Fromm took over the 4th series the first game, granted it was a cupcake and not much was expected or required that game. Adding to that was having not 1 but 2 RBs drafted in the top and barring an injury a 3rd as a frosh to lean on. He was also playing behind an OL coached by one of if not the top OL coach in college football for the 2nd year. He had some advantages other first year guys don't have, so did Tua. UK doesn't have the proven depth at RB that Bama or UGA have for a young QB to lean on, but they have the starter and if Rose can continue his spring game performance it will make things much easier for a young QB to be successful. Unlike many, I don't passing yards or TDs as a standard for QB play, I think limiting turnovers and wins are more important and are alot better measuring tools than passing yards. You can pass the ball downfield going 5 for 6, throw and int on number 7, what good were the yards?
Finebaum on UK
- Thread starter BigBluePhantom
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Fromm took over the 4th series the first game, granted it was a cupcake and not much was expected or required that game. Adding to that was having not 1 but 2 RBs drafted in the top and barring an injury a 3rd as a frosh to lean on. He was also playing behind an OL coached by one of if not the top OL coach in college football for the 2nd year. He had some advantages other first year guys don't have, so did Tua. UK doesn't have the proven depth at RB that Bama or UGA have for a young QB to lean on, but they have the starter and if Rose can continue his spring game performance it will make things much easier for a young QB to be successful. Unlike many, I don't passing yards or TDs as a standard for QB play, I think limiting turnovers and wins are more important and are alot better measuring tools than passing yards. You can pass the ball downfield going 5 for 6, throw and int on number 7, what good were the yards?
I disagree, he had better talent in 16 around him than 17, and more playmkers than the 18 season has heading into it. Boom, Babet, Baker, Conrad and Snell were all on the 16 team, that's a pretty talented squad. The 17 team didn't have the WR talent or Boom, or even a solid SEC backup for Snell, King just lacks the size to be a RB in the SEC, The 18 teams appears to be more talented than the 17, but that 16 team was a talented offensive unit by anyone's standards.
We will disagree. My comment was not about offense but about TEAM. You just comment about offense.
That defense was so incredibly young. So much talent and experience from the year before gone. True sophs Jordan Jones, Edwards, Josh Allen starting. Middleton forced into a starting spot. Youth at CB. It had potential, but was inexperienced unproven talent. Two years later, we call it experienced and for good reason. It was young and unproven when SJ took over.
On O, he had experienced skilled players, except for Benny and CJ. But, that is what this year’s QB has too. Compare the OLine, WRs, RBs, and TEs to SJ’s first year. This year compares favorably.
So, as a TEAM, there is little question that I am correct.
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We were talking about inexperience at QB so I went with offensive players. But on the other side, how many started as frosh? or played a good bit as frosh? Players improve much more from year 1 to year 2 than from year 2 to year 4 if under the same coaching staff. All I see posted here is how bad the defense was last season, not my opinion but the opinion of many UK fans. But if you go by the stats they ranked 91 in total defense, 10 spots below UT. rushing defense was 78th and 102 passing yards allowed.but tied for 44th in number of sacks. Many of those returning starters will be sr, I would think younger players passing some of those starters would be reason to be optimistic than having all the starters returning. It does happen, but not very often that players make big strides from year 3 to year 4.
I don't think UK is going to slide back, but the talent level on the O side is near what it was last season and not where it was in 16, and on the D side is very near the same as it has been the last 3 years, but more experienced.
Dude, you try so hard when you are wrong about something or misperceive a commment to make yourself appear correct. I am not participating in one of these 10 post banters about the definition of “is” that you seem to repeatedly have with others. I made an overall comment about QB play and the fact that many teams have “unproven” QBs going into the season who do well, including UK with SJ when he first got his chance. And, as Stoops has said, SJ looked like a kid who would never play in the SEC after his first spring.
That defense was raw in 2017, having lost some real leaders and starting a bunch of newbies. The QB who takes the snaps for UK this season will have more on the field for UK than did SJ when that team in 2017 won 7 games. The fact that we have not yet seen our QB take a snap in a real game is not as relevant as the poster suggested. That was my point.
Let’s talk about the defense when SJ was at QB for the first time. Here are some players who were lost off the team from the season before: Josh Forrest, Marcus McWilson, Melvin Lewis, JD Harmon, Jabari Johnson, Regie Meant, AJ Stamps, and F. Huguenin. That represents a bunch of tackles from the season before. The returning starters? D. Ware was a regular starter and Blake McClain was a regular Nickel back. Westry and Baity split some time during the season starting and Matt Elam started, out of necessity, at sesaon’s end. The defensive starters were mostly new to that role.
Don't let Caveman get under your skin. You are 100% legit to mention Boom v.s King was a massive drop off. The same QB was dropping bombs in 2016 with Baget/Baker couldn't hit a deep shot the to save his life in 2017 without them.
On defense...there was no excuses for in 2017 to be that bad with third year starters in Jones, Baity, Westry, Edwards, Ware, Allen...not to mention Love, Elam/Pringle were Srs. The biggest question mark is not how the QB will play...but is the collection of defense players/coaches who have partaken live up a top 50 defense or be mired in the 70's or below as they have for past 3 years.
The proof will be in the pudding...I think offense for this team will be more important than defense.
Yeah. Gotcha. And peanut butter contains protein, despite everything you posted.
Just chill CC... Just giving my take on what will be the most important thing for this year's team to reach about level.
I agreed with you, and yet you still want to post. At least you are right about peanut butter.
Now I was done on this topic, you are the one who continued to post. But credit where credit is due,you know more about nutrition than football. Are you a nutritionist, or chef in real life?
