Bitcoin and other crypto currency......

[SomeDudeCRO]

Yes, but a deflationary currency increasing in value all the time is one you don't actually want to spend and then what?

I'm also bullish on this whole thing, but for a limited time. There's a window here I think to make money before the bottom comes out. At any point the governments can come along and make their own crypto or just Jeff Bezos. Who'd want bitcoin if you could have Amazon primeos you could actually use to buy stuff? Actually buy food at Whole foods?

 

[vhcat70]

I would argue that there is intrinsic value in cryptocurrancy because if you own any, you "own" a part of a complex blockchain network, which has value. .

Why does a complex blockchain network have value? I just don't know.

 

[SomeDudeCRO]

It has value because people speculate they can store value there and then use it for good faith trust transactions.

Like now you and I assume greenbacks are worth something because of the faith we have in our government to eliminate the trust barrier you and I as strangers would have to perform a transaction between ourselves.

if that run on sentence makes sense.

 

[Deeeefense]

Why does a complex blockchain network have value? I just don't know.

It has value to the people and businesses that use it, just like the internet has value to those that use it. The more entities that use it, the more valuable it becomes.

 

[Deeeefense]

Yes, but a deflationary currency increasing in value all the time is one you don't actually want to spend and then what?

I'm also bullish on this whole thing, but for a limited time. There's a window here I think to make money before the bottom comes out. At any point the governments can come along and make their own crypto or just Jeff Bezos. Who'd want bitcoin if you could have Amazon primeos you could actually use to buy stuff? Actually buy food at Whole foods?

I agree that if Amazon mints it's own coin it could have a negative effect on bitcoin or other CCs, but Amazon may find it necessary to also accept bitcoin or bitcoin cash. There are over 1000 cryptocurrancies out there right now and while probably 98% of them are scams, there are a few that solve real world problems that have great growth possibilities.

I disagree that the bottom will fall out of CCs as a world wide currency as they are clearly superior to fiat currencies. The bottom may fall out of one as it goes out of favor but it will be replaced by others that do a better job. The bottom never fell out of the internet - so far anyway.

 

[SomeDudeCRO]

Yeah, I'm not saying the bottom will definitely fall out, just that I see many ways that it could and to some degree probably will in the very end. But some form of distributive ledger in some form of block space will emerge and be here to stay.

 

[anon_l8pbkn96tg3j6]

I've never invested in a pre-ipo company, but I'd imagine it would be a lot like the last couple of days. "Oh shit the government of India banned Uber . .. would anyone buy my shares?" meanwhile it's still something that if it gets absolutely figured out it will be a revolution. Basically if it scales, it's worth infinity, and if it doesn't it's worth zero. I feel sort of bad for those people who were early investors in Uber who had to watch the news of the last year or so and can't really cash out until IPO.

 

[NamelessOne]

One thing not being considered in the BTC craze is the fact that it's the main way to exchange Alt coins to Fiat.

If you make a killing in Ripple, Cardano, Iota, Dash, Komodo, etc...there's no way to exchange these to fiat easily. So you have to exchange it for Bitcoin and then the Bitcoin to Fiat.

As long as thats the case, bitcoin will never go anywhere.

I tried to warn you days ago. Get out while you can still salvage something.

BTC has already regained 4k since it's initial fall. Besides, I got in so early that unless it plummets to nearly nothing; I'm ok

 

[Rupp'sRunt]

Yo remember that bubble I mentioned a few weeks ago, yeah it's popping. You can buy my currency rn tho it's only worth 1,000$ a coin and it comes with an absolute no money back guarantee

 

[SomeDudeCRO]

This is going to be a more seroius correction imo... probably should pull at least some of your profits, maybe go down as low as 6-8k in the next few days before rebounding.

 

[Hankshaker]

What value is there in any fiat currency? Nothing backs up the US dollar, the federal reserve can authorize the printing of as much of it as it wants. The only thing that gives the dollar value is the acceptance and demand for it.

I'm pretty sure you just answered your own question. The universal demand and acceptance of the dollar and the U.S. government's ability to back its currency via both monetary and military policy is pretty damned valuable.

Forgive me if I (and almost everyone else) don't have the same trust or demand for blockchain gobbedly-gook.

 

[Deeeefense]

I'm pretty sure you just answered your own question. The universal demand and acceptance of the dollar and the U.S. government's ability to back its currency via both monetary and military policy is pretty damned valuable.

Forgive me if I (and almost everyone else) don't have the same trust or demand for blockchain gobbedly-gook.

I can appreciate your point, the US dollar has been a round a heck-of-a-lot longer than bit coin. However I can just say from a personal perspective, that having money that is backed by the "full faith and credit" of a government with nearly 20 trillion dollars in debt, and no way to ever pay it off, doesn't make me feel too warm about the long term value of that currency.

