Do we eventually see this team clicking... and when?

[HagginHall1999]

I still think this team can be very good. JMHO but Calipari still seems to be tinkering. I was incredibly encouraged to see Ugonna get legit time on floor vs Michigan. Livingston need time on court. Probably out second best rebounder.

The bizarre lineup combos have to cease and desist though.

I'm also most concerned with crunch time. Cannot have Wheeler pounding the pavement burning out the last 5 minutes.

 

[Fox2monk]

Don't think we'll know a whole lot until we get into the SEC...

Cal needs to quit tinkering with crap lineups and substitution patterns...he has our chemistry in chaos.

It’s starting to get tighter, I doubt we see more than 7 guys after the next stretch of games unless it’s for foul trouble or a short breather. 7 dudes will be getting the bulk of minutes from here on out. Exactly how the Michigan games played out.

 

[Fox2monk]

If Wheeler just came in and done these things like pass the ball and tried to get his assists in which he does get dimes... Even tho I don't know how he gets wat he gets in the dime department sometimes because seems like he always looking to make a play or get a basket for himself. Forces alot of things and that's all I'm saying is he'd b better off slow down and let it come to him at certain times. But I don't hate Wheeler and I'm not in that club that just can't stand the guy but I do agree with Cowtown here that he a bonehead play waiting to happen .

I still believe Wheeler is a huge key to our play. When he plays well we play well, have for a year and a half now. Like you said he just needed to play smarter especially the last 6 minutes of a game. A lot do that is on Cal I believe because he takes away our aggression and forces him to make something out of nothing the last 8 seconds of the shot clock.

 

[Mike-McD]

And there it is. You hope we lose every game. Is there any reason to even discuss this current team with you? NOT A SINGLE, RATIONAL REASON! Thanks for your honesty. I really do appreciate that. I appreciate it much more than the ones who continue to pretend they actually still cheer for this team. Merry Christmas to you and yours, sincerely. 🙂

You think people stopped cheering for this team in a vacuum? There are diehard fans who have been around for decades who have soured on UK basketball and the ONLY reason is John Calipari and his failures. Maybe you should digest the source of the pain before lashing out at fellow fans who have simply had enough.

 

[kyjeff1]

I just want to reiterate my point above. I don't mind having a discussion of the team and possible improvements that are needed and how the team can be better and win more games when I'm talking to people who can discuss the team without turning the entire discussion into an attack on Calipari. And, perhaps more importantly, I can have an honest discussion of the team and players when I know we all want the same thing, which is for the team to do well, win games, and for the players to become their best. But it's clear from this thread that is not the case for many. At least 2 posters here want the team to lose every game. The desire for the team to lose every game and to blame Calipari for every issue clouds the judgment of many. You can't have an honest discussion or logical evaluation of the team when your bias clouds your judgment.

I will say, I do appreciate the honest admissions here. I really do. It helps me know where you're coming from and that you've ceased to be a fan of this team. You may still want the best for the program (or claim that is the case, at least) but you've checked out on this particular team. So long as I know that, I can see there is no need to discuss it with you. Sad part is, many here not only hate Calipari they're beginning to hate anyone who doesn't also hate him. This is where we are now.

So, just to be clear. I still hope we win games. Ahhhh! I can send my picture to anyone who wants to make a dart board of my face. I know, it's shameful to want the team I've cheered on my entire life to actually win games.

I'm actually going to the Yale game with my son. Should I wear Yale colors and chant "EFF Kentucky" like an Indiana fan? Should we cheer if the team scores or wins? And to think, some of you people hope the team loses that game and ruins our weekend trip. That's where we are.

Yeah, hoping for UK to lose every game, is not going to result in Cal losing his job.

Well, first of all, while he's not a good game coach, he's always going to have enough talent to win enough games to keep the real hot heat off of him, but secondly, we're not talking about a coach that has only been here a year or two, Cal can survive here for 20 years just for what he did from 09-17. So hoping for losses does us no good and damages everything that was built for 100 years.

What I don't want, is a Denny Crum situation where Cal just coasts the last 20 years of his tenure. Hopefully that won't be allowed to happen.

 

[kyjeff1]

It’s starting to get tighter, I doubt we see more than 7 guys after the next stretch of games unless it’s for foul trouble or a short breather. 7 dudes will be getting the bulk of minutes from here on out. Exactly how the Michigan games played out.

