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College Basketball Corruption Trial - FINAL WEEK

Canned Heat

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Dec 10, 2006
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Expected to wrap up this week,

https://sports.yahoo.com/10-things-...on-heads-crucial-final-stretch-034307130.html

1. No coaches are going to testify, and so far we haven’t heard a single voice of a coach on any of the wiretaps played in court. That’s sucked the star power out of the trial.

...


2. Does that mean the NCAA doesn’t have anything to work with here?

Everyone wants to know if the NCAA will start investigating and punishing all of these schools that have been mentioned. Make no mistake, despite no big bombshell, there are endless allegations and evidence of violations.

The NCAA now employs a system where it can take third-party evidence and apply it to infractions cases. So, when Brian Bowen Sr., for example, details something under oath at a federal trial, the NCAA can use it and doesn’t need to actually speak to Bowen Sr.

Now, will the association actually move on the myriad violations uncovered? Who knows? Conference commissioners and coaches have felt emboldened enough to claim this isn’t that big of a deal. No one of significance from college sports has bothered to show up and listen to the testimony. It’s quite possible the NCAA just throws its hands up and lets it all slide. We’ll see.

One thing worth noting, though, is that what is presented and said at trial is not all of the evidence. It’s a fraction of it. There are damning tapes out there, according to sources. And someone like Gassnola sat for hours of interviews with prosecutors and the FBI under the penalty of perjury. He may have detailed violations that don’t fit into the government’s case here, but would be of great interest to the NCAA.

3. So far, no big-name coach has been proven to be in violation of NCAA rules." data-reactid="57">3. So far, no big-name coach has been proven to be in violation of NCAA rules.

On wiretap, Dawkins and Code make it clear they don’t believe Pitino knew directly about the $100,000 scheme to pay Brian Bowen Sr. for his son to play at Louisville. It is fair in the court of public opinion to believe he should have known. “Plausible deniability,” as Code put it. There is no direct evidence, though, and it doesn’t appear any of the key participants in the deal thought he knew. Score one for Pitino.

Gassnola did tell the FBI he believed Pitino knew, but Gassnola has also proven to be a braggart. He acknowledged on the stand that he’s told others he spoke to Pitino when he hadn’t in order to seem more influential than he actually was. And on the Bowen deal, Gassnola was not intimately involved.

Gassnola has said Bill Self didn’t know what he was doing with Kansas recruits, either, namely his payments to the families of future Jayhawks Billy Preston ($89,000), Silvio De Sousa ($2,500) and target Deandre Ayton ($15,000). Again, is it fair to assume Self knew, or should have known, that when someone like Gassnola said he was going to “help,” he meant more than just talking up the program? Sure. But so far, no proof of that.

There is also no evidence Larranaga knew what was up with Adidas’ plan to steer Nassir Little to Miami via a payout that might approach $150,000. Likewise, while Arizona gets mentioned about every 15 minutes and the characters in this case believe the Wildcats are willing to pay for pretty much any available recruit out there, there are no direct ties to Sean Miller at this time.

Some assistant coaches are in trouble, though. Gassnola testified he gave former North Carolina State assistant Orlando Early $40,000, upon request from Early, to give to the family of then-recruit Dennis Smith Jr. Bowen Sr. said former Louisville assistant Kenny Johnson personally gave him $1,300. Johnson is now at La Salle. A number of other coaches at DePaul, Creighton and elsewhere were directly named also.

So far, that’s about it.

4. That doesn’t mean they should get comfortable." data-reactid="64">4. That doesn’t mean they should get comfortable.

Again, there is more evidence and wiretap conversations than are being presented. Also, this is just one trial. If the other two are conducted, some major coaches are expected to be summoned to testify by defense attorneys.

5. Louisville remains in the most precarious position." data-reactid="66">5. Louisville remains in the most precarious position.


Just nine weeks later, Bowen Sr. testified under oath, was the payment from Johnson, the associate head coach and thus second in command of the program. That would be another major violation and falls under the repeat offender clause, which can trigger huge penalties.
 
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9. What’s next?

Gassnola will finish his colorful testimony on Monday. The government is expected to call one or two more witnesses and could rest by day’s end or Tuesday at the latest. The defense will get the case after that and none of the defendants are expected to testify. Closing arguments could come as soon as Thursday.
 
Gassnola has said Bill Self didn’t know what he was doing with Kansas recruits, either, namely his payments to the families of future Jayhawks Billy Preston ($89,000), Silvio De Sousa ($2,500) and target Deandre Ayton ($15,000). Again, is it fair to assume Self knew, or should have known, that when someone like Gassnola said he was going to “help,” he meant more than just talking up the program? Sure. But so far, no proof of that.

If this was UK, media would be screaming off with Calipari’s head.
 