 

[Hankshaker]

The fact that the U.S. can manage to get itself 20 trillion (or whatever the exact number is) and NOT be a bankruptcy risk suggests very strongly to me that the U.S. is in a very unique position of strength monetarily.

The idea of a private currency outside of government control is not in any way new. It has been tried thousands of times and has always eventually failed. (Oh by the way, would you like to buy some wampum?)

All of this techno-geek enthusiasm about blockchain software revolutionizing currency and creating an untraceable and unregulated but totally secure method of exchange is nothing more than a new facade on an old idea. Are you willing to bet your nest egg on the idea that a blockchain can't be hacked? Are you willing to take a guarantee on the money you store in a cryptocurrency with the same level of comfort most people do with an FDIC guarantee on money held in a U.S. bank?

The dollar is so valuable because the U.S. government is simultaneously able to both print more dollars on demand and control interest rates on the only investment in the world that is (almost) universally considered to be risk-free: the U.S. treasury bill.

To me, cryptocurrencies are nothing more than a fancy version of paypal that is denominated and then sold to whoever the next fool is. Even if security is guaranteed, the lack of central control to the supply will always be lacking. And no one really understands what the hell bitcoin "mining" even is (even those doing it) so there will always be the problem of snake oil salesman and all other manner of fraud, magical thinking, and other nonsense.

And I ain't knocking a hustle. So huzzah to anyone making money on it. But spare me any horseshit about cryptocurrencies becoming the world's money supply or anything in the foreseeable future taking the dollar's spot as the de facto world currency (absent a world war with us on the losing side to Russia and China.)

 

[Deeeefense]

Are you willing to bet your nest egg on the idea that a blockchain can't be hacked?

Nest egg? no. 5% of my liquid networth for an opportunity to make a significant profit down the road? absolutely.
I store most of my CCs on a hard storage device that cannot be hacked because it isn't connected to anything.

There are a lot of people that share your view of CCs, and a lot of others that believe they will eventually replace fiat currencies and become the world standard of exchange. That debate will go on. I've listened to the arguments on both sides, and like predicting any future event, nothing is certain but I think the stronger arguments are on the side of the CCs proponents, which is where I've placed my bet.

Each person can make their own decision.

 

[Hankshaker]

I think a small hedge position in cryptocurrencies is entirely reasonable. As you stated, there is a chance they could magnify in importance. Also, as you stated, we are all free to do what we want (for the most part in America, at least).

Do you have a rebuttal to the Greater Fool Theory with regards to cryptocurrencies?

The more I think about it, the more I find the fact that bitcoin, etc are discussed as an investment that will increase in value to be a huge problem.

A currency is, first of all, a unit of exchange and, second of all, a way to reliably store value during the periods between exchange.

The fact that there are wide swings in the value of cryptocurrency suggests an inherent weakness in the proposition.

 

[Deeeefense]

Do you have a rebuttal to the Greater Fool Theory with regards to cryptocurrencies?

Long term if you believe that the technological advantages of cryptocurrancy will result in widespread global acceptance, then the GFT theory doesn't apply. In the meantime, a lot of technical traders will make money from the greed/fear cycles of CCs. In the last couple of months we saw a huge spike in the price of bitcoin and other CCs as people raced in like the gold rush not wanting to be left out, then the smart technical traders sensed an overbought situation and a 30% selloff occurred as they took profit. You can expect similar types of cycles in the future until CCs are accepted by the general public.

Technological revolutions almost always go through three investment cycles:

Stage 1: Early visionaries. They are the investment capitals, angel investors, entrepreneurs that put their money in an infant technology like the personal computer, the smart phone, the internet search portal, video games etc.

Stage 2: Institutional Investors see the rise of a new technology and begin pumping money into it. This topically occurred when companies like Apple, Google, and Netflix issued their initial public offerings.

Stage 3: The general public becomes aware of the new technology and begins to invest in it as well as buy it and use it This is the final stage.

The way I see it right now CCs are in the process of moving from Stage 1 to the beginning of Stage 2.

 

[WKBlu]

 

[drxman1]

So I’m curious, Bought a few coins last week, and still waiting to get them. I’ve found this to be a pretty frustrating process. Most of the exchanges that have the greater selection of coins aren’t accepting new users right now.

Been listening to a bunch of podcasts, sounds like a cult. Believe in the technology, it’s the future...

If this technology is supposed to be the future, it’s pretty unimpressive right now.

 

[thabigbluenation]

to say the U.S. dollar isn't backed up by anything isn't quite true. it is backed up by the baddest military on the planet and if you as a govt decide you want to move from the dollar to something else, we create a reason or proxy war to come in and over throw your ass and install something different. it is what we do. bitcoin doesn't quite have that.

 

[SomeDudeCRO]

.

If this technology is supposed to be the future, it’s pretty unimpressive right now.

This is to be expected.

Markets go up, they go down... they go sideways..

 

[jameslee32]

Ripple struggling this week to say the least.

