freshman point guard, until it happened. All things were never done, until they were. What you are proposing is a theory, not a law. A law can be proven correct 100% of the time. A theory can't be proven correct, it has just never been proven incorrect.

The 2014 team is significant in that it was a team full of freshmen, and a few sophomores. Just to reach the championship game, they had to beat 3 teams that made the final four the year before and returned most of their respective teams. So why did our freshmen outperform those upperclassmen laden teams at the key moments if you theory holds water? The truth of the matter is, it all boils down to who makes plays and who doesn't. A freshman is no less prepared to make the plays than an upperclassman. It will happen more often with upperclassman simply because there are more upperclassmen playing in the tournament than freshmen.

I'm of the opinion that winning a title is extremely hard to do. It takes a lot of components to come together to make it happen. The age of the players is not one of the components. There are many ways by which to construct a roster, and all of them have their pros and cons. This isn't an exact science, because if it was, everybody would have it figured out.
 
The problem with the argument is the same as it always is. People tend to relate things that really have no relation. Just because there are instances where the two things appear to be related, doesn't necessarily mean they are. Like every time I plan to mow the yard it rains. That doesn't mean that me planning to mow the yard actually makes it rain. They are not actually related just because there is a correlation between the two items. There is no actual evidence that freshmen are not as steady as upperclassmen.

There is a reason it hasn't been done before, because only a couple of teams have actually tried to do it. Just playing the percentages says that you are unlikely to find a team that has done it. Most teams are comprised of upperclassmen because they don't have the luxury of recruiting at a high enough level to attempt an all freshmen team capable of winning it all. It should be noted that it was also said you couldn't win it with mostly freshmen, until someone did. It was also said you couldn't do it with a freshman point guard, until it happened. All things were never done, until they were. What you are proposing is a theory, not a law. A law can be proven correct 100% of the time. A theory can't be proven correct, it has just never been proven incorrect.

The 2014 team is significant in that it was a team full of freshmen, and a few sophomores. Just to reach the championship game, they had to beat 3 teams that made the final four the year before and returned most of their respective teams. So why did our freshmen outperform those upperclassmen laden teams at the key moments if you theory holds water? The truth of the matter is, it all boils down to who makes plays and who doesn't. A freshman is no less prepared to make the plays than an upperclassman. It will happen more often with upperclassman simply because there are more upperclassmen playing in the tournament than freshmen.

I'm of the opinion that winning a title is extremely hard to do. It takes a lot of components to come together to make it happen. The age of the players is not one of the components. There are many ways by which to construct a roster, and all of them have their pros and cons. This isn't an exact science, because if it was, everybody would have it figured out.

When you're only trolling, you don't care about valid arguments, only moving goalposts.
 
All I know (which isn't much) is that I would love to have him with Zion, Reddish, Williamson and Quickly - add Bol Bol and I'm delirious!!!

AlohaCat
 
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I'll wait and see what happens, but if we want titles with our system, players like this are nessesary. We've got to start getting legitimate top 5 guys on ghese rosters. Having the best recruiting class is great, but if its all 7-35 range it probably wont be enough if we are committed to being so young.

I don't think Cal has made many changes to his style of recruiting, but for some reason in the last 3 classes, we've only got 1 Top 5 player in the Rivals rankings, and that was Skal. Duke has had 5. I wonder what is the reason for that.
 
I don't think Cal has made many changes to his style of recruiting, but for some reason in the last 3 classes, we've only got 1 Top 5 player in the Rivals rankings, and that was Skal. Duke has had 5. I wonder what is the reason for that.
I think it's mostly a fluke. We're only talking about 15 guys (or a few extra, depending on how you want to parse the source of "top 5" ratings) and 3 years. We've seen some offbeat choices with a number of those players (Rabb and Brown to Cal, Simmons to LSU, Fultz to Washington, Porter to Mizzou, Bamba to Texas, Sexton to Alabama), and some late-risers who weren't really considered top 5 until the very end of their Senior years (Brandon Ingram, Fultz, Collin Sexton- the former 2 both cases where UK prioritized other recruits).

