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“It Really Comes Down to Who Commits First”

Duke insiders are very confident that we"ll get Wendell Carter, Mohammed Bamba, Quade Green, Kevin Knox and Gary Trent Jr.

I see UK getting Trae Young, Collin Sexton, John Petty, Jarred Vanderbilt and Nick Richards.

Michael Porter and DeAndre Ayton are far and away the 2 best players in this class though and Porter is a lock to play at Washington under Lorenzo Romar and Ayton will either go to Kansas or go overseas before the 2017 NBA Draft.

I'm good with that, though I would like to have Bamba.

I think Bamba will wait for the Spring to see who leaves.

If that is your class, then Duke probably looks like this in 17-18:

Starters
G Jackson
G Trent
F Knox
F Bamba
F Carter

Bench
G Green
G Kennard
F DeLaurier
F Jeter(if he doesn't transfer)

UK probably looks like this, with that class:

Starters
G Young
G Petty
F Gabriel
F Killeya-Jones
F Richards

Bench
G Sexton
F Vanderbilt
F Wynyard
F Humphries

Both teams will be really good, but really young.
 
I want Diallo the most of them all.

Then Young. Then either of Bamba and Ayton. After that I'm good with whatever.
 
Duke insiders are very confident that we"ll get Wendell Carter, Mohammed Bamba, Quade Green, Kevin Knox and Gary Trent Jr.

I see UK getting Trae Young, Collin Sexton, John Petty, Jarred Vanderbilt and Nick Richards.

Michael Porter and DeAndre Ayton are far and away the 2 best players in this class though and Porter is a lock to play at Washington under Lorenzo Romar and Ayton will either go to Kansas or go overseas before the 2017 NBA Draft.

Thanks for enlightening us with your condescending guesses. Now go re-read old Coach K transcripts of how awful he used to think OAD was before he routinely got his rat ass handed to him in the tournament from '05 through '09.
 
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Collin Sexton? We aren't even on his list are we?

He's just pulling guesses out of his ass. Basically his thesis is that Duke will land all their primary targets without fail and UK will land whatever's left.

I swear, these Duke asshats have gone from being above OAD to suddenly thinking they can't miss on a kid.

Enjoy it while it lasts, Duke fans. K turns 70 in February, and his Team USA connections fade into oblivion the moment he announces the retirement press conference.
 
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He's just pulling guesses out of his ass. Basically his thesis is that Duke will land all their primary targets without fail an UK will land whatever's left.

I swear, these Duke asshats have gone from being above OAD to suddenly thinking they can't miss on a kid.

Enjoy it while it lasts, Duke fans. K turns 70 in February, and his Team USA connections fade into oblivion the moment he announces the retirement press conference.


Duke is so done when K is gone.

Unless there is a UNC set up happening. Duke is done once K is gone.

If they are still getting players after he leaves, it will stink as bad as Chapel Hill.
 
Duke is so done when K is gone.

Unless there is a UNC set up happening. Duke is done once K is gone.

If they are still getting players after he leaves, it will stink as bad as Chapel Hill.
Duke is getting all these recruits in large part because of Capel. Their recruiting before he returned was stagnating. K provides the world class coaching and Capel brings the recruiting. When that duo splits up there will be a drop off.
 
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Duke is getting all these recruits in large part because of Capel. Their recruiting before he returned was stagnating. K provides the world class coaching and Capel brings the recruiting. When that duo splits up there will be a drop off.

I will be so glad when K retires and we quit having to listen to all these Dukies singing his praises.

I suspect they will continue to sign top guys for a while until Capel is gone, but they will sorely miss K's coaching.

I can't stand him, but he is a good coach. Plus he gets every benefit of the doubt when it comes to calls and every advantage in seeding, etc because he is considered royalty by the NCAA.
 
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I will be so glad when K retires and we quit having to listen to all these Dukies singing his praises.

I suspect they will continue to sign top guys for a while until Capel is gone, but they will sorely miss K's coaching.

