I think Dobbs is likely the best passer in the East this season. He threw for 63% last year I would expect to see improvement there. And I also think you don't give enough credit to Hurd considering the line he played behind last season. I think Jones and Stoops will feel some heat if they don't make it to a bowl this season, Jones even more than Stoops. I personally think Florida gets beat by Tennessee and Kentucky; Spurrier has yet to beat Jones; Missou is always better than anybody expects; Georgia is always tough, but Tennessee always plays them close regardless of how bad UT is, plus I think Butch Jones is a better coach than Mark Richt, and UT plays Vanderbilt @ Neyland. UK will be better but I think they are a year behind UT in the rebuild. Should be a better game than last year though.
Here's a shocker - UT player in legal trouble
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I think Dobbs is likely the best passer in the East this season. He threw for 63% last year I would expect to see improvement there. And I also think you don't give enough credit to Hurd considering the line he played behind last season. I think Jones and Stoops will feel some heat if they don't make it to a bowl this season, Jones even more than Stoops. I personally think Florida gets beat by Tennessee and Kentucky; Spurrier has yet to beat Jones; Missou is always better than anybody expects; Georgia is always tough, but Tennessee always plays them close regardless of how bad UT is, plus I think Butch Jones is a better coach than Mark Richt, and UT plays Vanderbilt @ Neyland. UK will be better but I think they are a year behind UT in the rebuild. Should be a better game than last year though.
You seem to have what is called a convenient memory, you forgot MOST of the story. Let me refresh your memory.
That was the SECOND assault by the TU players, the first much more troubling. Seems like the first was started by a 6' 4" 320# DT getting in a hassle with a 5' 11" 210# chubby guy that he apparently couldn't handle, since the EIGHT players got him down AND kicked him while down sending him to the hospital with a concussion. TWO local men were charged with attempted murder for kicking a man while down in a casino parking lot while down, but then that was caught on REQUIRED surveillance cameras. AND that man didn't have to go to the hospital. In the Knoxville incident the players (who were, against the rules, comped in by the owner) the OIC in charge "forgot" to ask for the surveillance film, which mysteriously didn't seem to have worked when they picked them up from the owner the next morning, what a coincidence. The police officer was their second victim, and the account I read said he was also kicked while down, I have never read your version before, probably a good cover story and retroactive history.
TU not having as many incidents as other legit Universities is a joke, NO charges from these TWO disgusting assaults from this ''incident", not even a parking ticket, (one player with two prior "incidents) dismissed for evading and resisting arrest later, probably because he couldn't outrun a fat cop. as well as only being concerned if a player has FIVE mj incidents compared to UK and Georgia having a limit of TWO. Similar to your starting QB facing no vandalism charges for the damage to the car because he paid for the damages, LOL, doesn't that sound like a confession to you?
This farce is among my favorite miscarriages of justice with the hurtt situation at the U and Transfer U probably ranking higher.
I still think those tapes the owner were left in charge of were probably worth a lot of money to the coach whose limosine arrived a short time later to pick up the players, and definitely was surprised to see no one sued by the two victims, still wonder what kind of car they were driving shortly after the incident. In my officials association we were supposed to be kicked out of the association if we were ever struck by anyone and didn't press charges, odd a police officer could laugh it off.
And I fully agree while I hate cheaters and the inept NCAA the way UK handled both the Hartline and Tubman cases was disgusting, along with other cases, UK has way too many disadvantages to let other schools get away with murder while being the biggest scaredycat around when it comes to the incompetent joke the NCAA has become. Caffey would have been a big star and fit well with the mj crew at UL while keeping eligible in their newly formed basketweaving lll class.
That was the SECOND assault by the TU players, the first much more troubling. Seems like the first was started by a 6' 4" 320# DT getting in a hassle with a 5' 11" 210# chubby guy that he apparently couldn't handle, since the EIGHT players got him down AND kicked him while down sending him to the hospital with a concussion. TWO local men were charged with attempted murder for kicking a man while down in a casino parking lot while down, but then that was caught on REQUIRED surveillance cameras. AND that man didn't have to go to the hospital. In the Knoxville incident the players (who were, against the rules, comped in by the owner) the OIC in charge "forgot" to ask for the surveillance film, which mysteriously didn't seem to have worked when they picked them up from the owner the next morning, what a coincidence. The police officer was their second victim, and the account I read said he was also kicked while down, I have never read your version before, probably a good cover story and retroactive history.