Gassnola has said Bill Self didn’t know what he was doing with Kansas recruits, either, namely his payments to the families of future Jayhawks Billy Preston ($89,000), Silvio De Sousa ($2,500) and target Deandre Ayton ($15,000). Again, is it fair to assume Self knew, or should have known, that when someone like Gassnola said he was going to “help,” he meant more than just talking up the program? Sure. But so far, no proof of that.

If this was UK, media would be screaming off with Calipari’s head.

Agree, national media would have already indicted, tried, and found him guilty. Espn has barely mentioned any of the court proceedings.
 
It's pretty clear, to me, that De Sousa won't be playing for Kansas much longer (and they likely vacate some games from last season).

Outside of that, I am unsure what will happen to the programs mentioned outside of KU and Louisville. Louisville could be looking at some major major major penalties.
De Sousa may not play this season but KU will worm it's way out of any other penalties.UL could take a big hit,t v ban for a year,post season for 2
 
Plausible deniability in and of itself implies the coaches knew. But avoided a trail of evidence proving knowledge. Don't need actual proof. Intentional ignorance is not a defense.
 
This is set up perfectly for the old NCAA to say "There is no proof any coaches did anything wrong," and let KU slide. Even though it's obvious what the understood arrangement was. Will the "new" NCAA that is serious about cleaning up college bball do anything? We shall see...but I won't be holding my breath.
 
Bill Self knows everything going on in his basketball program. Every damn thing. To believe that funny business/corruption occurred without his knowledge is laughable. Dude should be banned from coaching at the collegiate level for life & KU should be stripped of all wins from atleast 2008 to the present.
 
Plausible deniability in and of itself implies the coaches knew. But avoided a trail of evidence proving knowledge. Don't need actual proof. Intentional ignorance is not a defense.

I agree 100%. It doesn’t take muchbjntelligence to figure out that someone’s “help” may involve some dirty tactics. The only reason for a shoe company runner to be involved in recruiting would be to do something dirty. If he has contacts with a particular kid and deserves a “thank you” when the kid commits, you should also assume that something more than comments like “Kansas is a good program” happened and if self was just ignorant to that fact, then he shouldn’t be coaching anyway. If he’s completely unaware of dirty people doing dirty tactics to get kids to his school, then I don’t want him involved with kids in any way regardless. So don’t argue the “he knew” or “he didn’t know” because frankly, I don’t give a damn.

@Nooneputsbabyinacorner and all of your lawyer like rebuttals are a waste of time. Argue that in bed at night if that’s what it takes to get you to sleep. But you know he’s responsible the same as pitino was. You don’t have to hand money to a kid to be a guilty party. Simply having it happen multiple times underneath your watch should be guilt enough to me.
 
Plausible deniability in and of itself implies the coaches knew. But avoided a trail of evidence proving knowledge. Don't need actual proof. Intentional ignorance is not a defense.
Not only that but it's the reason the NCAA defined what lack of institutional control is. Failing to have proper controls in place will get you in more trouble than admitting to the payments. Admitting to a payment to a player is a single act. Having a system in place where you can't possibly know what's going on in your program implies systematic abuse.
 
In one sense I really hate it because this could happen somewhere else and I'd hate to see that school be punished for something that it knew nothing about.

However when it comes to some of these recruits please tell me why Cal/UK obviously knew they were being shopped around and stayed away from them. So for that reason I think coach self and others did know and should be held responsible.
 
In DeAndre Ayton's case... when you're the number the#1 player in the country and Duke nor UK offers you a scholarship then that's a huge red flag. Especially when you're begging other schools to recruit you like Ayton was.
 
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This is set up perfectly for the old NCAA to say "There is no proof any coaches did anything wrong," and let KU slide. Even though it's obvious what the understood arrangement was. Will the "new" NCAA that is serious about cleaning up college bball do anything? We shall see...but I won't be holding my breath.

If the NCAA allows Kansas to evade the rules, then every single coach who cheats from this point can just say he didn't know. That's what strict liability is all about. Stopping coaching from claiming ignorance. If a player is ineligible, he's ineligible. Doesn't matter who knew.

And the likelyhood of self NOT knowing anything about this shit while thanking Gassolla and communicating with these people is complete BS. Self just wasn't stupid and didn't leave a trail.

Kansas is what we always knew. Taking fringe players and thugs to compete.
 
Not only that but it's the reason the NCAA defined what lack of institutional control is. Failing to have proper controls in place will get you in more trouble than admitting to the payments. Admitting to a payment to a player is a single act. Having a system in place where you can't possibly know what's going on in your program implies systematic abuse.
UNCheat says hi. NCAA will do nothing to anybody except UofL, because they are not a blueblood and all the NCAA cares about are ratings and $$$$$.
 
De Sousa may not play this season but KU will worm it's way out of any other penalties.UL could take a big hit,t v ban for a year,post season for 2

That's a weak "hit". I want and expect to see more of a 2 year complete men's basketball ban, followed by 2 more years of allowed basketball, but no post season.
 