I can't stand him, but he is a good coach. Plus he gets every benefit of the doubt when it comes to calls and every advantage in seeding, etc because he is considered royalty by the NCAA.



K is the type of guy who will try to coach as long as he can. He's an egomaniac, and the media rarely calls him on it because he's privileged and coaches at an elite academic school.

To name a few - his throwing Parker under the bus in '14 post-tournament new conference; his publically shaming of William Avery and Corey Maggette for leaving early; his berating of officials; his hypocritical posturing against Dean Smith for working the officials in the 1980s; his condescending entry into opposing locker rooms to congratulate them on beating his team; his clever, coy "ah shucks" media slurping; his two-faced approach to the OAD Era.

All of it points to a man with a massive ego problem. It's not wonder he's enlisted the help of a crony like Capel to solidify his legacy at the end of his career.
 
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he is considered royalty

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Duke is getting all these recruits in large part because of Capel. Their recruiting before he returned was stagnating. K provides the world class coaching and Capel brings the recruiting. When that duo splits up there will be a drop off.

Yep. Cuz Capel can't keep Duke maintained.
 
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K is the type of guy who will try to coach as long as he can. He's an egomaniac, and the media rarely calls him on it because he's privileged and coaches at an elite academic school.

To name a few - his throwing Parker under the bus in '14 post-tournament new conference; his publically shaming of William Avery and Corey Maggette for leaving early; his berating of officials; his hypocritical posturing against Dean Smith for working the officials in the 1980s; his condescending entry into opposing locker rooms to congratulate them on beating his team; his clever, coy "ah shucks" media slurping; his two-faced approach to the OAD Era.

All of it points to a man with a massive ego problem. It's not wonder he's enlisted the help of a crony like Capel to solidify his legacy at the end of his career.

Add in the berating of the Oregon player, then lying about it this March.
 
Duke is so done when K is gone.

Unless there is a UNC set up happening. Duke is done once K is gone.

If they are still getting players after he leaves, it will stink as bad as Chapel Hill.

Well the end is near then. K looked like he was some kind of weird vampire brother to Pitino last year on the bench for the UK game. He looks bad. But it had been a couple years since I seen him in person. Maybe just uglier than I remembered
 
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Well the end is near then. K looked like he was some kind of weird vampire brother to Pitino last year on the bench for the UK game. He looks bad. But it had been a couple years since I seen him in person. Maybe just uglier than I remembered

Let him stay as long as he wants. We have Cal.
 
I'm good with that, though I would like to have Bamba.

I think Bamba will wait for the Spring to see who leaves.

If that is your class, then Duke probably looks like this in 17-18:

Starters
G Jackson
G Trent
F Knox
F Bamba
F Carter

Bench
G Green
G Kennard
F DeLaurier
F Jeter(if he doesn't transfer)

UK probably looks like this, with that class:

Starters
G Young
G Petty
F Gabriel
F Killeya-Jones
F Richards

Bench
G Sexton
F Vanderbilt
F Wynyard
F Humphries

Both teams will be really good, but really young.
Yeah pretty much, the only changes I would make is that Luke Kennard will almost definitely start over Gary Trent Jr. unless he doesn't progress at all this year.

As for UK, I realized I accidentally put Sexton instead of Diallo which is who I meant to write down in my earlier post.
 
Thanks for enlightening us with your condescending guesses. Now go re-read old Coach K transcripts of how awful he used to think OAD was before he routinely got his rat ass handed to him in the tournament from '05 through '09.
How is what I said condescending? This was never going to be UK's greatest recruiting class of the Cal era or anything like that and most realistic UK fans understand that. Getting Young, Diallo, Petty, Richards and Vanderbilt would make a great recruiting class. Heck, I bet half those guys will stay for a 2nd year giving your program some continuity. Now wouldn't that be nice!!

Also, I love how you're arbitrarily singling out maybe the worst 5 year stretch in Coach K's illustrious 35+ year coaching career. It's a bad look to criticize someone who's been to 12 Final Fours in his 36 years coaching at the school.
 