My fear is that Collins will be one of those 7, if that happens, we're screwed. Cal is really going to force that square peg I believe.

 

[kyjeff1]

I still believe Wheeler is a huge key to our play. When he plays well we play well, have for a year and a half now. Like you said he just needed to play smarter especially the last 6 minutes of a game. A lot do that is on Cal I believe because he takes away our aggression and forces him to make something out of nothing the last 8 seconds of the shot clock.

Wheeler is consistent at one thing, he's a guy that will make a bad play for every good play he makes. The stats on him are misleading, because usually those turnovers, or missed shots, lead to easy points for the opponent and so many of those bad plays happen in crunch time when they absolutely cannot happen.

The missed free throws are another thing. I mean, he was bad against Michigan and he was also bad against Saint Peters.

He tries to do way too much and since he's in year 4 of his college career, I'm really surprised to see him continue to make the mistakes he makes.

Wallace missed key free throws in the MSU game, he could have won the game twice and didn't, but he's a freshman, I believe he'll fix that, but Wheeler is a veteran player that makes way too many bad mistakes at the wrong times.

 

[CincyUKFan]

We saw the beginning stages of the clicking v Michigan as evidenced not only by the neutral court win but the 9 of 15 shooting from long range.

May God have mercy on not only Yale Sat. but on every team UK plays the rest of this season.

Troll.

 

[Sejonesy]

Clueless??? Clueless yo ass. I thought Cowtown Cat hit nail on the head. Just because some talking head gives a star out don't mean shit. Hell, did he tell how many times he got his shit blocked at the rim or how many Ill advised other things he does. Glad he good on assist to turnover ratio but he bad for bonehead to bonehead plays ratio also.

Ha! Stats don’t mean anything? Delusional is more like it

 

[CincyUKFan]

It's impossible to have a rational discussion right now on this board. It's pointless. Everything just devolves into "Cal is an idiot! Cal can't coach! Cal will just screw it up." It becomes no real discussion, just another gripe thread. But I'll give you an opinion...

I agree that this team is not what I thought it was back in the Bahamas. Once I saw what Reeves could bring and then with the way Toppin was playing and even Collins, I thought this team could be dominant, one of the best in the nation. I will say, the early injuries to Oscar and Wheeler hurt the early development. Having heard Calipari talk about how the team really doesn't put in offense in the Bahamas, it makes more sense. They were just playing man to man defense and running a couple sets on offense. Anyways, I think that's part of the problem. For Collins, the death of his father seems to have set him back significantly. He was playing with confidence and aggression in Bahamas but we haven't seen that yet.

But there is something else here that I didn't see coming. Reeves doesn't seem to deal well with physicality. And he also has backed off under pressure. He showed against Michigan that he can step up, though, so maybe he has turned a corner. Fredrick has also struggled against more athletic teams. I'm not sure that will change.

As for Toppin, he showed some signs against Michigan that he is ready to step up. Before that, he was backing down under pressure and disappeared in the big games, vs Mich St and Gonzaga. He must be a consistent player for this team to be what we thought.

I think we're still waiting on some guys- Fredrick, Collins, and Livingston- to become what we need them to be. We have seen some flashes from Onyenso which i didn't expect and could be a good addition.

The best news we've seen so far is from Cason Wallace. We knew he could become a great player as he progressed this season, and he has shown that he may be ahead of schedule.

So, what's next? I'm not sure. We need these guys who have been timid at times to step forward and be what they have the potential to be. Namely, Toppin and Reeves MUST be consistent threats every game out. We need Wallace to continue his production. We need Oscar to be Oscar. We need Wheeler to be more steady. We need Fredrick to get open and make shots.

Yale will be a challenge because of their style, which mirrors Bellarmine and Mich State. That will tell us if we're ready to step forward or not. And the next high pressure game will be UCLA at MSG. That game will tell us if we are ready for the pressure of a big game and atmosphere. The Michigan game was a step in the right direction but was still lacking consistency. Too many turnovers and dumb mistakes, too many missed free throws under pressure.

I think we will get there eventually. We're gonna have some more growing pains. I just hope we can win while growing. When we hit conference play, we'll need to take more steps ahead. I guess we'll see.

