My name on ALL these boards, since the mid-90's, has been DACats86. What was yours in April 2013?
If Stoops Succeeds at UK - Will He Stay?
- Thread starter UKWinsAgainYep
- Start date
What the F do you care? I think I started posting in May or June after our rules changed at my job. The point is, others here are talking about football. But you are using the board to attack other fans. See what I'm getting at? On 2nd thought, maybe you should start your own board.
You can probably count the number of schools who can say their coach would stay on one hand, maybe less, Schools you thought had a coach forever have lost them to other programs, Peterson at BSU is an example, he had turned down several offers for bigger jobs, until the job opened up at Washington. Some schools are target or goal schools for a lot of coaches regardless of the success they have at their current program. Some guys are money motivated, and regardless of how much money you think your school has, if a few select schools, none in the south, come calling they are gone. But one thing you can be sure of, if Stoops gets UK to being competitive weekend weekout in conference play, someone will come calling.
But lots of things in UK's favor for him staying awhile, fairly near his home, its a program he has built from almost scratch, and I know you won't agree with this, but relatively a lack of pressure on him to win big. That wouldn't be the case at those goal or target schools for coaches.
![[laughing]](http://l.yimg.com/j/assets/img/emoticons/classic/laugh.r191677.gif "Laughing [laughing]")
I'm not sure how even a pessimist could say that Kentucky is a "stepping stone". Kentucky might be a lot of things for a head coach historically, but stepping stone isn't one of them. How many head coaches at UK have been successful at UK and used the job as a stepping stone? Bear Bryant? That's the only guy I could even come close to thinking of and he stayed her for 8 years so I'm not sure if you'd call that a stepping stone.
A stepping stone job is one that usually doesn't have much to offer. It's not in a P5 conference or it doesn't have a really really strong football fanbase or facilities like a school like Vanderbilt or Louisville. If a guy wins at the highest level here he won't find a more passionate football fanbase anywhere in the nation.
Charlie Strong had really good teams at Louisville and they couldn't even fill up their 50,000 seat stadium. That's one of the reasons why I find this whole argument silly. Kentucky has never been a stepping stone job. IF (and that's a big IF) Stoops has a lot of success here, the only job I would see him leaving for is a school like Ohio State, and that's still a big maybe. Kentucky has a lot more to offer than many of you think. Heck, Dan Mullen had an opportunity to go to Michigan and he stayed at Mississippi State, why wouldn't Stoops do the same thing? We have more football history than Miss State, we have a bigger football fanbase than Miss. State..we have better facilities than Mississippi State. I know you all look at this program and see a history of losing and wonder why any decent coach would even consider this job..but it's a lot more attractive than you all believe.
The ONLY negative I could think of would be having to play second fiddle to Calipari, but still, if a football coach is winning at the highest level I still don't think he'd play second fiddle to Calipari (and I don't think Cal is going to be here a whole lot longer anyways).
-Kentucky has a football fanbase that's second to none (when we're winning)
-Our football facilities overall are as good as anyone
-Our conference affiliation gives a coach more attention than anywhere in the nation
-The expectations here are lower than anywhere in the nation so a coach won't have constant pressure like he would at a traditional power
I just think this argument is silly honestly. I'm not sure why people always assume that a Kentucky football coach is just itching to jump out the door once he has a small taste of success. This isn't Louisville or Vanderbilt where no matter how much a coach wins the fanbase would have trouble filling up a 50,000 seat stadium. If a coach wins big here our fanbase would be more passionate about football than they are basketball (and that's quite a bit).
Tell me, why would a coach want to leave Kentucky if he's having success and the fans love him and he has almost zero pressure to win? Where else would he go? Come on..this job has never been a stepping stone and never will be. If a coach is winning here there is nowhere better to be in football. (And this whole thing is moot considering that we've been 2-10 and 5-7 in Stoops' first two years..come on..I know he's recruiting well, but come on..he hasn't even started winning yet..this whole thing is just really silly and pointless..people were saying these same things when we were 5-1 last year). Why do you all think a successful Kentucky coach would be just itching to jump ship? What would he get at another school that he couldn't get here? Tradition? Who cares about that if you have a winning team with great facilities and a great fanbase in a great conference?