He's just pulling guesses out of his ass. Basically his thesis is that Duke will land all their primary targets without fail and UK will land whatever's left.

I swear, these Duke asshats have gone from being above OAD to suddenly thinking they can't miss on a kid.

Enjoy it while it lasts, Duke fans. K turns 70 in February, and his Team USA connections fade into oblivion the moment he announces the retirement press conference.
Remember that Coach K had recruited one-and-dones long before Cal with Corey Maggette and Luol Deng. In the current era, its very likely that Grant Hill, Jay Williams, Elton Brand, Shane Battier and many more would have been one-and-done if they played now.
 
Collin Sexton? We aren't even on his list are we?

According to one of the KU insiders, Kentucky offered Sexton last week (so does this make him a valid source now or still unreliable because he's not a Kentucky writer? :) )

Rumor Central - Sexton
http://throughthephog.com/2016/07/12/kansas-jayhawks-basketball-recruiting-index/13/

With him blowing up so much over the past 10 weeks, there doesn’t seem to be a real strong idea as to where this one is headed. Alabama thought they had a leg up as Avery Johnson has really gone after Sexton hard. Kansas has offered and Coach Self left Peach Jam to go out to see him at the Peach Invitational (same area, but satellite sites for that event). Kentucky will most likely try to get involved now as they offered last week. Villanova did the same.

While Kansas has a shot here – and he’d be an excellent fit – this one will take a while to play out.

Rumor Central - Young

http://throughthephog.com/2016/07/12/kansas-jayhawks-basketball-recruiting-index/3/

The rumors are out of control right now for this one. Kansas fans seem eager to believe they have no shot, but they’re definitely one of the few true contenders for Young’s services. Handicapping this one would likely see the odds as a two-horse race between Kansas and Oklahoma. We spoke to a lot of people this week – and with varying responses – but the few people who really are clued into this one all said Kansas and Oklahoma are the teams to beat. Kentucky and Oklahoma are darkhorses, but I’ve been told to expect him to stay near home.
 
According to one of the KU insiders, Kentucky offered Sexton last week (so does this make him a valid source now or still unreliable because he's not a Kentucky writer? :) )

Rumor Central - Sexton
http://throughthephog.com/2016/07/12/kansas-jayhawks-basketball-recruiting-index/13/

With him blowing up so much over the past 10 weeks, there doesn’t seem to be a real strong idea as to where this one is headed. Alabama thought they had a leg up as Avery Johnson has really gone after Sexton hard. Kansas has offered and Coach Self left Peach Jam to go out to see him at the Peach Invitational (same area, but satellite sites for that event). Kentucky will most likely try to get involved now as they offered last week. Villanova did the same.

While Kansas has a shot here – and he’d be an excellent fit – this one will take a while to play out.

Rumor Central - Young

http://throughthephog.com/2016/07/12/kansas-jayhawks-basketball-recruiting-index/3/

The rumors are out of control right now for this one. Kansas fans seem eager to believe they have no shot, but they’re definitely one of the few true contenders for Young’s services. Handicapping this one would likely see the odds as a two-horse race between Kansas and Oklahoma. We spoke to a lot of people this week – and with varying responses – but the few people who really are clued into this one all said Kansas and Oklahoma are the teams to beat. Kentucky and Oklahoma are darkhorses, but I’ve been told to expect him to stay near home.

Kansas has 2 guys who track MoKan like kids trying to get autographs. It's really odd.

That info on Young is wrong. I'll take it from who I have heard that UK is in strong position for Young--and for the KU fan, I am NOT a Kentucky fan.
 
