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Good match up

May 13, 2015
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As a Jayhawk fan, I see similarities in our teams. Some highly rated new talent (Bragg, Diallo, Vick; Labissiére, Murray, Briscoe, Mathews, Mulder.), and some glaring needs met for both squads.

We are now better down low, and Heaven knows we needed to be, and you have a killer guard line-up (which you needed) not to offend about the Harrison's. I'm a guest here.

It's all questions at this point isn't it?

Have Mason and Graham come as far as we think they have? Frank looked great in the Games, but a true test?

Is this a NEW Selden, or a Selden against weaker/sower foes?

How good will Graham be coming off injury? Greene? Same question.

Will Svi step up to expectations?

Will Hunter get real minutes or will Coach Self continue to play Jamari Traylor despite the clear evidence that he is just not good at basketball?

Will Murray turn out to be as good as the hype? (And man, on this board there has been a LOT of hype).

Can Ulis score? We all know he is stupid quick with good court vision, but can he add 8 a game to keep defenses honest.

Your bigs. Can Skal and Poy really carry the load inside with Lee and Willis backing them? I know KU has some challenges inside, but your down-low is kind of suspect and dependent upon Skal to be great as a freshman.

Don't get me wrong. Tons of talent, but a little thin and a Freshman.

This would be a good year to evaluate both of our coaches. I would not trade Coach Self for Cal and know you all feel the same way.

Good year for basketball. I wish we would play more often. Home and homes would be nice.

Good luck to you. (Except at Allen of course).
 
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Good post.

Some legitimate questions.

I think both teams are legitimate contenders.

Both coaches are very good college coaches.

KU has questions about their talent.

UK has questions about experience (as usual) and depth.

UK's strength is its backcourt.

KU's strength is its frontcourt.

It should be good years for both teams.

I'd rather have UK's team because talent usually trumps experience and depth doesn't matter much once tourney play starts.
 
Good post.

Some legitimate questions.

I think both teams are legitimate contenders.

Both coaches are very good college coaches.

KU has questions about their talent.

UK has questions about experience (as usual) and depth.

UK's strength is its backcourt.

KU's strength is its frontcourt.

It should be good years for both teams.

I'd rather have UK's team because talent usually trumps experience and depth doesn't matter much once tourney play starts.
 
I think it a great chance for our respective coach to show what they can do with un-proven talent combined with what, these days, we call veterans.

You are stacked (again), but I think Perry and Selden give KU the edge.

With respect.
 
Hey you guys are going to be good. Yall will be a top 5ish team all year long. But the fact is we're the better team and we'll be the most dominate team in college just like we were last year. We most likely have the 1st overall pick and another top 5 pick. Ulis will be the best PG in the nation I really believe that and hell yeah he will score. Murray's just the real deal. He's a pure scorer, and Skal will be the best player in the country. He's an AD type. Similar skill set. No disrespect but we're better than you guys at every position. And we also have depth and experience to go along with our elite level talent so.....
 
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By the way Jayhawks fans. Who do you think will be starting for yall??? If the foreign kid is going to be as good as I hear he will be then he'll probably start right? But you all have a bunch of possibilities. I'd guess this...

Graham
Mason
Selden
Ellis
Diallo

Or
Mason
Selden
Svi
Bragg
Diallo

Or maybe go big?
Mason
Selden
Ellis
Bragg
Diallo

I mean you guys got a lot of possibilities.
 
Good, friendly post man.....here is my main objection to what many think about UK this year. Our Post play.
First off, Skal is the #1 center in the class and likely the number 1 pick in the draft next summer. That position is solid for us. Second, Alex Poythress is a beast. He has 4 years of experience, and to me if you compare him to any incoming freshman, or current college player at the forward, Alex has more than any of them. So, that position is solid. At the next forward spot, whether it ends up as a true 3, a stretch 4 playing the 3, etc, we have many options. Marcus Lee exploded onto the scene in the Michigan game, during the tournament 2 years ago. He's shown what he can do. He is 6'-9" and uber athletic. Or we could play Murray there, in a 3 guard lineup.