This conversation would more credible if you could give examples of dietitians who have worked with the UGA football team over the years.
I like how you use the what “many UK” fans think.
Although no way a football guy like you could be wrong, I will start with that source.
Many UK fans think this year’s offensive talent is better than last year. Many think the OLine will compare to mid season of 2 years ago, as many UK fans know the shot the line took when Mosier, Toth, Ramsey and a sick Haynes were not available last year, after creating such a solid run offense in SJ’s first year. Somehow, many UK fans have listened to the coaching staff say GAA and Young are better, Stenberg is better, and believed. Many think a second year center JAckson will be better. Many think that Benny with AJ will be better than Benny alone. Many think CJ Conrad as a senior will be better than he has been the past two years. He thinks as much. Many think a second year Bowden, after a year at WR for the first time, will be better. Many think that the return of Baker will make the WR corps better than last year without him. Many who don’t know your research about the improvement of players think Tavin Richardson will be more consistent and better as a junior than soph. Many think sophs Epps and Ali will be better than their frosh versions.
In fact, if you read the posts here, many UK fans think the defense will be better. Many think a soph Bohanna will be better at NG than the true frosh of last year who displaced the two part-time starters of SJ’s first year. Many, with the coaching staff, believe a bigger Allen moved to his more natural position will be better. Many hope that a Healthy Jones is better than the one who played injured last year. Many think the depth on the DLine is better, perhaps the best in the Stoops era. Many have stated that a second year Phil Hoskins will be better than the first year soph just coming off double shoulder surgery. Some actually think Carter will be better and Middleton will return to his form of two years ago. Many have suggested a second year Lonnie Johnson will be better than the kid just coming out of Juco after playing WR in HS. Some have suggested he will be drafted. Many think Boogie may be as successful as Allen at OLB. Many think Darius West will be improved in his second full healthy season. Many thInk Kash will be as good or better than Love.
So, while I will never know as much about football as you, I know what many UK fans here are saying. I am sure that the science behind your conclusion that players don’t improve after a point is impeccable and reproducible (I wonder if Mike Edwards and Josh Allen are aware of that research), I know that two years ago, no one was talking about UK having multiple NFL prospects on defense. All I know is what many UK fans are saying now.
So, if your sourcing of many UK fans makes any sense, I will rely upon them. I don’t know what they are eating, just what they are saying.
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Thanks for the rundown, but didn't you get tired before you were done?
Seriously, I liked it, and while all of those things won't come through I think enough will for a very good season, with hopes for an outstanding one.
You do realize I said the 16 team was a more talented offense than the 17 right? Now you are trying to convince me of that very thing? IF you read the post I said the 17 defense was not very good, and in most cases players don't develop at the same rate from year 3 to year 4 in the program as they do from year 1 to year 2/ I have defended Jones multiple times on here, both his less than expected performance last year and some of the other things that went on, an elite player not playing at the level he expects himself to be playing is frustrating. As for all the other expectations, those are hopes.
Once again I said many UK fans and many isn't all or most have said the 17 defense wasn't a strong unit, research backs that up, I don't see into the future so I don't know how good the 18 unit will be. What I do know is from my experience is that the biggest improvements a player makes is early in their careers, not near the end of it. What exactly are you expecting defensively from the 18 team? Top 30, top 50, top 75?
I don't think the key to UK's defense is the new starters, but one of the older ones returning to his former form. Jordan Jones, imo, is/was by far the most complete defensive player on UK's team in 16. Him playing with basically one arm last year and trying to protect an injured shoulder led to his decrease in production and increase in frustration because he wasn't able to play at the level he expected of himself.He is UK's version of Roquan Smith, but that injury wouldn't allow him to play at that level.
You do realize that I never said anything about last year’s offense, right? It simply was not an issue related in any way to the point I was making. Not at all.
In fact the ‘18 defense being better than ‘17 was also not integral to my original point. See, you took one point from my original post which was a supportive fact, but not the emphasis and said you disagreed. And then, you had to support your position after I said you misperceived my point. Your perseverance on your desire to be right, even on a point that was not central to my premise is exhausting and suggests you have difficult grasping the big concepts when you get tangled in the minutiae.
I am not debating defensive rankings or your anecdotal belief about how teams improve.
My point remains that “unrproven” QBs can have success and be really good QBs. Forget about SJ and look at UGA last year. For a fan to say UGA’s QB would not be good because he had not yet been proven on the field of Saturday play would be wrong. And, that is not the only example of a new QB being good. So, “unproven,” by my experience is a non-factor for prediction. The new QB can be a very good QB.
Obviously, the one mistake I made above is the year. SJ’s first was the 2016-17 season.
Re Jones, totally agree. The young man had a very frustrating season in '17, hopefully '18 will be better for him and UK. I know some here were pissed by his antics last year. I like guys who are on the edge. I go back to the times when coaches bailed their players out of jail on Sat morning in time for Sat afternoon's game.
Our whole issue is this UK team being more talented than SJ 16 and 17 teams. At this point the offense is not close to proven talent on that 16 team, imo. The defense returns quite a few starters, but only 3-4 are proven. On offense Benny, Baker, Conrad, a couple OL, but overall it isn't proven to be more talented than the 16 team yet. It may or may not do that.
Fromm took over a team returning 9 starters on offense led by 2 RB drafted in the first 35 picks of the draft and a 1st round OL and returns 8 starters this season. At some point 6 of those have a good shot at being drafted. So 9 of the 11 starters from From me first team are likely to be drafted work as many as 5 having a shot at being first rounders. They were a very talented group.