According to one of the KU insiders, Kentucky offered Sexton last week (so does this make him a valid source now or still unreliable because he's not a Kentucky writer? :) )

Rumor Central - Sexton
http://throughthephog.com/2016/07/12/kansas-jayhawks-basketball-recruiting-index/13/

With him blowing up so much over the past 10 weeks, there doesn’t seem to be a real strong idea as to where this one is headed. Alabama thought they had a leg up as Avery Johnson has really gone after Sexton hard. Kansas has offered and Coach Self left Peach Jam to go out to see him at the Peach Invitational (same area, but satellite sites for that event). Kentucky will most likely try to get involved now as they offered last week. Villanova did the same.

While Kansas has a shot here – and he’d be an excellent fit – this one will take a while to play out.

Rumor Central - Young

http://throughthephog.com/2016/07/12/kansas-jayhawks-basketball-recruiting-index/3/

The rumors are out of control right now for this one. Kansas fans seem eager to believe they have no shot, but they’re definitely one of the few true contenders for Young’s services. Handicapping this one would likely see the odds as a two-horse race between Kansas and Oklahoma. We spoke to a lot of people this week – and with varying responses – but the few people who really are clued into this one all said Kansas and Oklahoma are the teams to beat. Kentucky and Oklahoma are darkhorses, but I’ve been told to expect him to stay near home.

Our own insiders are saying that Sexton is currently not being recruited by UK, and I think you're just going to have to agree with that, because Kentucky insiders will clearly know more about who Kentucky is recruiting than a Kansas insider does. For the record, the last time that a recruiting updated has occurred on Sexton was today.

I'll post a Young quote from Peach Jam, word for word.

"Well, maybe if De'Aaron and Malik are struggling and it looks like they could come back, I may wait to see if they turn it around."

Kentucky is much, much more than a darkhorse for Young. virtually everybody outside of Kansas feels that he's nearly a lock to UK, and his own words would indicate that. This is a kid that's willing to stall his recruiting process just to see if Kentucky will have the available playing time for him the next season.

In case you need clarity in what that means, from the same post from our insider:

Regarding his recruitment, some believe he's a lock to Kentucky. I wouldn't use the word lock but I think there's a good chance he ends up at UK and the Cats lead now.
 
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How is what I said condescending? This was never going to be UK's greatest recruiting class of the Cal era or anything like that and most realistic UK fans understand that. Getting Young, Diallo, Petty, Richards and Vanderbilt would make a great recruiting class. Heck, I bet half those guys will stay for a 2nd year giving your program some continuity. Now wouldn't that be nice!!

Also, I love how you're arbitrarily singling out maybe the worst 5 year stretch in Coach K's illustrious 35+ year coaching career. It's a bad look to criticize someone who's been to 12 Final Fours in his 36 years coaching at the school.

You're not understanding my point (I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that you're not choosing to be obtuse).

My point: that five year stretch coincided with K's failure and or refusal to recruit multiple OAD guys. His 2010 title was a well-earned championship, although it was an anomaly that fell into K's lap once UK and KU underperformed in the tournament and were bounced before the Final Four. If someone can find an easier run to the title than Baylor-WVU-Butler in recent years, I'd like to see it. The subsequent years after the 2010 team saw much of the same thing - K reluctantly embracing OAD and seeing much of the same results he saw from 2005-2009, losing in '11, '12, '13, and '14 to inferior tournament teams, all the while continuing his degradation of a full-blown OAD approach. Of course, that changed with the class of '14, wherein he added three OAD players.

Fact: Coach K has advanced past the Sweet Sixteen twice since his 2004 Final Four with teams that were not heavily-predicated on OAD players. He saw the writing on the wall and finally listened to his assistants, to which I give him massive credit. What I would like to see, however, is the abundance of Duke fans who followed his anti-OAD theme with elitist impunity, to actually acknowledge, in mass, that they exhibited the height of hypocrisy in their smear campaigns on Calipari and OAD players.

Your boys down in Durham trashed OAD when you couldn't see the benefit of it. Once K adapted Cal's approach and saw that it worked, your fans suddenly did a 180 flip.