Now, the backcourt is ridiculous. Ulis and Briscoe are tough as nails, and can score. Murray is a freak that can do it all. These guys are interchangeable too...
Ulis\Briscoe\Murray
Briscoe/Mathews
Murray \Mathews\Willis
Poythress\Lee\Willis/Winyard
Labissierre \Winyard

And don't forget, we will be adding Tai Winyard in December. He is 6'-9" 255 and won the MVP of the U18 world 3x3 championships.
http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcspo...to-gold-at-u18-3x3-world-championships-video/
 
We'll look like this

Tyler Ulis
Isaiah Briscoe
Jamal Murray
Alex Poythress
Skal Labissiere

Bench:
Charles Mathews
Mychal Mulder
Marcus Lee
 
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No offense to the OP, but you have to be a pure homer to say you wouldn't trade for Calipari. Time and time again Cal has proved he's the better coach at UK compared to Self. Kansas will be good this season, but I don't think they will achieve much more than another Big 12 title.
 
No offense to the OP, but you have to be a pure homer to say you wouldn't trade for Calipari. Time and time again Cal has proved he's the better coach at UK compared to Self. Kansas will be good this season, but I don't think they will achieve much more than another Big 12 title.

Yeah take the guy who has been to what 4 final fours in 5 years or Bill " mid major beat down " Self . Such a tough one .. LOL. KU will be a top 5 team IMO but will do there usual thing . They will lose 3-4 times in non conference schedule and then dominate the Big 12 again and fall in sweet 16 of the tourney .
 
As a Jayhawk fan, I see similarities in our teams. Some highly rated new talent (Bragg, Diallo, Vick; Labissiére, Murray, Briscoe, Mathews, Mulder.), and some glaring needs met for both squads.

We are now better down low, and Heaven knows we needed to be, and you have a killer guard line-up (which you needed) not to offend about the Harrison's. I'm a guest here.

It's all questions at this point isn't it?

Have Mason and Graham come as far as we think they have? Frank looked great in the Games, but a true test?

Is this a NEW Selden, or a Selden against weaker/sower foes?

How good will Graham be coming off injury? Greene? Same question.

Will Svi step up to expectations?

Will Hunter get real minutes or will Coach Self continue to play Jamari Traylor despite the clear evidence that he is just not good at basketball?

Will Murray turn out to be as good as the hype? (And man, on this board there has been a LOT of hype).

Can Ulis score? We all know he is stupid quick with good court vision, but can he add 8 a game to keep defenses honest.

Your bigs. Can Skal and Poy really carry the load inside with Lee and Willis backing them? I know KU has some challenges inside, but your down-low is kind of suspect and dependent upon Skal to be great as a freshman.

Don't get me wrong. Tons of talent, but a little thin and a Freshman.

This would be a good year to evaluate both of our coaches. I would not trade Coach Self for Cal and know you all feel the same way.

Good year for basketball. I wish we would play more often. Home and homes would be nice.

Good luck to you. (Except at Allen of course).
 
I think this is the most well thought out post by a Kansas fan on this site ever. We realize you guys will be good, however it is hard to give you any credit when none is ever thrown our way. It will be a great game and there are a lot of questions to be answered for both teams.
 
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I get that KU has had major fails in the tournament. Any idiot can see that. And we hate it.

We played you pretty well in 2012, considering what we had vs what you had. We were in the game.

This year, I think we are more than "in the game".

You are loaded, as always, but in a year when both teams are roughly equal, give me Bill Self as game coach over Coach Calipari.
 
I get that KU has had major fails in the tournament. Any idiot can see that. And we hate it.

We played you pretty well in 2012, considering what we had vs what you had. We were in the game.

This year, I think we are more than "in the game".

