Cal does that a lot. If a kid makes a mistake in a game then he automatically takes em out. I'll never understand that. Let them play through their mistakes.
Bryce Hopkins is right...
- Thread starter blueblood65
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I see so many on here with that opinion.
We really don't know the inner workings enough to judge.
Let me propose a scenario. Coach spends two weeks working with a player on fighting through the screen on pick and roll defense. Coach calls the player to sub into the game and says hey you're on their best shooter don't forget how we worked on the PnR defense. Guy goes in an immediately goes under a screen and the guy sinks a 3.
Is that a unreasonable yank? In my opinion, no, and since we don't know the details of what's going on it may look like he just pulls for any little mistake.
We really don't know the inner workings enough to judge.
Let me propose a scenario. Coach spends two weeks working with a player on fighting through the screen on pick and roll defense. Coach calls the player to sub into the game and says hey you're on their best shooter don't forget how we worked on the PnR defense. Guy goes in an immediately goes under a screen and the guy sinks a 3.
Is that a unreasonable yank? In my opinion, no, and since we don't know the details of what's going on it may look like he just pulls for any little mistake.
Not one person on here has taken 3 different programs to the Final Four, with two of them being irrelevant. And all we do is pretend we know more.
It still doesn't mean that you take him out for one mistake. Let's remember that Cal himself says all the time that these are human beings, not robots so it's only natural that they will make mistakes
So what. Practice is for training. Games are for performance results. Hopkins was not a good player sans LSU
2021-2022Season Stats: Hopkins
games. 28
avg minutes per game. 6.5
2fg%. 42.0
3fg%. 31.1
ft%. 53.8
reb. 1.4
asst. .3
stl. .1
to. .5
blk. .1
pf. .5
points per game avg. 2.1
these are not very good stats for Hopkins. Take out his 14 points against LSU and you can see how poor his results were as a freshman. Similar type results for all people that have left.
See: BJ Boston, Devin Askew, and of course Wheeler for examples where Cal is veeeeeeeery longsuffering.
If you take out his THIRTEEN points against LSU you also have to take out his minutes, which reduces his average minutes (if you take out his early double digit minutes against the cupcakes) to about 3 mpg, which clearly isn't enough minutes to even get into the flow of the game.
See? I can cherrypick too.
Not really. Take out the LSU points and minutes, his averages really suck. Why take out the minutes against cupcakes. He played in those games and sucked. The LSU game helped him average up his stats. I didn’t cherry-pick. I quoted total factual results and they were poor. My point is they would have been worse without the LSU game Your position is that we don’t need to look at any stats other than the LSU game. That way you can justify Hopkins being the super fresh you portray him to be for your argument.
Pure and simple:
Hopkins sucked as a freshman
Hopkins is a bash Cal point of emphasis
Got minutes, didn’t produce, got pine time
Maybe he would have gotten more minutes had he played better but he didn’t. Cal did play him in 28 games
Your position is weak
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Hopkins didn’t have some aspect’s down but cal playing him at the 3 was setting him up for failure
Playing at the 3 was better than not playing at all. Needed to shoot better. An open shot is an open shot regardless of position. FT% at 53
Other metrics not good either.
How about he stays, matures, learns, becomes a good team player and adds to the success of the team
Cal was giving him a chance to show what he had and he didn’t or couldn’t at his maturity level at the time. Didn’t add much to the success of the team overall
Everybody wants to be drafted in one year without getting some aspects of the game down 👎👎
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I don't remember anyone crying when he left. All coaches use the bench as a teaching tool. Find something else to slam Cal.
Yes it is. I guess you would let him play a crappy first half to warm up for the second half. Let him play 40 minutes hoping he might get warmed up
How many minutes do you think it would take for him to have gotten in the flow of the game?
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Cal has always shown preferential treatment to certain players (Boston, Askew, Wheeler) and a short leash to others (Juzang, Hopkins, Mulder) and he seems to make that decision very early on. Now maybe this is based on results in practice and Cal has forgotten more about basketball than I will ever know. However, as a former educator of 11 years (band/music), I do know you have to allow kids to play through mistakes in performance settings. If they're playing with a fear of failure, most often they will fail.
Hopkins needed a different type of coaching than what Cal was willing to do. It's unfortunate Cal can't seem to adjust to individuals based on their personality types because Hopkins on this team at the 4 would be a beast this year and the closest thing we've seen to Mashburn in 30 years.