This is perhaps the most significant reason that the Kentucky fan base currently resents your fan base. It has less to do with your on-the-court success, and more to do with the smug, two-faced nature in which your program and your coach have evolved.
 
According to one of the KU insiders, Kentucky offered Sexton last week (so does this make him a valid source now or still unreliable because he's not a Kentucky writer? :) )

Rumor Central - Sexton
http://throughthephog.com/2016/07/12/kansas-jayhawks-basketball-recruiting-index/13/

With him blowing up so much over the past 10 weeks, there doesn’t seem to be a real strong idea as to where this one is headed. Alabama thought they had a leg up as Avery Johnson has really gone after Sexton hard. Kansas has offered and Coach Self left Peach Jam to go out to see him at the Peach Invitational (same area, but satellite sites for that event). Kentucky will most likely try to get involved now as they offered last week. Villanova did the same.

While Kansas has a shot here – and he’d be an excellent fit – this one will take a while to play out.

Rumor Central - Young

http://throughthephog.com/2016/07/12/kansas-jayhawks-basketball-recruiting-index/3/

The rumors are out of control right now for this one. Kansas fans seem eager to believe they have no shot, but they’re definitely one of the few true contenders for Young’s services. Handicapping this one would likely see the odds as a two-horse race between Kansas and Oklahoma. We spoke to a lot of people this week – and with varying responses – but the few people who really are clued into this one all said Kansas and Oklahoma are the teams to beat. Kentucky and Oklahoma are darkhorses, but I’ve been told to expect him to stay near home.

Newman's coming to Lawrence to run the show, even if he's better off-the-ball. Young, and any other elite point guard given to solid logical disposition, will not come within 100 miles of your campus on a serious level. It will be Newman's show. You should be happy with that. You finally landed an elite point guard, even if his arrival does constitute a case of "sloppy seconds."
 
Yep. Cuz Capel can't keep Duke maintained.

They'll still be good, but closer to what Arizona is currently doing than what they're presently maintaining.

The narrative that helps Duke fans sleep easy at night might go like this: Well, if Capel has been the lead recruiter for all these elite prospects, then that logically has to carry over when K retires.

What they fail to acknowledge, as a whole, is that Capel represents only about 1/4th of the recruiting output. Duke as a name brand plays a part, but K's legacy and stranglehold on USA basketball is the principal feature in the recent Duke sale's job. Without him, Capel can continue to sell Duke based on...

1. The Duke brand and the program's historical preeminence
2. Prestigious academic impact
3. Duke NBA family

But he can't sell kids on the most important factors, K's almost root-based connection to point #1. Without K, Duke no longer features that same preeminence, and without the Team USA connection, it's even debatable that the majority of these elite kids would have even ended up at Duke, despite K's legacy. He was, after all, getting snubbed, by-and-large, by most of the OAD players all the way up until the last few classes. The correlation behind that was the impact of USA basketball, and Capel's insistence on using it as the primary weapon in Duke's nuclear arsenal.

What happens once that weapon is no longer in the arsenal?
 
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Well the end is near then. K looked like he was some kind of weird vampire brother to Pitino last year on the bench for the UK game. He looks bad. But it had been a couple years since I seen him in person. Maybe just uglier than I remembered

If Capel is still an assistant at Duke the next two years, it's likely because K's presently within three years of retirement. He will take the program over once K steps down. The only reason you remain an assistant when other solid programs make an offer at you - which will be the case for Capel over the next two seasons - is if you're about to take the main job at the school you're assistant coaching at.
 
Duke is getting all these recruits in large part because of Capel. Their recruiting before he returned was stagnating. K provides the world class coaching and Capel brings the recruiting. When that duo splits up there will be a drop off.

I'm sure Capel is a fine recruiter, but let's be honest, how hard is it really to recruit while coaching at Duke with coach K as headcoach? Once K is gone, Duke won't look as sexy and Capel will not be recruiting at the same level as he is currently recruiting at. When Capel becomes the head man at Duke, i do think he will turn out to be a pretty good coach, but he will not be bringing in the elite recruits he is currently enjoying. It will take some time before he gets to that level of respect from recruits in highschool.
 
