These kids aren't being paid millions of dollars to succeed. When coaches are let go for performance, almost all of the time they are paid out for their contract, or a good portion of it. Apples and oranges.
Is Taking a Player's Scholarship Ethical?
- Thread starter BlueRattie
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These kids aren't being paid millions of dollars to succeed. When coaches are let go for performance, almost all of the time they are paid out for their contract, or a good portion of it. Apples and oranges.
If you tell an athlete 4 years then it needs to be 4 years. Yanking a kid's education away because the coach can't evaluate isn't fair. The kid gets penalized if he transfers so why should the school get off? Besides evaluating players is part of job performance. Allowing coaches to yank scholarships isn't going to fix the problem of the coach not being able to recruit. What's stopping him from messing up with the next guy he gives the scholarship to.
You asked a question I answered in my post you responded to, obviously you didn't read the post or you wouldn't have asked me what if. What does government entitlements and the post office have to do with what we are discussing? If a kid comes in, works his rear off in the classroom and for the team, does everything the coaches asked him to do but just isn't good enough to see the field often I think a coach should eat the scholarship and honor his word to the kid and the parents. You aren't going to change my mine, I believe in doing what I say I am going to do, and feel someone representing me should do the same. Obviously you think it's ok to say one thing and mean another. Do you think its ok to send cops to the hospital, or rob a store with a gun too? UT has no problem keeping kids on the team who do those type of things because they happen to be able to get on the field. You happen to pull for a team that has shown over the years they have no respect for ethics and will defend that way of running a program, I happen to pull for one who will not tolerate that type behavior and currently have a 5 game winning streak over your team.
If he is a woman then you must be a teenager. If you would stop being a know it all and listen, the man from Georgia knows his stuff.
Nice response, but once you have been shown facts and you don't have the ability to refute them, name calling is always the best and last resort, especially on an internet blog.
I don't get your point. They wouldn't be limited by not being able to work either if they their scholarship wasn't renewed.
Georgia doesn't offer many four year scholarships either. Why? Because it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to. There is a lot of turnover at Georgia. There is a lot of turnover at Tennessee. There's a lot of turnover at pretty much every school in the SEC. Some players go from high school to college and realize that it takes substantially more in terms of commitment and not all are willing to put forth the effort required to become a contributing member of the team.
We all know that entitlements are a huge problem in the state of Kentucky. Lots of people on government assistance, but athletes have a free education handed to them, or at least a subsidized education. In most cases if a player really wants to play and sees he is way down on the depth chart he will leave on his own, problem solved. In other cases the coaches should be honest about the prospects. Athletic scholarships shouldn't be guaranteed for 4 years any more than academic scholarships. We are talking about a very, very small number of players who don't get their scholarships renewed from one year to the next. It's not really an issue, but the only things in life that are guaranteed are death and taxes. Not athletic scholarships.
Its true, UGA doesn't offer 4 year scholarships, we have had some turnover too, not because they aren't playing, because they can't follow rules. UGA doesn't tolerate certain things, some schools do. Example is 3 failed drug test and you are gone, at some places 10 don't get you suspended and I am not talking UT. Any arrest gets you a 2 game suspension, that isn't the case at other schools, some kids don't like following rules and leave, some can't pass the drug test and are removed, but you can't name a single player Richt has not renewed their scholarship in his soon to be 15 years, and we have had a lot of 4 and 5 year guys who never took a meaningful snap in that time, but they kept their scholarship till they got their degree. Look, I know I am not going to change your thoughts on the subject you think its fine, but you aren't going to change mine, if we don't win the big game so be it, but we aren't screwing kids over and lying to mamas and daddys in their living rooms when we recruit. Follow the rules and you get your degree regardless of your production on the field, as an alumni I can live with that.
Not sure what government entitlements has to do with a college offering a scholarship to students that have academic and/or athletic qualities they desire. You are really reaching on that.
Plenty of kids get Pell Grants but if they transfer out they are not limited to what school they can transfer too.
Never seen a professor leave or retire and the incoming professor cut students he/she did not want.