The coaches that usually jump ship are these guys that aren't in a P5 conference or are at a school that doesn't really have a big football fanbase or something like that. Kentucky is in the best conference in America and has one of the most supportive football fanbases in the nation. Come on..if a football coach wins big here he'd be treated like Elvis..this isn't Louisville or Vanderbilt or Duke..the only negative here is basketball, and I'm not sure how much that really bothers a coach anyways..if a football coach wins big here he will have zero trouble getting attention...the only reason people turn their attention to basketball is to distract them from the bad football seasons we've had..if a football coach wins big here I would argue the exact opposite..that basketball would have trouble getting attention away from football..but this whole thing is pointless right now..how about we go .500 before we worry? It's not like we have a history of coaches jumping ship..come on..we have NO coaches that have jumped ship..we're not Louisville..the reasons coaches have jumped ship at Louisville and schools like that are things that Kentucky HAS and DOESN'T have to worry about
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No one knows what Coach Stoops will do in the future, even the man himself though if you asked him today he would say he's 100% happy here. In reality I just don't see him leaving UK for another SEC team even a Bama but I would not rule out Ohio State or Florida State, if UK surges towards the top of the pack and maybe wins the East in the new few years. But even then he would have to think twice about job security in one of those pressure cooker environments like brother Bob is in right now. He's smart enough to know all the glitters, isn't gold.
Didn't we have these discussions last year long about the time the Cat's were 5-1? Jeez, some were afraid Michigan would hire him. We know what happened then. Before I worry if Stoop's is going to leave I'm going to be worried about whether he'll be successful. I think he will, but it's still a ways off right now. If the Cat's win 7 this year, maybe 8 next, and go from there then we can worry about whether Stoops will stay or leave. He's not going anywhere until then.
Ram...This is Otis BS...Is a damn lie and he has no UK sources...Mark Stoops isn't going anywhere for a while unless he doesn't win...If he does then he needs to be paid commensurate with he has accomplished and he has stated that at this time next season UK will have as good of football facilities as any school in the country...I think it will depends on the job and how much he loves Lexington...
Guy Morris seemed to think Baylor was an upgrade. Anyway, I'm not saying that's my opinion. Lay off the Bourbon. Take away the word "perpetual" and I still think people may think Stoops views this as a stepping stone. I take the neutral standpoint. Lets hope a perennial top 10 doesn't come knocking, particularly one he feels he could maintain an OH pipeline to. Not saying he'll go just anywhere, but we can be cuckold.
Every fanbase thinks their's is the most rabid, but it will be hard to beat Carolina's fanbase, during the 0-21 stretch, they put 89k+ in the stadium every week, screamed and yelled like they were 21-0. I don't know anyone else not seeing a bunch of empty seats when a season falls apart, much less 2 back to back.
Congratulations..you named one coach in the entire 100+ years of Kentucky football..one coach..boy that's a real trend right there..Guy Morriss didn't leave because he was doing a bang up job and schools were beating down his door..he left because he saw probation around the corner and no support from the administration..why do you think he went to coach a terrible Baylor team? It's not like he left to go coach Alabama lol you need to lay off the peyote big dog..it's not healthy to do that stuff during the day time..take a deep breath and take the gun out of your mouth..some people continue to amaze with how they live in a constant state of fear lol one bad thing about when it gets closer to football season is that we start getting these basketball-first people coming out of the woodwork
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BR22...History also tells us that KENTUCKY has NEVER made a commitment to football like they are making today and it may very well take a "big time" school to get him away especially if he wins...The only thing left to complete this domino effect right now is for THE FANS TO BUY SEASON TICKETS AND GET ON THE TRAIN...Sorry for shouting , but most fans have ben bitching forever that UK wouldn't support the football program and now that it is THEY won't support the program and get on the train...STOOP TROOPS!!!...GOCATS!!!