TU not having as many incidents as other legit Universities is a joke, NO charges from these TWO disgusting assaults from this ''incident", not even a parking ticket, (one player with two prior "incidents) dismissed for evading and resisting arrest later, probably because he couldn't outrun a fat cop. as well as only being concerned if a player has FIVE mj incidents compared to UK and Georgia having a limit of TWO. Similar to your starting QB facing no vandalism charges for the damage to the car because he paid for the damages, LOL, doesn't that sound like a confession to you?
This farce is among my favorite miscarriages of justice with the hurtt situation at the U and Transfer U probably ranking higher.
I still think those tapes the owner were left in charge of were probably worth a lot of money to the coach whose limosine arrived a short time later to pick up the players, and definitely was surprised to see no one sued by the two victims, still wonder what kind of car they were driving shortly after the incident. In my officials association we were supposed to be kicked out of the association if we were ever struck by anyone and didn't press charges, odd a police officer could laugh it off.
And I fully agree while I hate cheaters and the inept NCAA the way UK handled both the Hartline and Tubman cases was disgusting, along with other cases, UK has way too many disadvantages to let other schools get away with murder while being the biggest scaredycat around when it comes to the incompetent joke the NCAA has become. Caffey would have been a big star and fit well with the mj crew at UL while keeping eligible in their newly formed basketweaving lll class.
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Now I forget Jauk, what year was all that that happened at UT? Was that back when Ridge Wilson was at UK?
Keeping this fairly short and sweet. 1. We don't know what happened because the report was unclear about it. The person in the vehicle was not identified, and there was, to my knowledge, no official release of events. Pretty sure it was only stories told by members of VolQuest that "cleared up" what actually happened. 2. In the state of TN, and you would know this if you were a TN attorney, the keys do not have to be in the ignition and it does not matter if you drove the vehicle while drunk. Simply put, all that matters is that you are intoxicated and in control of a vehicle is functioning and the vehicle is somewhere frequented by the public (like a parking garage). 3. Hurd got a punishment that few others would have gotten. Plain and simple. Few, if any, laypersons are able to get arraigned on January 20th (according to sources) and turn around and have their charges dropped on January 21st, the very next day, for completing the requirements of his diversion. Really? You really think a judge is going to give a 1 day punishment to most 18 year-olds for committing a Class A misdemeanor? He got an extremely favorable treatment from the judicial system. 4. If you had read properly, you would have seen that the person whose case I am referring to was not my client.
He would start at Ole Miss, probably at State this year and no where else, he is very average back, quit reading his clippings and watch him play, feet are awful. Of course you also think Butch and his staff are top knotch too, so its no surprise you think Hurd is anything but average. Look at his stats, he averaged less than 5ypc, he wasn't top 15 in any RB stat, none, several teams had 2 backs with more production, so what exactly do you call him? He isn't an elite SEC back, he isn't an elite SEC frosh back, I didn't say he was awful, I said he was very average and that is exactly wh
Probably hard to remember that far back when you have only been around for 8 messages, where do you normally post?
I don't remember the year either, seems like that starting LB with a bright future as a football player didn't stay around long after that, do you remember that part?
To help you out I looked it up, seems like Wilson was in the 09 class and the eight thugs incident was in the summer of 10, so IIRC Ridge would probably have been starting for UK by then. I remember TU's first game that year was when they suspended ONE of the eight players for one game, the 50-0 cliffhanger against Tennessee Martin, never did find out who was suspended, the 6' 4" 320# DT or a third string special teams player. Odd that Dooley could punish anyone since he claimed there was no way to figure out who was really involved, LOL, a bunch of hardened criminals would never turn in someone that they "might" have thought shouldn't have kicked a man while down if you told them their scholarship was on the line. But it was TU, so maybe they all thought he deserved to be kicked in the head.
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What makes you believe Butch is a good coach? Has he beaten a ranked team yet? Has he come up with a way to win those tight games, no its actually be the other way around he has found a way to lose them. But one thing any team facing the vols can be prepared for, and thats everyone of them trying to end kids careers by taking their knees out, got Lattimore hate it for him but hopefully he is the last one.
Being the best passer in the East is like being the tallest dwarf, still not very tall or in this case a good passer.
Be careful Grumpy. I got blasted for calling out the Vols for going after knees and ankles to intentionally take out the other teams best player. I actually heard a UT defender on the local Knoxville sports station say that Randall Cobb would not cause them a problem in their upcoming game because he would not be effective without his "wheels". Needless to say Randall was an early casualty in the game. One went low and one went high and Randall's ankle went by by.