There's plenty of merit scholarships guaranteed for four year as long as one meets the academic standards and code of conduct.
Most academic scholarships are simply renewed every year as one applies for any financial aid.
Besides what has happened to a man's word when he looks you in the eyes and say he want to to be a part of something and simply tosses it away?
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The reason I mention entitlements is that an entitlement mentality is apparent on here. The culture of everybody deserves a trophy is strong. A lot of students never take meaningful snaps in a game, but are hard workers in practice, I don't know any program that has cut those type of players because they still have a value to the team. But, if the player has no value to the team, doesn't work hard in practice, etc. he shouldn't keep a scholarship. I'm sorry, but no. Maybe it's not fair. Life's not fair. If life were fair I would be a better quarterback than Peyton Manning and have an NFL contract to show for it. The one thing I do think should be changed is that if a player transfers out he should be eligible to play immediately; I don't see the point in forcing him to sit out a year, it just seems petty.
You mean like you deflecting what I said about entitlements?
You're just a grumpy old dog sitting on your high horse
Does anyone do less with more than uga?
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Lol grandma dog.
uga signed 102 players in the last 4 classes including THIRTY-THREE in the 2013.
Get off that high pony and look to your own house granny.
#different
uga signed 102 players in the last 4 classes including THIRTY-THREE in the 2013.
Get off that high pony and look to your own house granny.
#different
Btw...in the same last 4 years Tennessee signed 104, bama signed 102, and Kentucky signed 99.
I believe Kentucky would of taken more LY but had some late flips that would have put them in the same place as Tennessee, bama, and uga.
Tennessee had a blue shirt in LY's class of 29 that already got the boot for not going to class and study hall. Our class LY is now at 28. We should be taking 18 or 19 this year.
I believe Kentucky would of taken more LY but had some late flips that would have put them in the same place as Tennessee, bama, and uga.
Tennessee had a blue shirt in LY's class of 29 that already got the boot for not going to class and study hall. Our class LY is now at 28. We should be taking 18 or 19 this year.
Sounds like they did enough to beat TU five years in a row. Stop some time and look at how many four AND five star commits TU has had in the past decade, including when they had losing records.
Pretty weak argument there.
I pretty much have no problem with cutting players for non performance, for many of the reasons cite in this thread, i.e., we all are not going to be the lead singer, get the starring role, be the President of the US, etc. Too bad, that is life in a meritocracy. But honestly, not in favor of an open transfer rule either, not for college athletics. These kids are allegedly at school for the education, that is what they all say anyway, not just playing ball. If all they want to do is play ball, then go play semi pro, or tryout for the NFL. If you want to go to college, then find a place where you fit, whether you make a big splash on the field or not.
Georgia has more D1 recruits than any other state in the SEC including Florida or Texas. While state of Tennessee has more than Kentucky they both pale in comparison to The state of Georgia. Talent rich and being the state school and Richt can't convert that to championships.
Even with the over signing that goes on in pristine Athens
Isn't your school considered the "State School", or is that Vandy now?
And with all their HUGE recruiting advantages (including a lot more in state talent, ZERO four stars in Kentucky in 2010) TU has been spending about THREE times as much as UK on football recruiting, and I am not even sure that included their subscription to the "recruiting service" that got Oregon in trouble.
And of course you were famous (infamous?) for your use of the "Orange Pride" until the NCAA banned them.
Times has changed fellas. Scholarships are now 4 year guaranteed and they aren't based on performance either. The ruled was changed last year and took effect in January. It was changed because to many coaches were yanking scholarships in the SEC. The SEC coaches weren't if favor of the rule change but it passed anyways.
Do you have some sort of...you know...source for that contention. Because I don't think you know what you are talking about. http://mweb.cbssports.com/ncaaf/wri...4-year-scholarships-to-athletes-but-many-dont
Yes,
Yes, UGA signed 104 the last 4 years, we also played the 2010 season with 67 kids on scholarship, its taken 5 years to get our numbers back to 85. The reason for that is 4-5 years of undersigning 2-3 per class followed by the 2010 class where we undersigned by 7 kids, but at least you tried. Of course that doesn't matter to you, the important thing is we didn't tell anyone they had to leave because they weren't contributing.