I can respond without a pure Cal bash right now.

This team, as you’ve somewhat alluded to, but still hold out what I would deem irrational hope for, simply is not very good.

Aside from Oscar, there’s no one in this roster who can be counted on to consistently perform at a high level. Cason might get there. But this is a roster mostly comprised of guys who would not be at Duke, Kansas, and other blue-bloods.

I think the mistake many on this board make is that they place blame either on Cal’s coaching or on the players. The reality is, our struggles have to do with BOTH his coaching deficiencies AND poor roster construction/lack of talent and skill.

 

[SparksCat]

What changes need to be made? Where do you see improvement is needed and what are the actual changes needed to improve?

It has to be more than just playing time.

Those of us who are fed up, fail to see any meaningful changes.

Help us understand why the team will win big games leading to the tournament and in the tournament

Also, what should we expect for this team after they improve? A 2 seed in March? 3 seed? 4 or 5 seed?

 

[kyjeff1]

We have a lot of people on this board that are great archiologists, they love to dig up old comments and present them with a smile on their face. Well, hopefully they come dig up my posts in this thread, because I firmly believe this team has everything you need to win a title.

All summer long we talked about how great this collection of players was, now, a few weeks in and we are saying they suck, but I'm telling you, they look the way they do because Cal is screwing with lineups and making them play his stupid style. Eventually they'll get it.

KU got blasted by 20 points in January on their home court last year. We hammered uNC by 28 in December. We made both programs look like ass, but they clicked at the right time and neither team had what this team has. They simply made shots.

We said all these same things in 2011 and 2014, we all said they wouldn't even make the tournament, look what hapoened.

Cal is the issue here, not the players. When they get a few more games under their belt, they will start to turn the corner. We don't want them peaking right now anyway.

 

[JonathanW]

I think we will. But not before Cal figures out his rotation, and sticks with it. And I hope it is the optimum rotation. "Sticking with it" does not mean it can't be flexible though. For example, with the way Fredrick is shooting, I like the idea of giving him, Theiro and Livingston 5 min each in the first half, and then whoever played the best can play in the 2nd half.
I also would like to see Wallace grow into by SEC play the lead PG role, with Wheeler coming in off the bench for 15-20mpg. But for those 15-20min, even if Wallace is on the floor, Wheeler running PG, because if the ball is not in his hands it really is 4 on 5, whereas if he has the ball the other team has to prevent him from penetrating.

Ideally, I would like to see:
Oscar 30 (not looking the same/right, but still most important player)
Toppin 25 (if can start making 3's, could go up to 30)
Livingston 20 (he plays hard, he rebounds, not hurt you on D)
Reeves 30 (just don't disappear at times, like has so far)
Wallace 30 (2nd most important player)
Wheeler 15 (doubt Cal drops him below 20)
Fredrick 15 (if he starts hitting, this could go up, so this assumes he making 30-38% 3's)
Theiro 10 (probably not going to happen, but he's shown enough to get a chance in games, especially when Fredrick is missing)
Onyenso 10 (if he could play w/ Oscar (?), could see occasional 15)
Collins 10 (tempted to drop to 5, and I was one saying how good he would be this year)
Ware 5 (probably <5, but vs more physical C he backup Oscar)

 

[JonathanW]

What changes need to be made? Where do you see improvement is needed and what are the actual changes needed to improve?

It has to be more than just playing time.

Those of us who are fed up, fail to see any meaningful changes.

Help us understand why the team will win big games leading to the tournament and in the tournament

Also, what should we expect for this team after they improve? A 2 seed in March? 3 seed? 4 or 5 seed?

With the 2 losses already, and our schedule, I think a 1 seed is unlikely. A 2 seed will be tough but doable. If I had to bet, I would bet on a 3 seed. Would not be surprised by a 4 seed. And I guess a 5 is possible, probably a sign of team turmoil.

 

[kyjeff1]

I think we will. But not before Cal figures out his rotation, and sticks with it. And I hope it is the optimum rotation. "Sticking with it" does not mean it can't be flexible though. For example, with the way Fredrick is shooting, I like the idea of giving him, Theiro and Livingston 5 min each in the first half, and then whoever played the best can play in the 2nd half.
I also would like to see Wallace grow into by SEC play the lead PG role, with Wheeler coming in off the bench for 15-20mpg. But for those 15-20min, even if Wallace is on the floor, Wheeler running PG, because if the ball is not in his hands it really is 4 on 5, whereas if he has the ball the other team has to prevent him from penetrating.