Never said Kentucky's was "the most rabid"..but go find me some schools with Kentucky's history that will continue to pack the stands..South Carolina is one..that's a good start..see if you can name five in the entire nation..heck, see if you can name two or three...I'll wait lol..want to know why you're struggling to think of anyone? It's because it's a RARITY to have schools like South Carolina and Kentucky who have been terrible historically to continue to be passionate about football
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Not being sarcastic...Most of the $$$$$ at UK is basketball people...remember that the funding for the new fb facility was provided by $$$$$$$$$$ people that had never contributed to the fb program , but would they stand for a football head coach being paid as much as Cal...
Then I guess we should hope he's not successful...
Or, maybe, we should buy up all the season tickets, pack the stands, make donations to the football program, make sure he's paid commensurate with his peers, and support him in every way that we can...
Or, maybe, we should buy up all the season tickets, pack the stands, make donations to the football program, make sure he's paid commensurate with his peers, and support him in every way that we can...
It is NOT true that ANY coach can succeed at an already "successful" program (e.g. UL with Kragthorpe in over his head). But it IS TRUE that MANY coaches can succeed at such programs. By the same token FEW coaches can succeed at a "snakebitten" program (e.g. UK with "The Bluegrass Miracle", "The Drive", "The Catch", "The Expired Play Clock", etc.). Stoops can become one of the MANY successful coaches in the history of some "name" school or one of ONLY TWO successful coaches in the history of UK. Which would YOU choose?
I thought I read that Bear Bryant would have never left Kentucky if the legislature hadn't meddled with recruiting. I'm sure he had his reasons to stay then and there are certainly excellent reasons for hanging around now. Why do threads like this focus on the negative sides of Kentucky football? I'm a realist and I get that there are more prominent jobs around the country but leaving UK after shedding so much blood to build the program into a winner doesn't seem too likely considering Stoops' achievements in recruiting. He's hauling in kids for success 4 and 5 years down the road. Is he really thinking about leaving prior to seeing these players win bowl games?
Bear would have eventually left for the same reasons that he refused to schedule UK for a period of time; lack of funding to the program. No facility upgrades, no money going into recruiting, so on and so forth.
I could see this as a destination job for Stoops though. Let's assume that Kentucky starts producing 9, 10, 11 win seasons, and contending for national titles consistently. He's at a place close to home, where he recruits very well, in a powerhouse league that recruits actually turn away schools like Ohio State to play in. The program finally gets the funding that Stoops wanted before he accepted the coaching job. He's getting a practice facility that could rival, and probably surpass any in the country. Commonwealth Stadium will continue to be upgraded over the next couple of years, and if UK is a big competitor, or ticket demand goes up, we could see a new addition to the stadium (some new bleacher sections, maybe above the older suites, on both sides of the video boards, for example). Let's also assume that following all of this (the most success that we will have had in numerous years), he, and his staff receives another huge raise, and contract extension. With UK making ~$95 million a year at this point, and being one of the two schools in the SEC with tier-3 deals (with the other being Alabama).
I don't see why he wouldn't take this as a destination. A loyal, passionate fan base for a school that would excel in multiple sports to a high level, a huge salary, elite recruiting success, a lot of wins, all of the resources that he could ever ask for (he's getting a lot of that going into year 3), and the opportunity to make history for Kentucky, go down as a legendary coach if all of this plays out.
I see a lot of up-side.
A few years ago there were several schools that didn't have a winning tradition that do today: Oregon, Oklahoma State come to mind. In the SEC, Florida didn't have much of a winning tradition before Spurrier, and as has been mentioned neither did South Carolina. Most coaches leave because the resources, the fan support, the facilities, etc just aren't there. Occasionally a coach will leave to take a "dream job" but more often these guys stick around if they are getting the kind of support they need to recruit the type of players needed to win championships. Currently, UK seems to be making that commitment. If that continues there is likely very little to worry about unless Stoops just has a soft-spot for a program that we aren't aware of or he gets the type of Sabanesque offer he just can't refuse.