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Plausible deniability in and of itself implies the coaches knew. But avoided a trail of evidence proving knowledge. Don't need actual proof. Intentional ignorance is not a defense.
Exactly. Self has now been identified as having actual knowledge that two Adidas reps were somehow steering kids to KU. Just because he never asked how they were doing it, and may have never actually been told directly from either of these guys, doesn't mean he didn't know. How the hell else would he think these two Adidas "execs" were convincing kids to come to KU? Leg massages and kind words??
 
This is a pervasive issue. Not sure how you all can't grasp that (there are rational posters like docholiday51 and gracetoyou, among others who do).
 
I'm not sure the NCAA wants it to stop. As long as these kids can get paid under the table, the pressure is off of them to compensate them for their abilities.

The NCAA can pretend to care, pretend to stop it, assure everyone everything is better, make reform committees, say none of the coaches knew and it's all the shoe company's fault, and then sign huge extensions with the same shoe companies and keep running business as usual.
 
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Up until this point, Self has had plausible deniability, however dubious. But this new stuff basically makes this whole thing look like a charade to keep plausible deniability.
 
Exactly. Self has now been identified as having actual knowledge that two Adidas reps were somehow steering kids to KU. Just because he never asked how they were doing it, and may have never actually been told directly from either of these guys, doesn't mean he didn't know. How the hell else would he think these two Adidas "execs" were convincing kids to come to KU? Leg massages and kind words??

Oh but hey, as long as you dont ask the drug dealer how it went down, you're good to possess the weed.

Is this the logic the NCAA really wants to play? Because If they do, look out.
 
I'm not sure the NCAA wants it to stop. As long as these kids can get paid under the table, the pressure is off of them to compensate them for their abilities.

The NCAA can pretend to care, pretend to stop it, assure everyone everything is better, make reform committees, say none of the coaches knew and it's all the shoe company's fault, and then sign huge extensions with the same shoe companies and keep running business as usual.

Compensating players using NCAA funds wont do anything but take money away from universities and open up many issues with title 9. I know everyone wants to play grievance today in 2018, but it's really not that simple.

I think the NCAA is scared. They dont know what to do, social media has interfered with their practices. I think at minimum someone will be made an example out of, and they will no doubt pin the Kentucky school. We are the only state (blue blood) that they dont kind hitting. Louisville is lower than that, so of I were them I'd be scared. The elitist academics hate UK, and they run the entire system.
 
Compensating players using NCAA funds wont do anything but take money away from universities and open up many issues with title 9. I know everyone wants to play grievance today in 2018, but it's really not that simple.

I think the NCAA is scared. They dont know what to do, social media has interfered with their practices. I think at minimum someone will be made an example out of, and they will no doubt pin the Kentucky school. We are the only state (blue blood) that they dont kind hitting. Louisville is lower than that, so of I were them I'd be scared. The elitist academics hate UK, and they run the entire system.

The elitist academics don't run the system at all, or else it wouldn't be in this shape. Athletics runs the system because it's where the money comes from.

And I don't mean the NCAA pay players from the NCAA fund. I mean they don't have to deal with the issue of allowing players to make money as long as they're getting this much under the table. If that stops, a lot of these guys stop playing college sports and the product suffers and the TV dollars take a hit.
 
On Sept. 19, 2017 — three days before KU Athletics announced a 12-year contract extension with Adidas — Gassnola texted Self to tell him thank you for helping to get that extension done. Self replied via text that he was happy with Adidas and wrote “Just got to get a couple real guys.”

Gassnola responded with a text that said, “In my mind, it’s KU, Bill Self. Everyone else fall into line. Too (expletive) bad. That’s what’s right for Adidas basketball. And I know I’m right. The more you have lottery picks and you happy. That’s how it should work in my mind.” Self replied by text, “That’s how ur (sic) works. At UNC and Duke.” Gassnola answered by saying Kentucky as well. “I promise you I got this. I have never let you down. Except (Deandre). Lol. We will get it right.”

In this case, Gassnola could be referring to center Deandre Ayton. Gassnola testified Thursday that he felt he let Self down when Ayton chose Arizona instead of KU.


Read more here: https://www.kansascity.com/sports/c...of-kansas/article220042375.html#storylink=cpy
 
Those text messages show three things

That self knew impermissible help which is a benefit in itself was happening

That gassnola has it out for UK while also has loyalty and a reason to lie for Self

And third that the defense is out to show self had to know which is what I tried to tell fbiputsbabyinacorner
 
Bill Self knows everything going on in his basketball program. Every damn thing. To believe that funny business/corruption occurred without his knowledge is laughable. Dude should be banned from coaching at the collegiate level for life & KU should be stripped of all wins from atleast 2008 to the present.
Schwagg! We need you for ababypoopsinthecorner
 
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