I'm not in Tennessee. But what we do know is that Jalen Hurd's case was only dismissed after showing he completed a drug and alcohol assessment course AND after 24 hours of community service. Maybe you think that's a light sentence for underage drinking, maybe you don't. I think it falls within the bounds of the law. I wasn't impugning you as an attorney, I was simply commenting that the person needed a better one.
Had been reading for a few years, but this thread just annoyed me so much I decided to make an account.
I remember there were a lot of discipline problems under Kiffin...which would have been 09. Despite the fact that Dooley might be the worst coach in the history of the SEC, maybe worse than Joker?...I don't think Dooley was around yet for the incident you are referring.Yeah he beat South Carolina in 2013, I think they were ranked #11. And again in 2014. His teams have played Georgia incredibly close in 2013 and 2014. He has won every game he was supposed to win (except Florida) and lost most games he was supposed to lose (except South Carolina, 2013). Considering he had to replace both sides of the line, I doubt many coaches would have done better. I think he is a good coach for the same reason I think Stoops is: energy, passion, and an intangible quality that just feels different. Tennessee fans know it because they have won in the past, the recognize that this feels much more like that, much less like Kiffin or Dooley. UK fans haven't really known success, but they will IMO.
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Had been reading for a few years, but this thread just annoyed me so much I decided to make an account.
Dooley was definitely there when that happened and was in charge of nothing happening to the players, they did know what they were doing when they hired him, you did know he has a law degree?
You do realize that very average back rushed for 120 yards and a TD on you and only 2 other backs rushed for more yards against you than Hurd.
He is pretty much right, although not overly articulate about it, about the Knoxville Bar fight. UT players got into a fight in a bar and they beat the snot out of some unnamed guy (later identified as Gary Russell). This turned into what witnesses called a brawl. The owner of the bar said there was 7-10 guys beating up one guy, and the police believed that it was mostly UT football players involved. The fight was not stopped, but was just pushed outside of the bar onto the street where an off duty KPD police officer stepped in and he was then struck in the head and suffered a fractured skull and took a trip to the ICU. Witnesses to the event tell a much different story than your story. They say he was struck on the head and not that he fell on the ground and hit his head. He may not have identified himself, but no news story that I have ever seen has him coming up and putting the guy in a choke hold, and when the guy fell that's when he cracked his head.
The bar owner stated that there must have been a "power surge" because his surveillance equipment stopped working 2 days before the fight.
Then, according to other articles, Darren Myles was attempting to flee the scene of the Knoxville Bar fight and was pursued by a UTPD officer. The UTPD officer attempted to detain him and Myles punched him in the face. Myles was the only UT player charged with assault.
The first story is probably the most in detail and is basically in line with what Jauk has said all along.
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=5378061
http://www.local8now.com/home/headlines/98093449.html
http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/07/09/bar-brawl-leaves-cop-injured-two-vols-charged/
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=5366458
Now... not one single UT player was charged with assault of either the off duty officer or Gary Russell. Yet, by all accounts the UT players were extremely aggressive and even attempted to use weapons (bar stools) in this fight. They could have been charged with aggravated assault, which is a Class C felony in Tennessee. Witnesses say there were up to 10 UT football players assaulting Mr. Russell, while Mr. Russell was on the ground, and despite that only 2 of them were arrested and they were arrested seemingly for entirely different offenses. Police stated that they were "continuing to investigate," but the story conveniently faded away and no one else was charged.
You also have the fact that a bar owner openly admitted that UT players have VIP status and do not have to pay a cover charge like the other students. This is an NCAA violation, though a small one, and yet I don't believe anything came of that either.
Everyone that tried to run the ball against us had success, so what does that prove? His season stats were 750 yards and a 4.7 apc. He wasn't in the top 15 in rushing yards, he wasn't in the top 15 for ypc. He is a very average SEC back who very likely won't start for you this year, if he does you will have to deal with a pouting Kamara on the sideline. At UGA he would have been redshirted or changed positions, 4th string at best in our opener last year. Kid runs like he is kicking horse turds out of the road, big with decent speed. As a UT fan you know what an elite back looks like, unless you become a fan in the last 4-5 years.