A coach is not a statue....they are free to roam the country...
I only care about the guys that are here... I like him here and he can stay long as he wants... If when he decides to go then make a good hire and PLEASE don't BCG us a CJP again ..... Barney!
I only care about the guys that are here... I like him here and he can stay long as he wants... If when he decides to go then make a good hire and PLEASE don't BCG us a CJP again ..... Barney!
Either of the Mississippi schools, neither have much of a history in football, but they always packed their stands every season before things went south. Arkansas is in the same group alone with most of the Big12 schools. UK is like everyone else, everybody expects big things when the season starts and fills the stands, if things don't go well there are more empty seats the next week. Just about any school with a large alumni base packs the stands early in the season. Schools like Vandy or GT with very small alumni bases have a tough time putting people in the stands
^Unfortunately you are likely correct. Guys like Bowden or Paterno who stay at a program are very infrequent. Everyone one of us hope to get a "program changer" but it just doesn't happen often. Even guys like Gary Pinkel.......for every successful guy like Pinkel who sticks around there are 10 guys that are successful that move on.
For now, I'm going to enjoy the ride. I'm going to cheer on my Cats. I'm going to cheer for Stoops. If he is successful and chooses to leave, then so be it. I'm going to be thankful for what he has given us. And I'm going to look to Mitch to capitalize on the momentum that Stoops brought and find another homerun hire.
And if Stoops is successful and stays, then I will be ecstatic. I'll have a great sense of pride. And I'll be envious of my daughter........she's 3 and if Stoops stays and is successful she may never know UK to be a lesser program.
For now, I'm going to enjoy the ride. I'm going to cheer on my Cats. I'm going to cheer for Stoops. If he is successful and chooses to leave, then so be it. I'm going to be thankful for what he has given us. And I'm going to look to Mitch to capitalize on the momentum that Stoops brought and find another homerun hire.
And if Stoops is successful and stays, then I will be ecstatic. I'll have a great sense of pride. And I'll be envious of my daughter........she's 3 and if Stoops stays and is successful she may never know UK to be a lesser program.
Agreed about UK fan passion. The only part that I disagree with is that there are certain jobs that will always be destination jobs. It's SO EASY to win at Michigan or Ohio state. So many resources, such a huge national brand, and a far easier conference and path to get to the playoff most years. It will never be easy in the SEC, so I wonder if he wouldn't want to move if given the chance. Urban Meyer had an amazing job at UF, but he realized it's a lot easier to play Purdue and Iowa than Georgia and LSU.
We just need to get through that first wave of offers that is sure to come Stoops way probably as soon as the end of this season. The longer he is here and the more successful we become, the harder it's going to be for him to want to leave. So far, the admin has done everything right in giving him what he needs to be successful.
And the longer he is here, the harder it's going to be for other coaches to negative recruit that Stoops and Co have one foot out the door as it appears many programs did last year to lure some guys away. Keeping Marrow was huge but what happens when he eventually moves up the coaching ladder? Can he do that here? What are his aspirations? Replacing him is going to be one of the keys to our continued success. But, maybe by the time he leaves it has become much easier for Ohio kids to listen to UK. They'll have a huge list of successful Ohio kids that have played here by then.
And the longer he is here, the harder it's going to be for other coaches to negative recruit that Stoops and Co have one foot out the door as it appears many programs did last year to lure some guys away. Keeping Marrow was huge but what happens when he eventually moves up the coaching ladder? Can he do that here? What are his aspirations? Replacing him is going to be one of the keys to our continued success. But, maybe by the time he leaves it has become much easier for Ohio kids to listen to UK. They'll have a huge list of successful Ohio kids that have played here by then.