Ideally, I would like to see:
Oscar 30 (not looking the same/right, but still most important player)
Toppin 25 (if can start making 3's, could go up to 30)
Livingston 20 (he plays hard, he rebounds, not hurt you on D)
Reeves 30 (just don't disappear at times, like has so far)
Wallace 30 (2nd most important player)
Wheeler 15 (doubt Cal drops him below 20)
Fredrick 15 (if he starts hitting, this could go up, so this assumes he making 30-38% 3's)
Theiro 10 (probably not going to happen, but he's shown enough to get a chance in games, especially when Fredrick is missing)
Onyenso 10 (if he could play w/ Oscar (?), could see occasional 15)
Collins 10 (tempted to drop to 5, and I was one saying how good he would be this year)
Ware 5 (probably <5, but vs more physical C he backup Oscar)

Hopefully Cal figures out the rotation soon, the rest of us Bennies have known what the rotation should be since August and I'm not kidding. The rotation is obvious, but Cal can't just go to it, he has to screw around for a while first.

 

[BigBlueFan19]

Won’t matter. This team isn’t winning anything substantial. And Calipari and his fans have already said the SEC championship doesn’t matter. So that’s out.

March matters and I guess now beating a decent team in January matters. March ain’t happening as long as Wheeler plays late in games which he will.

I had to reread the thread title because I thought it said post the most idiotic thing that pops in your head, after reading your comment. Then, I looked at the name and it all made sense.

 

[Gromcat]

I had to reread the thread title because I thought it said post the most idiotic thing that pops in your head, after reading your comment. Then, I looked at the name and it all made sense.

You still support Calipari?

It’s hard to believe there’s anyone left that does. But he is a good salesman.

 

[SparksCat]

Not afraid to go on record. 4 seed is the highest we will get in my opinion. More likely a 5 seed

Since people are taking notes of individual posters, mark this and let’s rehash in March

 

[ala_kat2]

Hopefully Cal figures out the rotation soon, the rest of us Bennies have known what the rotation should be since August and I'm not kidding. The rotation is obvious, but Cal can't just go to it, he has to screw around for a while first.

Cal has too many players that he’s trying to get playing time for. We’d be better off if we only had 5 clear-cut starters and serviceable backups. But, the longer Cal tinkers with bad combinations on the floor together, the longer it will take for this team to gel. Cal is too worried about getting guys to the NBA.

 

[BigBlueManSouthCentralKY]

Cal's tone sounded as if it is going to be a while before he figures everything out. I am concerned about taking losses and hurting our seed. I still say just play your best 7-8 and be done with it. No time to pamper around with players!

 

[ala_kat2]

Stoops tone sounded as if it is going to be a while before he figures everything out. I am concerned about taking losses and hurting our seed. I still say just play your best 7-8 and be done with it. No time to pamper around with players!

Calipari will never figure things out. Just, “Go!, Run!, Beat your man off the dribble!”, all the while constantly screaming from the sideline and jerking out our best shooters when they get beat on defense due to our constant switching on D. It is what it is by now.

 

[DreadLox]

I still think this team can be very good. JMHO but Calipari still seems to be tinkering. I was incredibly encouraged to see Ugonna get legit time on floor vs Michigan. Livingston need time on court. Probably out second best rebounder.

The bizarre lineup combos have to cease and desist though.

I'm also most concerned with crunch time. Cannot have Wheeler pounding the pavement burning out the last 5 minutes.

I have no idea how you get so many players minutes without having "bizarre" combinations on the floor. And fans all have their favorite players who aren't getting significant minutes. Remember the saying about war, "No plan survives first contact with the enemy." Oscar had foul trouble. Who backs him up against a very talented 7 footer? Onyenso and Collins just got brushed away. Ware gave away lots of height. No team has an infinite number of talented players.

I think the biggest deficiency fans have as surrogate coaches is how few factors they consider important.

 

[HagginHall1999]

I have no idea how you get so many players minutes without having "bizarre" combinations on the floor. And fans all have their favorite players who aren't getting significant minutes. Remember the saying about war, "No plan survives first contact with the enemy." Oscar had foul trouble. Who backs him up against a very talented 7 footer? Onyenso and Collins just got brushed away. Ware gave away lots of height. No team has an infinite number of talented players.