Here's where you're wrong. Hurd is 6-4 240 and runs in the 4.5 range. His change of direction and pad leverage isn't as good as 6' 200 lb RB, we get that but he isn't 6' 200lbs either. No his pad leverage looks bad against 5'9 DB, I'll give you that but how many of those DB's are gonna come up and hit him in the open field? Hurd put 2-3 guys out of the game including Florida's best LB last year because they tried to take him on. If you are gonna say he lacks this or that at least compare him to other RB's his size. You talk about Jones not being a very good coach and why I don't like "if and but's" you do realize Tn is a Pig Howard fumble in the end zone and a interception in the end zone from being 2-0 vs a much, much more talented UGA team. We shouldn't of been within 18 pts of you all in either game. So either your coach is doing a terrible job or Butch is taking a much lesser talented team and coaching them up. Which is it Bud?
We're not going 6-6, 5-7 again. Is CMR going to shank another game this year like he has the last 2-3 years?
Apparently those DBs don't have too much fear of coming up and taking Hurd on, he gained 750 yards starting every game, averaged 4.7 per carry, so who exactly is getting him on the ground before he get very far downfield, or is he tripping on his won feet? You don't like the if's and but's but yet you use those right? If UT hadn't let their grass grow like a pasture to slow us down last time we visited maybe we wouldn't have had 3 kids rip ACL's. As for as you saying your aren't going 6-6, 5-7 this season, that is a hope because at least 6 teams UT faces have an excellent chance to beat them at probably 5 will be favored.
UT is recruiting well, but does Butch have to beg the sites to inflate UT commit's rankings so it looks better than it actually does? It really isn't very flattering. One last thing, rent is due on Neyland and we are coming to collect soon.
LOL..... So now we are going to blame it on the grass. Not one Tennessee player had a leg injury against you all that day. Was the grass at your field too short last year? I'm sure it was something besides Tennessee coaches taking an undermanned team on the road against the preseason favorite in the east and putting Ga on their heals all day. No way this is possible. Also Hurd missed 2 complete games with a separated shoulder.
So here's what we have according to Grumpy. Tenn last year had an awful OL, a below average starter at RB, a QB that isn't very good and coaches that can't coach a lick but was 2 plays away from being 2-0 vs Georgia. Oh yeah.... It was the high grass that kept us in it the first year at Neyland. Even though UT was double digit underdogs in both games. You make some good points man.
Not sure what incident you are referring to. The only incident I could find was this one: http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/07/09/tennessee.football.brawl/
Dooley should have stuck with the law. He was a terrible football coach.
I think most Tennessee fans expect around 8 or 9 wins this season. I'd be surprised if it's less and I think that would place Jones on the hot seat going into 2016.
Really I think UT is going to be pretty good, I do think Kamara is a better back than Hurd but that's just an opinion. I think 8 is the least wins UT will get, UF shouldn't have beat UT last year, Bobo had a brain fart when we were up 14-0 in the first quarter, Chubb had over 100 yards on 11 touches and from about 3 min to go in the first quarter until it was over he got 4 touches. We kept running the ball might not have won, but they never stopped the run and we couldn't throw it a lick. I would call it one of Richt's wtf games, but we dominated the first quarter and Bobo wanted to make the passing game work, I might not be at the end of the season but I was glad to see him go. If we don't show up in Knoxville like we have done at several places the Vols will beat us, I don't think they do if we show up ready to play but coming off the Bama game it will be tough to get up 2 weeks in a row. I think we will win the East but we could beat Bama and UT while losing to USC and UF to kill the year. I think UT is the 2nd favorite, but I reserve the right to change those opinions when I see our qb play, whoever that is. Peace
Thx man, I don't know about the last 10 years, because there have been some good backs during that time. But he is a pretty good back and I don't think any UGA fan would trade him for any other back in the SEC.
Thanks for the help, wasn't looking forward to trying to find all those articles again. Now all we have to do is wait for his link on his version of what happened, it might take a while, I think I will take a nap while I wait, maybe a Rip Van Winkle snooze.
I'm not sure how much we should blame a fan for the revisionist story though, TU has a very proficient propaganda department, hard to tell what he read down there.
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[QUOTE="jauk11, post: 1825191, member: 5222"I'm not sure how much we should blame a fan for the revisionist story though, TU has a very proficient propaganda department, hard to tell what he read down there.[/QUOTE]
You mean like calling it attempted murder when literally nobody else has cooked that up?
Your hate blinds you.
You mean like calling it attempted murder when literally nobody else has cooked that up?
Your hate blinds you.
You mean like calling it attempted murder when literally nobody else has cooked that up?