Hopkins needed a different type of coaching than what Cal was willing to do. It's unfortunate Cal can't seem to adjust to individuals based on their personality types because Hopkins on this team at the 4 would be a beast this year and the closest thing we've seen to Mashburn in 30 years.
Hopkins could have had a better handle and been in better position more for sure, but playing him at the 3 with already limited spacing was putting him in a position to fail, what he is doing at providence now at the 4 spot it what could have happened here
Wow!!!! Hard to believe that Hopkins didn’t put up much better numbers given that he was given a good 3 minute run per half. Honestly doesn’t matter if he played 6.5 or 16.5 per game as according to him he never felt comfortable playing for Cal. If you ever played the game then you know exactly what he means, if you didn’t then you should probably sit this one out.
How about his level of maturity and strength is higher as a Sophomore at Providence than it was at UK. Wow. He should be playing more minutes with a loose handle and didn’t know where to be on the court. Hopkins was never going to replace Brooks and Toppin at the 4.
His option to play was at the 3. Coach put him in at the 3 based on his athletic ability. Hopkins did not perform up to his ability.
Hopkins need to be held accountable for his lack of success.
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Guess he wasn’t happy not being allowed to be a volume shooter and play his own game.
Sounds like a malcontent blaming everyone but himself for his lack of success at UK
Everyone in the game life that works/reports to someone understands what it means to adhere to directives and expectations whether one likes his or her supervisor.
Hopkins came to UK to be a OnD and wasn’t given the stage to succeed because he sucked as a freshman. I hope he is successful at Providence so he can go pro after this year
Hopkins is more sour grapes than anything else
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He wouldn’t because cal wouldn’t give him the chance to, Hopkins could have done some things better but cal could have played him at the right spot and given him the chance to prove it at that spot
It is ok to admit that both things are true.
Hopkins was mismanaged in his time at Kentucky as many others have been, but he also was not ready to step in and be the player he is now last season either.
As another poster pointed out it wouldn’t have mattered if he was here four years because he would be playing the three and look just as ineffective as Livingston has this season, but Livingston has gotten a long leash and become a little better lately.
If Livingston transfers after this season he will find himself averaging close to what Hopkins is, maybe more as a college 4.
Hopkins was mismanaged in his time at Kentucky as many others have been, but he also was not ready to step in and be the player he is now last season either.
As another poster pointed out it wouldn’t have mattered if he was here four years because he would be playing the three and look just as ineffective as Livingston has this season, but Livingston has gotten a long leash and become a little better lately.
If Livingston transfers after this season he will find himself averaging close to what Hopkins is, maybe more as a college 4.
The players you mention were not the shooters they were recruited to be. Don’t believe me? Go back and review their game by game progress.
Juzang to his credit did begin to shoot better later in the year and Cal gave him more playing time. Juzang was contributing to the team success. Had a great position for his Sophomore year, but left because he was homesick(so it was stated)
Milder got a little better as the year progressed
Hopkins, minus the LSU game, was a poor contributor.
Not every recruit that gets recruited by UK, Duke, UNC or Kansas is a happy camper with pine time.
Playing though errors and mistakes is ok in games where the outcome is not in question against the cupcakes. That is what cupcakes are for. No good manager, coach or educator will tolerate errors and mistakes that cause negative consequences for the whole business unit, team or class with repeated errors in multiple events. Continued mistakes cause a lack of confidence to develop on the part of the manager, coach or educator.
The manager probably terminates the employee, the coach benches the player and the educator probably tries to help the student get better(the stakes aren’t as high)
I agree with you that players need to work hard and earn it. And Lord knows our current culture doesn’t push that mindset, much less athletes who have tons of people in their ears.
With that said…Based upon all the things we cannot see with practice, team dynamics, etc, I’m not sure if Hopkins should or shouldn’t have played more last year.
However, I think a big part of the reason so many get frustrated with Cal is he stalks about how much more player _____ should have played this game or will be playing in the coming games only to see no change whatsoever.
And he likes to say, “Players decide who plays. Make me play you.”
Some players go out, perform, and then never see the floor. Hopkins was huge in the win against LSU last year. Cal talked him huge in the postgame and (I think) even said Hopkins was the reason they won that game. The next three games he played 5 minutes total, so Cal doesn’t even follow his own rule.
IIRC, Cal said it with Hopkins last year, he has said it about Collins this year. Seems like there is always one (or two) players a year he does this with, and I think fans and players get tired of the sales pitch.