I think the biggest deficiency fans have as surrogate coaches is how few factors they consider important.

I don't really think this is entirely true. There should be a time where we see:

Wheeler
Wallace
Livingston
Collins
Ware

I'm not suggesting this is easy when there is foul trouble, etc but you can look at that lineup and immediately know that scoring is going to be a MAJOR problem. I also don't agree on Ugo, I think he performed admirably against Dickinson (won't play against a much better offensive big).

Limit main rotation (use Thiero versatility a little):
- Sparingly Collins or Ware unless needed. I like Collins but he is not ready as compared to his peers. If he gets there or there is foul trouble insert him in at C or the 4 for 5-10 mins.

Starters: 15 mpg
Wheeler
Wallace
Reeves
Toppin
Oscar

Sub Pattern: 10 mpg
Wallace
CJ
Reeves
Livingston
Oscar

Sub Pattern: 5 mpg
Wheeler
CJ
Thiero
Collins
Oscar

Sub Pattern: 5 mpg
Wallace
CJ
Toppin
Livingston
Ugo

Sub Pattern: 5mpg
Wheeler
Reeves
Toppin
Livingston
Ugo

Total mins:
Wheeler- 25
Wallace- 30
Reeves- 30
Toppin- 25
Oscar- 30
CJ- 20
Livingston- 20
Ugo- 10
Thiero- 5
Collins- 5

 

[BlueThunderstruck]

One thing that is beyond obvious to me is that the team has a big confidence issue. They play in a very apprehensive manner. They don’t appear to know what to do half the time. Fredrick turns down shots for fear of missing. You just can’t play if you’re unsure of yourself and afraid. The players, other than Oscar, are afraid of contact. That’s one of the main reasons I want to see Thiero on the floor more. He brings energy and does NOT play afraid of contact. In fact he seems to like it. We just lack “dawgs” right now and I’m not sure many of the players are capable of changing. Let’s face it, a huge part of succeeding in any sport is attitude and confidence. When you play with attitude and confidence it shows. You can tell by how much fun the players seem to be having and I don’t see that now.

 

[Ima Alien]

It's impossible to have a rational discussion right now on this board. It's pointless. Everything just devolves into "Cal is an idiot! Cal can't coach! Cal will just screw it up." It becomes no real discussion, just another gripe thread. But I'll give you an opinion...
(snip)

I agree with you completely. There needs to be some kind of rule preventing extremely negative posting, bad-mouthing coaches and players, etc. Basketball is just a game. The players and coaches are fellow human beings

I know I will get attacked for this, but on the Dook board they have such a rule. This is the message from a moderator on that board:

Just a friendly reminder: please keep posts constructive. DBR has a policy against destructively negative posts and venting.

Destructively Negative. Oh, there are times when things aren't going Duke's way, and we want to discuss the loss or other less than pleasant issue. Its OK to be negative, but do so in a manner that is not destructive to the person (particularly players, staff, and their families). "Player X has to work on his rebounding" or "Player Y really has a low shooting percentage from three point range" is fine. "Player X couldn't rebound if he was the only player on the court," "Player Y jacks up nothing but airballs," "Player Z sucks and shouldn't wear a Duke uniform," "Player X won't have a place and should transfer," are all examples of Destructively Negative. We don't throw players under the bus here.

Venting. Related to Destructively Negative. If you're too emotional to post thoughtfully, don't post.

 

[IL Wildcat]

I agree with you completely. There needs to be some kind of rule preventing extremely negative posting, bad-mouthing coaches and players, etc. Basketball is just a game. The players and coaches are fellow human beings

I know I will get attacked for this, but on the Dook board they have such a rule. This is the message from a moderator on that board:

Just a friendly reminder: please keep posts constructive. DBR has a policy against destructively negative posts and venting.

Destructively Negative. Oh, there are times when things aren't going Duke's way, and we want to discuss the loss or other less than pleasant issue. Its OK to be negative, but do so in a manner that is not destructive to the person (particularly players, staff, and their families). "Player X has to work on his rebounding" or "Player Y really has a low shooting percentage from three point range" is fine. "Player X couldn't rebound if he was the only player on the court," "Player Y jacks up nothing but airballs," "Player Z sucks and shouldn't wear a Duke uniform," "Player X won't have a place and should transfer," are all examples of Destructively Negative. We don't throw players under the bus here.