 

[drxman1]

TRX taking a beating too. Would like to buy both, but can’t get access. Are there really that many people jumping in or is this the proverbial “always keep a line” charade.

For those of you trading on these exchanges, how long are you waiting for transactions to go through?

 

[SomeDudeCRO]

TRX ruffled some chinese government feathers.

What transactions are you talking about? Moving coin from exchange to exchange? Placing orders? Putting real money in?

 

[drxman1]

I’ve got coins in coinbase now after a week wait from initial purchase.

Binanace, bittrex, kraken...not accepting new users right now.

But yes i was talking about trading coins. And when you sell them, what’s the process like for getting your cash?

 

[SomeDudeCRO]

You a real doctor? I seem to remember maybe you or someone else is.. we talking serious money? Then you need to be careful.

Otherwise, trade for free on gdax (coinbase extension) for free (limit orders) from bitcoin to ehter or litecoin.. then move that litecoin to an exchange you research as safe enough that is open for registration.

Move small amount first make sure it goes through. Then move back to coinbase to cash out.

Coinbase giving you real money back take weeks.

This is not qualified financial advice, just advice from a some dude on the internet so do with it what you will.

 

[UK_Dallas]

^He is Croatian so be careful Doc.

 

[drxman1]

I appreciate all the advice. I’m looking at this as gambling money so I’m pretty reserved. The potential for a windfall is tempting. Not risking anything I wouldn’t drop at the blackjack table. That being said I’d rather not be robbed.

Thanks wildcat friends.

 

[Kaizer Sosay]

Uh oh...

Over $100 billion wiped off global cryptocurrency market following talk of South Korea trading ban - CNBC https://apple.news/Apz7fZZz0TMqRlcOzwY6JTg

 

[SomeDudeCRO]

Ripple is on a run... if he got in, he can go ahead and take 50% profit if he wants.

 

[Deeeefense]

TRX taking a beating too. Would like to buy both, but can’t get access. Are there really that many people jumping in or is this the proverbial “always keep a line” charade.

For those of you trading on these exchanges, how long are you waiting for transactions to go through?

The last bitcoin transfer I made from one exchange to another took 11 hours, in the early months of 2017 they were taking less than 30 minutes. The system was overwhelmed with transactions in the 4th quarter of 2017 I think it caught everyone off guard.

Not to get too far into the weeds, but there are technical improvements under development to make bitcoin transactions occur much more quickly. For now the fork that gave us bitcoin cash solved a lot of those problems. The bitcoin critics are right that the functionality of bitcoin as an altcoin has limited utility at present, and until the issues are better addressed it's more of a stored-value investment. However Internationale transactions are still one advantage. Bitcoin still beats the heck out of bank wire transfers or western union.

 

[Bill Cosby]

How are you all planning on handling your tax reporting? Especially in light of the changes to Sec. 1031 with the recent tax reform?

 

[SomeDudeCRO]

Last bit of advice I'll give... his intuition is right I think, there are a lot of cultists who don't know what they are talking about (probably better off just listening to Deefense and Z) and he needs to be careful (there are hackers looking for your coin) and stick with gambling money able to be lost.

For me, there's too many ways for this to go wrong... a lot of people are going to lose their shirts; there are going to be seroius problems. It's not for me, too much of a gamble and I'm a slow and steady wins the race kind of tortouise, but I think if you are intelligent and patient, there is money to be made.

 

[drxman1]

So apparently China gonna put an end to crypto mining too?

 

[Platinumdrgn]

Crypto's starting their correction back to realistic values atm

 

[drxman1]

Y’all gonna HODL or run?

 

[SomeDudeCRO]

Hold unless you want to try to short, will go further if not today than soon.

The correction I and others thought around christmas was delayed a bit; Ripple though seems like it's particularly situated for a decent rebound.

As always, that is not qualified financial advice, but I did already sell a few days ago except some small alt coin positions.

 

[PTI (pti)]

Y’all sound like a bunch of desperate, broke idiots. Like the degenerates at the track that were soooooo close to hitting that super. Good luck on all of your ignorant, terrible, risky investments!

 

[throatpoker]

Hold unless you want to try to short

No one here is going to be shorting it. The only way you can do so at this time is via contract (75k per) or via puts on one single exchange (which no one ever mentions the exchange because it's shady as hell). In other words, anyone that tells you they are shorting bitcoin is a liar/noise.

 

[cawoodsct]

Hopefully no one in this thread.

 

[Deeeefense]

What's occurring to bitcoin and other CCs right now is what's called "consolidation". That normally occurs after a big run up. A lot of profit taking occurs and sends the price down, and people that got in late start panic selling. Others with a longer term view see a buying opportunity and start buying, but then comes a new round of sellers wanting to "get out while the can". All that back and forth can go on for a few months until the price forms what technical charters call a "bottom". Then it can move up again.