I know that you are saying this of others, but who really thinks that we are a stepping stone? Kentucky has the reputation(before Stoops) as the graveyard for college coaches. I think Stoops is changing that thank God, but I really do not know anyone who actually believes we are a stepping stone, as I said, before Stoops. My personal opinion as to whether or not he will stay is this. I think that he has a great deal of loyalty and is not money motivated, therefore I think there is a really good chance that as long as we keep showing loyalty to him and his way of doing things, then he will be loyal to us. If we keep investing in the infrastructure of the program, and I hope we do, then I think he will be here a long while. I am sure that more raises are heading in his and his staffs direction as we fend off people trying to lure him away. I really believe that with the money the new TV network is bring in, and with an increase in attendance, that we will add more seats to the stadium in the next few years. It all depends on our on field success. I can remember the old days when our stadium was full even though we endured many years of mediocrity at the very best. Sure I think that tOSU could lure him away and maybe MI but I doubt that either will have an opening any time soon. I really don't think that it is likely that he will go anywhere anytime soon. I would be surprised if he is not here for a least 10 years and hopefully much much longer.
I think he is in an area of the country where he can recruit successfully. Part of the draw at Kentucky is that he can tell Ohio kids they can play close to home AND play in the SEC. Behind going to OSU, that is the next best thing for many of them. I don't think he could recruit like this at other middle of the pack teams in any conference. I think for the area there are probably three schools he could go to and have better recruiting: OSU, Michigan, and Notre Dame. I think he would probably take those jobs. Then there is FSU where he has connections and schools like Alabama who any college coach would be a little crazy to turn down right now.
I think it pretty much depends on 1. Who comes calling and 2. What kind of legacy he wants to leave. If his dream school, whatever that may be, comes calling then he will be hard pressed to turn it down. However, he might be the type of person that wants to leave a bigger mark. He could come to UK and make our program. He could be idolized as being our greatest coach ever (which wouldn't take a whole lot). On the flip side, he could go to a more traditional power and end up being one of many outstanding coaches. So, who is he? One to walk his own path and do something few others have done or to be another great at a great program? Here at UK he's already done quite a lot in terms of recruiting, fan excitement, and towards helping the program take a step forward in commitment. The more success he has on the field the more support he'll get. Only time will tell, but first, he has to prove he can be a coach that the big schools come calling for.
The ultimate point is, everyone will have varying opinions and nobody knows if he will stay or go. Call it a stepping stone, a graveyard or any undiscovered gold mine.
Jcrew,
Name 5 close friends you have in life, I'll wait lol... Want to know why you're struggling to think of anyone?
Of course he stays, why wouldn't he? UK is an SEC school and if we are successful there would not be a reason to leave. Urban Meyers is at Ohio State, his dream job. I doubt he goes anywhere. FSU has a coach, where would Stoops want to go other than maybe those two. Now let's be successful and enjoy the ride
On the other hand, the intense pressure on coaches to win is even more dependent on supporting entire athletic departments. The 24/7 world of recruiting, media exposure, fan expectations et al is not for every head football coach "on the rise."
Brother Bob has found a home at Oklahoma for the past 15 years. Brother Mike, very intense and over the top, has been at OU for seven years. He was successful at a wobegone Arizona program, but the famous temper and intensity eventually cost him. Brother Mark has learned from his brothers. Mark can be intense as well, but knows when to dial back and control his emotions. I look for Mark to be the most successful UK coach since Bear Bryant. And, he stays the course.
Brother Bob has found a home at Oklahoma for the past 15 years. Brother Mike, very intense and over the top, has been at OU for seven years. He was successful at a wobegone Arizona program, but the famous temper and intensity eventually cost him. Brother Mark has learned from his brothers. Mark can be intense as well, but knows when to dial back and control his emotions. I look for Mark to be the most successful UK coach since Bear Bryant. And, he stays the course.
If you really listen to Stoops, he's very high on loyalty. He's stated as much in regards to Kentucky. If he is able to put UK on a higher football, plain of exsiatance, and UK compensates Stoops in accordance with that higher plain of exsiatance, I don't see him leaving.
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