But sending all those kids packing got UT to a bowl last year, first one in awhile, so in your eyes I guess it was ok.
I understand you don't care about anything but winning and how disappointed you are with the results UT has had the last few years and willing to accept whatever means is necessary to win. I don't think that way, but something you have never been taught and should have is being decent guy who treats people with respect doesn't mean weak.
One last thing and then you join the ignore list, rent is due and we are coming to collect in Oct.
I'm really confused by this when Georgia had 27 enrollees in 2010, 24 in 2011, 17 in 2012, 32 in 2013, and 20 in 2014 and 28 in 2015. That isn't substantially different than Tennessee (27,26,23,24,32,29) or Kentucky (28,22,28,21,28,21). And what confuses me most is that Georgia has had coaching stability for years so the recruiting should also be stable. If Richt were a decent recruiter, he should be signing an appropriate number of players every year to prevent wild imbalances. I can understand why Tennessee or Kentucky would sign more than 25 players, coaching changes always lead to substantial attrition, so they have been rebuilding. That's the primary reason why Tennessee had one of the youngest team in the country last season and Kentucky wasn't much older.
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CFB is a business just like any other but if you don't believe that then I don't know what to tell you. If it's not a business why do they need a union? Just because these kids are 18 to 22 yo's does make it any less of a business.
One definition of ethical is "following acceptable standards of conduct". In the business world do you think it is acceptable to fire someone when it is apparent that they can not perform their duties, whether it be lack of motivation, skills or ability? Now it used to be acceptable but if you don't believe that then that is another larger societal issue for another day.
Yes it does come down to entitlement issues and that is really the discussion here just covered up by sports. Would you hire a salesman for 4 years no matter how they performed or give them a job for life? If a business person makes a bad hire you try to correct your mistake and not repeat it again or do you say well that's my fault guess I'll just have to live with it?
I just hope we don't end up like Greece for our kids sake.
Granny dog used the justification for Richt's over signing as getting up to 85.
Same for Tennessee but somehow he sees it as different.
Richt has been over signing for years but from grumpy granny's high horse it is different
#hypocrite
Ok, I couldn't remember if the flips were replaced.....so 99 vs. 103 in 4 years of recruiting.
uga 102 vs. 104 for Tennessee.
Not exactly room to throw rocks at another school over signing as some itt have done.
Why can't you see that there is a difference? The limit is supposed to be 25 per year so yeah you might be high one year and low another, but the average should be about 25. TU is ELEVEN over for those six years, an average of 26.84 per year for the six years, while both Georgia and UK are two UNDER for the six years, or an average of 24.67 for the six years. Averaging two more commits per year is a pretty substantial difference IMO, what are the limits for anyway?.
I think as long as your team is at 85 there shouldn't be the 25 per year limits. It's unsurprising to me that UT has had relatively large classes since they've had a lot of coaching changes which leads to a lot of attrition. Georgia has had no recent change at head coach, Richt is just incapable of recruiting in a stable and beneficial way.
Kentucky has had a recent coaching change and is 13 commits below TU in the six years.
Some teams don't have as much trouble with the 85 limit as others, some players get injured and can't continue their careers even though they don't look that injured, LOL.
Some teams don't have as much trouble with the 85 limit as others, some players get injured and can't continue their careers even though they don't look that injured, LOL.
Tennessee had 3 coaches in 3 years and the turnover from Fulmer to Kiffin to Dooley would be enough to nearly destroy any football program. It's just sad that while UT was down UK couldn't take advantage of the opportunity. Now it appears that Jones is doing a good job (time will tell) but hopefully UK will at least be competitive in that rivalry going forward.
Well, you probably got something right, you probably should be taking 18 or 19 this year. How about coming back when it is all over and telling us how many you actually took?
If Tenn stays at or below 85, why does it matter how many they take? In jones first year we started the season with 67 scholarship players, now he's making that up.
Just so we're on the same page -
Signing 99 kids in 4 years ok
Signing 104 kids in 4 years not ok
Correct jauk?....or is it somehow different?