So, Hopkins is the example this time, but it isn’t completely out of line to question Cal’s history.
Closest thing to Mashburn is so off-base Hopkins did not shoot well.
Just shot 3-14 in losing effort against Xavier. Cal is a coach that cares for his players. Hopkins didn’t perform for whatever reason. Don’t blame Cal. Hopkins had chances in the 28 games he played in. LSU game was great. Just couldn’t reproduce the effort against anyone else
I think we all take a course of action to do what we think is the best course of action that will work to our benefit. After the event, we often think of thinks we could have done in retrospect. I know I have and feel positive that you have also
During the game the coach has to make personnel issues that he thinks gives him the best chance of winning the game. I don’t think Cal wants to lose any game. Hindsight is 20/20.
Not playing could be game situations: current team playing well so don’t rock the boat. Could be matchup issues between opposing players. Could be that one successful outing(LSU) does not guarantee future success. Look at the whole season and tell me he didn’t deserve the pine time.
There are things I wish Cal would change, but I will take the bitter with the sweet.
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Neither one was attributed to Cal and any mismanagement of his programs. Got another angle bash the coach
He had a bad handle.
Shooting was suspect
Price in some fashion or it’s pine time
Hopkins had his chances
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So you wanted more minutes at the 4 for Hopkins and put Toppin or Brooks on the bench. That says it all
Hopkins stats for the season are 16.5pts, 9.1 reb, and 2 Asst per game. with FG %'s of 50/30/75.5. I agree Cal cares for all his players but how many more opportunities did Hopkins get AFTER the LSU game?
@Ark: 3 min, 0 shots
Ole MIss: 0 min.
@FL: 3 min, 1 shot
Vandy: 1 min.
Tenn: 0 min.
St. Peters: 0 min.
So after turning in his best performance of the year, he gets a total of 5 minutes the rest of the year and 1 shot. In the same stretch, Lance Ware played in every game and Topping played significant minutes despite only performing at a high level in the Vandy game. Like I implied and believe, Cal is a great coach but he has always had a longer leash for some players than others, sometimes to the detriment of the players AND the team
Playing ware usually meant he was subbed in for Oscar or we needed the height to rebound.
What is lost in all these discussion is Hopkin’s defense. I can’t remember his defense. Coach’s decisions are his decision to make. I really never cared much for Hopkins. His play against LSU was a pleasant occurrence.
Maybe and I admit I do not know, he couldn’t get in position to score in the other games. Did he score when he did play? Was he playing good defense? Was he rebounding? Was the opposing player scoring on him. A 6’7” 4 position player is usually at a height disadvantage.
Cal did not play him much for sure. That is evident, but we will never know all the reasons.
I know one thing, coaches play players they believe can help the team succeed
Hopkins did have his best game against LSU.
The rest of his 27 games were less than optimal
Same thing happened to Allen. He had two really good shooting nights against Miss State in the two games played last year. Not much in the other games. I know Cal has shown a history of not playing people if the don’t play defense. Cal will play people with subpar offense as long as the are rebounding and playing defense. Hopkins may have been in that category’s
It’s obvious you never played the game as it literally has zero to do with if you like you coach, your role, etc. Bryce did suck as a freshman, I will give you that but there was a reason. Do you think his game has improved that damn much in less than 8 months time or is it perhaps he is playing more loose and confident and within a system that fits him.
If he were still here this year we would not have the same Hopkins that providence has for those reasons.
I wanted to see it, your making assumptions about what he would have been, we never saw so how can you possibly know if he would have been good or not. And yes I wanted to see it, brooks and toppin were both to inconsistent
Hahaha ha. Now the band director knows more about coaching than Cal.
Only UK fans.
Donate Allen couldn't throw the ball in the ocean if he was in a boat the last year he was here. He showed no hustle or enthusiasm. That's not on Cal.
The same things could be said of Juzang, Hopkins and Mulder. Once they left, they most likely realized they would only get so many chances and started putting in the effort.
While I respect your position, Toppin and Brooks got us to #5 in the country and a 2 seed. We almost had a 1 seed.
One successful appearance against LSU didn’t mean he could replicate the effort going forward. Hopkins was just crappy in 27 of the other games he played in. I had not confidence in him and am sorry he left. Maybe he could have had an impact this year for us. Unfortunately, players today want to be OnD and have no patience
Cal needs to play the people he has confidence in and if they do not perform, give them a quick hook. Joe B Hall had a quick hook for sure.
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