You're not understanding my point (I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that you're not choosing to be obtuse).

My point: that five year stretch coincided with K's failure and or refusal to recruit multiple OAD guys. His 2010 title was a well-earned championship, although it was an anomaly that fell into K's lap once UK and KU underperformed in the tournament and were bounced before the Final Four. If someone can find an easier run to the title than Baylor-WVU-Butler in recent years, I'd like to see it. The subsequent years after the 2010 team saw much of the same thing - K reluctantly embracing OAD and seeing much of the same results he saw from 2005-2009, losing in '11, '12, '13, and '14 to inferior tournament teams, all the while continuing his degradation of a full-blown OAD approach. Of course, that changed with the class of '14, wherein he added three OAD players.

Fact: Coach K has advanced past the Sweet Sixteen twice since his 2004 Final Four with teams that were not heavily-predicated on OAD players. He saw the writing on the wall and finally listened to his assistants, to which I give him massive credit. What I would like to see, however, is the abundance of Duke fans who followed his anti-OAD theme with elitist impunity, to actually acknowledge, in mass, that they exhibited the height of hypocrisy in their smear campaigns on Calipari and OAD players.

Your boys down in Durham trashed OAD when you couldn't see the benefit of it. Once K adapted Cal's approach and saw that it worked, your fans suddenly did a 180 flip.

This is perhaps the most significant reason that the Kentucky fan base currently resents your fan base. It has less to do with your on-the-court success, and more to do with the smug, two-faced nature in which your program and your coach have evolved.
I wasn't part of those smear campaigns against OAD players. What I would like to see from Duke is a continuity of their current recruiting process: mix in a few OAD (Parker, Okafor, Ingram) with some multi year 5 star recruits (Singler, Kelly, Plumlees, Allen).

I do agree that K saw what Calipari was doing and decided it was high time to copy it and why not? He has a stroried program to sell in the context of an elite academic university and now he has Team USA connections as well. K has basically taken what Cal has done and perfected it to a certain degree since Duke gets a lot more upperclassmen returnees than UK.

As for the 2010 Duke title run, it wasn't easy at all considering Baylor, WVU and Butler were ranked #6, #8 and #9 by Ken Pomeroy.

The 2011 UConn team had to beat #23 Arizona, #5 Kentucky and #33 Butler to win the championship that year. Now that's an easy path!!
 
I wasn't part of those smear campaigns against OAD players. What I would like to see from Duke is a continuity of their current recruiting process: mix in a few OAD (Parker, Okafor, Ingram) with some multi year 5 star recruits (Singler, Kelly, Plumlees, Allen).

I do agree that K saw what Calipari was doing and decided it was high time to copy it and why not? He has a stroried program to sell in the context of an elite academic university and now he has Team USA connections as well. K has basically taken what Cal has done and perfected it to a certain degree since Duke gets a lot more upperclassmen returnees than UK.

As for the 2010 Duke title run, it wasn't easy at all considering Baylor, WVU and Butler were ranked #6, #8 and #9 by Ken Pomeroy.

The 2011 UConn team had to beat #23 Arizona, #5 Kentucky and #33 Butler to win the championship that year. Now that's an easy path!!

I believe you weren't part of the smear campaign. At least you aren't a hypocrite like so many of your Duke brothers.

That said, your comparison to 2011 is flawed. UConn had to play a 2 seed in the Sweet Sixteen, and would have had to play a #1 seed Duke if Coach K had prepared his team instead of getting stomped by an under-manned Arizona team.

Duke, in contrast, had the table set up for them from the jump in their region, with a mediocre Baylor representing the only threat in the entire region. In other words, circumstances created UConn's so-so road to the Final Four in 2011. In 2010, Duke had the table set for them at the start.

I'm surprised you can't recognize the difference, actually, given that you seem to be somewhat level-headed.
 
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