Venting. Related to Destructively Negative. If you're too emotional to post thoughtfully, don't post.

Yeah, I totally agree with that policy. If there is such a policy in place here, I am not aware of it. I will say, if we had that rule, at least 1/4 of the posts on this board would have to be deleted. I've suggested this to people many times. Constructive criticism is fine. Cal sucks! Cal can't coach! Player X sucks! Player Y is hopeless! Those kinds of posts are not helpful at all. So, the question this post posed was "will this team come together? If so, when? What needs to change? Who needs to improve? How do they need to improve?" Read the answers here, though. "Cal can't coach" is not an answer. It's a destructive opinion. There are several who actually answered the question, or at least attempted to, and I appreciate that.

 

[aikenite4uk]

Just my opinion, but I think we all need to stop putting stock into the Bahama games. It’s low level competition with the main priority to get some reps in and not get anyone hurt. It’s almost one of those things that I wish wasn’t televised, because then we all get crazy from it haha

I think it all comes down to line ups and rotations. There will be games/situations where certain guys will excel and times they will look lost. It’s up to the staff to have the right pieces playing based on the opponent. Will that happen? I’m not sure, but there’s times certain guys just need to be on the bench. If feelings are hurt, so be it.

UCLA will be a good test to see what direction we can expect come SEC play. I feel the road is going be tough in league play, so got to win the games at Rupp and maybe sneak out with a couple of unexpected road wins. Really need to beat KU at Rupp, too.

Frankly, I have no idea what this team will look like come March. I do think the pieces are there, but will they all come together to put a run in? Time will tell, and we’re all going have to take it one game at a time.

Bingo re the low level games. I don't even watch them. All of our scholarship players should look good against that level of competition.

 

[aikenite4uk]

As far the OP's original question, I can see a scenario where we get better. We have two very strong pieces of the puzzle in Oscar and Wallace. That's a decent foundation but we must get better play from Toppin to reach our round of 16 potential. Toppin has some upside...heck he played better last year. He has to give us a consistent high FG % option at the forward position or we'll be lucky to be .500 in the SEC. We have to play Ugonna vs. Ware/Collins. Neither of those guys has the upside or talent of Ugonna so we might as well get him ready for SEC play.

Wheeler will get his minutes. Really no other good options at this point and he does some things well....good on the break, 3.65 assists/turnover ratio. If I were Cal, I'd tell Wheeler he HAS to shoot the wide open three if they give it to him. AND, you have to hit 30% minimum or you'll sit. If a guard can't hit at least 30% of wide open threes (45.5% EFG%) then he can't play at the D-1 level. Can't be playing 4 on 5. We'll have to go with CJ despite his obvious limitations.

 

[cornbreadnmilk]

I agree with you completely. There needs to be some kind of rule preventing extremely negative posting, bad-mouthing coaches and players, etc. Basketball is just a game. The players and coaches are fellow human beings

I know I will get attacked for this, but on the Dook board they have such a rule. This is the message from a moderator on that board:

Just a friendly reminder: please keep posts constructive. DBR has a policy against destructively negative posts and venting.

Destructively Negative. Oh, there are times when things aren't going Duke's way, and we want to discuss the loss or other less than pleasant issue. Its OK to be negative, but do so in a manner that is not destructive to the person (particularly players, staff, and their families). "Player X has to work on his rebounding" or "Player Y really has a low shooting percentage from three point range" is fine. "Player X couldn't rebound if he was the only player on the court," "Player Y jacks up nothing but airballs," "Player Z sucks and shouldn't wear a Duke uniform," "Player X won't have a place and should transfer," are all examples of Destructively Negative. We don't throw players under the bus here.

Venting. Related to Destructively Negative. If you're too emotional to post thoughtfully, don't post.

That's likely why they only have a total of 10 posters on that board.