Your hate blinds you.[/QUOTE]
Well, I didn't "cook that up" until a local case where two men (only two) were charged with just that when they kicked a man while down, caught on surveillance film. But in that case the man kicked didn't even go for treatment, and it didn't happen TWICE in the same night, so it doesn't seem that outlandish to me.
Now I do realize that this is Knoxville where the two victims were probably both big Vol fans, but wouldn't you think someone should have been charged with something out of TWO men going to the hospital, say like maybe a parking ticket, since it is Knoxville? LOL
So in your hater world, the DA, KPD, the Judge overlooked attempted murder.
Let me guess. .....your tin foil hat picked that up.
Let me guess. .....your tin foil hat picked that up.
At the very very least they overlooked simple assault charges, and the most likely charges that they overlooked were probably aggravated assault charges. Attempted second degree murder is a highly unlikely charge, but it isn't outside of the realm of possibility.
Still, the point is that there was a massive fight involving multiple people on one of the busiest streets and in one of the (previously) most popular clubs in Knoxville, and yet not one single person was arrested and charged as a result of those actual fights. People were charged as a result of other incidents, such as striking an officer (which was also later dropped), but not because of those fights. Those fights that sent two separate people to the hospital, and put at least one in ICU. There is no conspiracy theory about the fact that the Knoxville area justice system did little to nothing in regards to this incident. It is simply a clear and obvious truth.
There is the issue of intent. It is unlikely that a DA would have been able to prove that they intended to assault the officer and from what I've read (mostly from things posted here) the officer was knocked down in the scuffle. It is possible that the officer's preference was for all charges to be dropped and the prosecutor will usually take that into account. But, regardless they were removed from the team which is about all you can ask as far as the school is concerned.
What? First off... there are three different possible assaults (meaning 3 different people, at the very least were assaulted) that arose from this incident. 1. Bar patron. 2. Off-duty police officer 3. Active duty UTPD. The only assault charge was on number 3, which was later dropped.
In terms of the other 2, you don't have to prove intent, but I don't see how you would have any problem proving it. Did they repeatedly kick two people (regardless of who they were) while those two people were on the ground? Yes? Then at the very least that is intentional or reckless behavior that caused bodily injury to both parties. So, that is at the very least a simple assault. Now, I think when both parties go to the hospital and have to spend several days there that the injury becomes serious and the charge(s) can easily, and probably should have been, bumped to aggravated assault. No one has to prove that they intended to assault a police officer. They simply have to prove that they intended to cause bodily harm or recklessly caused bodily harm. Those are pretty darn simple to prove.
In terms of the officer dropping charges... well that's fine. What about the off duty officer? What about the bar patron who was adamant about wanting them brought to justice? Also... no charges were ever actually pressed on them so the victims couldn't actually ask the DA to drop the charges.
Lastly, they were not permanently removed from the team. If I am not mistaken only one of them, Myles, was actually kicked off the team. He being the only one actually charged with assault (number 3 above). There might have been some suspensions, but that's it. Pretty sure no one missed a single game because of the actual bar fights.
I'm not saying if I was 18 that I wouldn't knock off a couple of those girls, but if that's why you choose a school, then there's a good chance that you're going to wind up with a large group of kids who got lots of stuff going on outside of the football field. Tennessee has been unreal on the recruiting trail, but i think the tweet sheds light on why they're having off the field problems. I'm no recruiting expert, but is this the norm around the SEC? If so, then I see why Stoops already got a raise. I'm pretty sure UK doesn't do this kind of stuff in recruiting.
As I pointed out before, there was ONE suspension for ONE game, the 50-0 laugher against Tennessee Martin, lucky they pulled it out. But no word on who was suspended, the 6' 4" 320# DT originally involved or the third team special teams player-----not that it made any difference.
Could have been an issue similar to the EKU/UK player incident without video where the players were provoked. At UT, two players were suspended and later reinstated. One player was dismissed from the team.
Dude even Vanderbilt has girls to welcome recruits to campus, if UK doesn't no wonder it's a perpetual cellar dweller. Just to give a little history on having "student hosts" to greet recruits and their families, the practice actually started with Bear Bryant back in the 50s or 60s. Since then the practice has expanded to programs all around the country. Currently, every school in the SEC (maybe except UK?) has a hostess group and every single major program in college football today has a similar group.
Here's an article I thought was interesting on the subject: http://deadspin.com/5422547/a-brief-history-of-campus-recruiting-hostesses
My favorite quote "One high-profile recruit, she says, tried to lure her to his hotel room, saying, "The girls at Kentucky and Georgia did it."
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