The practical effect has been nil- if anything, in UK's favor. What turned out to be the more effective class, Fox/Monk/Bam/Gabriel or Tatum/Giles/Jackson/Bolden? Easy answer for anyone with any objectivity, even if Duke could claim 2 top 5 guys to UK's none. And I wouldn't be surprised to see the same thing this year. You can say Carter and Duval are top 5 recruits (though Carter's final RSCI is actually 6), but would you take their class over UK's?
 
No apparently your missing the point I'm saying they dont and highlighting the reason why. We will have a couple soph and a redshirt freshman Diallo who went against future lottery pros in practice everyday. We are fine we are in position to win it all more often than not. Nervs at the line because they were young isn't what cost us a game in 14. We mature by the end of the season the. Upperclassmen make the same mistakes. Like what if are experienced upperclassman Willis had of stayed with his man and was there to defend on the last second shot vs UNC we could be talking about number 10 not number 9. I have given my reasons why I disagree. What is your basis for ur argument? or is it just because that's why?

He doesn't seem to have much of a basis for his argument.
 
Welp, Meyer is saying now that Duke is looking good for Bagley. When is that old mother ****er just gonna go on and retire?
 
Welp, Meyer is saying now that Duke is looking good for Bagley. When is that old mother ****er just gonna go on and retire?

While I agree with wanting Coach K to retire, I trust Meyer's opinion about like I trust CNN.
 
What is my reasoning for the importance of having an upperclassmen contribution? Simple: no team has ever won the national title without it. ITS NEVER HAPPENED. Yet you keep acting like I'm the ignorant one. It's amazing really. Like I have some incredibly crazy theory.

You're sitting here trying to tell me how stupid I am for wanting an upperclassmen contribution. You literally have zero argument. All you've come up with is, "we almost won it in 2014". And you're exactly right. We ALMOST won it
The thing with this argument ia that there's really no teams to make the comparison to. How many title contenders have actually played in the tournament that didn't have an upperclassmen contributor? Even in 2014, UK had a senior in Polson that played quite a bit at backup guard spots.
 
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I'm not surprised Jerry Meyer changed his tune. It was bound to happen. I think he ends up at Duke and they end up flopping (not winning it all). In 2018, they'll be replacing they're starting 5 most likely. If they don't win it all this upcoming season, 2018 will be rough for them IMO.
 
To be honest, In some instances - like this one especially - I blame Nike. I suspect there are people within Nike steering certain superstar guys to Duke. Duke just has an image that plays better with advertisers, etc. Think of the Jahlil Okafor commercials, where the fact he played for Duke was played up as a demonstration of his successes. "Brand image" was big with Bamba too.

Kentucky is still very strong with the borderline OAD guys - guys who think going to UK will give them that boost to the NBA, but we've got to start closing on Top 3-4 guys. Hopefully, Zion will break that streak.
 
To be honest, In some instances - like this one especially - I blame Nike. I suspect there are people within Nike steering certain superstar guys to Duke. Duke just has an image that plays better with advertisers, etc. Think of the Jahlil Okafor commercials, where the fact he played for Duke was played up as a demonstration of his successes. "Brand image" was big with Bamba too.

Kentucky is still very strong with the borderline OAD guys - guys who think going to UK will give them that boost to the NBA, but we've got to start closing on Top 3-4 guys. Hopefully, Zion will break that streak.

I don't want to be overly critical, because I believe it's valid that shoe companies steer kids, but do you really think Okafor is selling any shoes? :joy:
 
Man, it sucks how quick the momentum can seemingly change in a recruitment. From supposedly being a leader with a kid, to him apparently not being interested.
Spoiled to complain about usually having the #1 class and never lower than #2, but man, I miss how things were the first three years Cal was here. Where recruiting was getting boring because I knew we were going to get whoever we were really going after. Haha.
Maybe we could get Billy G back and be in on all those top level recruits he was landing.
 
I don't want to be overly critical, because I believe it's valid that shoe companies steer kids, but do you really think Okafor is selling any shoes? :joy:

I'm talking about right after he left school and it was thought he would be the No. 1 pick and a big star.
 
It should probably be pointed out that if Bagley completes his high school work by mid-October he will be eligible for the 2018 draft.

I wouldn't be at all surprised to see him go that route.
 
It should probably be pointed out that if Bagley completes his high school work by mid-October he will be eligible for the 2018 draft.

I wouldn't be at all surprised to see him go that route.

That would still allow him to play at any college for the 2017-18 season.
 
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