 

[IL Wildcat]

As far the OP's original question, I can see a scenario where we get better. We have two very strong pieces of the puzzle in Oscar and Wallace. That's a decent foundation but we must get better play from Toppin to reach our round of 16 potential. Toppin has some upside...heck he played better last year. He has to give us a consistent high FG % option at the forward position or we'll be lucky to be .500 in the SEC. We have to play Ugonna vs. Ware/Collins. Neither of those guys has the upside or talent of Ugonna so we might as well get him ready for SEC play.

Wheeler will get his minutes. Really no other good options at this point and he does some things well....good on the break, 3.65 assists/turnover ratio. If I were Cal, I'd tell Wheeler he HAS to shoot the wide open three if they give it to him. AND, you have to hit 30% minimum or you'll sit. If a guard can't hit at least 30% of wide open threes (45.5% EFG%) then he can't play at the D-1 level. Can't be playing 4 on 5. We'll have to go with CJ despite his obvious limitations.

Agreed on all points. Gotta have more from Toppin. I think that is probably the biggest key right now. The next biggest key is consistency from one of our wing guards- either Fredrick or Reeves, preferably both. Oscar needs to be himself. Wheeler needs to make plays for others and make open shots. If he can't make shots, he has to sit. Wallace needs to continue doing what he's been doing and keep improving. If these things happen consistently, this team can be very good. To be great, we'll need contributions from others, like Livingston, Collins, Onyenso, or Thiero.

 

[Backer cutter]

That's likely why they only have a total of 10 posters on that board.

Yeah, great idea if you want true discussion and debate. Just Bass and Ed and a couple more. Party time! And this post would be deleted. lol. Like I would care lol.

 

[BigCat241]

For those of you who are optimistic that this team will get better, go ahead and tell us what seed we should be anticipating for the big dance.

2 seed

 

[DreadLox]

One thing that is beyond obvious to me is that the team has a big confidence issue.

Don't overlook boredom. Some of these guys are well past the age of most college players. They've seen all this before, but maybe their pro dreams have dried up, and there's a bit of going through the motions. That's the downside to taking these advanced 5 year guys, 6 year guys. They know how to play, but next year it's not going to be basketball for them, is it? They'll be off to some other kind of career. They used to call it "senioritis." Whatever the coach is saying is like one of the adults in a Peanuts TV special.

However complicated basketball may be, it's not the kind of complication that transfers to other situations. It's utility has a 94'x50' span. For a lot of them there's a March or April "Sell By" date on their skills.

 

[dl51344]

One thing that is beyond obvious to me is that the team has a big confidence issue. They play in a very apprehensive manner. They don’t appear to know what to do half the time. Fredrick turns down shots for fear of missing. You just can’t play if you’re unsure of yourself and afraid. The players, other than Oscar, are afraid of contact. That’s one of the main reasons I want to see Thiero on the floor more. He brings energy and does NOT play afraid of contact. In fact he seems to like it. We just lack “dawgs” right now and I’m not sure many of the players are capable of changing. Let’s face it, a huge part of succeeding in any sport is attitude and confidence. When you play with attitude and confidence it shows. You can tell by how much fun the players seem to be having and I don’t see that now.

Who causes that? Cal does.

 

[rivercatinfl]

But I think the talent is elite, they just look pedestrian, because they're lost and confused.

Not only that, but there's no set lineup, he's mixing up so many different lineups in these games and they don't play long enough together to gain cohesion.

Wallace, Oscar and Reeves are elite. Reeves is an elite shooter, but he has the potential to be more than just an elite shooter. CJ is also an elite shooter and his overall game is that of a + player, he's smart

Livingston has the body and athletesisn to be elite, but, he's a freshman and he needs game minutes. He's one to watch.

You know who's not elite? Wheeler, Collins and Toppin. He needs to start limiting their minutes.

I also think Ado can be elite, he makes plays, he's just not getting a chance.

I think we have more overall talent and weapons than most teams out there, problem is, we're disjointed because Cal keeps tinkering.

Good post. We will jell once Cal settles on a top 7 group of players and stays with it.
IF HE PLAYS the BEST PLAYERS!

 

[Kats meow]

They’ll start clicking when they get to the NBA.

 

[westerncat]

We will start clicking when Wallace starts at PG and Wheeler is the backup PG.

 

[Ukheadhunter]

It's impossible to have a rational discussion right now on this board. It's pointless. Everything just devolves into "Cal is an idiot! Cal can't coach! Cal will just screw it up." It becomes no real discussion, just another gripe thread. But I'll give you an opinion...

I agree that this team is not what I thought it was back in the Bahamas. Once I saw what Reeves could bring and then with the way Toppin was playing and even Collins, I thought this team could be dominant, one of the best in the nation. I will say, the early injuries to Oscar and Wheeler hurt the early development. Having heard Calipari talk about how the team really doesn't put in offense in the Bahamas, it makes more sense. They were just playing man to man defense and running a couple sets on offense. Anyways, I think that's part of the problem. For Collins, the death of his father seems to have set him back significantly. He was playing with confidence and aggression in Bahamas but we haven't seen that yet.

But there is something else here that I didn't see coming. Reeves doesn't seem to deal well with physicality. And he also has backed off under pressure. He showed against Michigan that he can step up, though, so maybe he has turned a corner. Fredrick has also struggled against more athletic teams. I'm not sure that will change.

As for Toppin, he showed some signs against Michigan that he is ready to step up. Before that, he was backing down under pressure and disappeared in the big games, vs Mich St and Gonzaga. He must be a consistent player for this team to be what we thought.

I think we're still waiting on some guys- Fredrick, Collins, and Livingston- to become what we need them to be. We have seen some flashes from Onyenso which i didn't expect and could be a good addition.

The best news we've seen so far is from Cason Wallace. We knew he could become a great player as he progressed this season, and he has shown that he may be ahead of schedule.

So, what's next? I'm not sure. We need these guys who have been timid at times to step forward and be what they have the potential to be. Namely, Toppin and Reeves MUST be consistent threats every game out. We need Wallace to continue his production. We need Oscar to be Oscar. We need Wheeler to be more steady. We need Fredrick to get open and make shots.

Yale will be a challenge because of their style, which mirrors Bellarmine and Mich State. That will tell us if we're ready to step forward or not. And the next high pressure game will be UCLA at MSG. That game will tell us if we are ready for the pressure of a big game and atmosphere. The Michigan game was a step in the right direction but was still lacking consistency. Too many turnovers and dumb mistakes, too many missed free throws under pressure.

I think we will get there eventually. We're gonna have some more growing pains. I just hope we can win while growing. When we hit conference play, we'll need to take more steps ahead. I guess we'll see.

Thank you for being a voice of reason! I am not happy with recent results either but try to not over react. The game threads are completely unreadable for me.

 

[BigRedMachineBigBlueNation]

I just want to reiterate my point above. I don't mind having a discussion of the team and possible improvements that are needed and how the team can be better and win more games when I'm talking to people who can discuss the team without turning the entire discussion into an attack on Calipari. And, perhaps more importantly, I can have an honest discussion of the team and players when I know we all want the same thing, which is for the team to do well, win games, and for the players to become their best. But it's clear from this thread that is not the case for many. At least 2 posters here want the team to lose every game. The desire for the team to lose every game and to blame Calipari for every issue clouds the judgment of many. You can't have an honest discussion or logical evaluation of the team when your bias clouds your judgment.

I will say, I do appreciate the honest admissions here. I really do. It helps me know where you're coming from and that you've ceased to be a fan of this team. You may still want the best for the program (or claim that is the case, at least) but you've checked out on this particular team. So long as I know that, I can see there is no need to discuss it with you. Sad part is, many here not only hate Calipari they're beginning to hate anyone who doesn't also hate him. This is where we are now.

So, just to be clear. I still hope we win games. Ahhhh! I can send my picture to anyone who wants to make a dart board of my face. I know, it's shameful to want the team I've cheered on my entire life to actually win games.

I'm actually going to the Yale game with my son. Should I wear Yale colors and chant "EFF Kentucky" like an Indiana fan? Should we cheer if the team scores or wins? And to think, some of you people hope the team loses that game and ruins our weekend trip. That's where we are.

The problem is every criticism of Cal
is written off as attacking him and being negative.

 

[BigRedMachineBigBlueNation]

You think people stopped cheering for this team in a vacuum? There are diehard fans who have been around for decades who have soured on UK basketball and the ONLY reason is John Calipari and his failures. Maybe you should digest the source of the pain before lashing out at fellow fans who have simply had enough.

It’s gaslighting. “Cal and (his supporters) are not the problems, it is all the negative posters who constantly (and rightfully so) criticize Cal.