You are loaded, as always, but in a year when both teams are roughly equal, give me Bill Self as game coach over Coach Calipari.

On a neutral floor, I take UK.

In Lawrence, you guys should win.

By March, on a neutral floor, I think UK is better.
 
Glad to see KU fan with post. KU fans love basketball just as much as UK fans. And they respect UK's tradition. Most, however, dislike/hate Cal. We will have a tough game at AFH in January. Can't wait for that game.
 
If our question marks are whether Murray is good and Skal can be great as a freshman, then we're in for a fantastic year.
 
I get that KU has had major fails in the tournament. Any idiot can see that. And we hate it.

We played you pretty well in 2012, considering what we had vs what you had. We were in the game.

This year, I think we are more than "in the game".

You are loaded, as always, but in a year when both teams are roughly equal, give me Bill Self as game coach over Coach Calipari.
I don't see Kansas and Kentucky as having equal talent. It's close, but UK will have the two best players in the game. I think Kansas has a good chance of winning because the game is at Kansas. Other than that, I think UK has the better team and coach. If UK can win at Louisville, they can win at Kansas.
 
I don't see Kansas and Kentucky as having equal talent. It's close, but UK will have the two best players in the game. I think Kansas has a good chance of winning because the game is at Kansas. Other than that, I think UK has the better team and coach. If UK can win at Louisville, they can win at Kansas.
I keep forgetting that Diallo went to Kansas. They will have a tough front line for sure. After watching Murray this weekend I can't imagine anybody in college that can hang with him. I mean Melo Trimble will prob be a first team all-american preseason and he could not get off the bench for team USA. Murray lit the guy up the was playing ahead of Trimble.
 
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This would be a good year to evaluate both of our coaches. I would not trade Coach Self for Cal and know you all feel the same way.
Why is this a good year to evaluate both coaches? Every year has been a good time to evaluate the coaches.

Since Cal became the coach at UK, only once (and thanks to Nerlens Noel blowing out his knee) has Self ended the year better Calipari.

In 2010 you guys had Sherron Collins, Cole Aldrich, Xavier Henry and the #1 overall seed and couldn't manage to pull out the game against Ali Farroukmanesh. Our season was a disappointment as well, but ended two rounds later.

In 2011 I believe it was 11-seeded VCU that knocked you guys out. Calipari? Final Four.

What happened in 2012?

In 2013. Well congrats to Bill Self he finally had a better season that Calipari.

In 2014. A once-in-a-generation talent like Andrew Wiggins led you to a 2nd round exit against a 10-seeded Stanford. Meanwhile Calipari made the natioinal title game.

In 2015 you guys got pushed around by L'il Bro in the Sweet-16 while your OAD talent fizzled most of the season (top-10 recruits Anderson went undrafted, and Oubre fell out of the lottery). Meanwhile Calipari made his 4th final four in 5 years.

So yeah. You can evaluate the coaches this year if you want.
 
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He thinks this year is a good year to evaluate coaches because KU might actually have a shot.

Good luck.
 
You are loaded, as always, but in a year when both teams are roughly equal, give me Bill Self as game coach over Coach Calipari.

Yeah. We hear this line a lot from UofL fans every year.

It really is amazing to watch how the teams are "roughly equal" before the game. Afterwards it becomes, "well any idiot could win with that much talent." Frankly I don't see the teams as roughly equal. What I have learned from watching Self over the years is that his freshman are hit or miss. Rarely (although it can happen) do freshman studs live up to their potential under Self. Calipari isn't infallible, but he has a much higher batting average than anyone else.
 
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We gotta gotta come up with a handy way to remember the outcome of these things. Along the lines of L1C7.
 
As a Jayhawk fan, I see similarities in our teams. Some highly rated new talent (Bragg, Diallo, Vick; Labissiére, Murray, Briscoe, Mathews, Mulder.), and some glaring needs met for both squads.

We are now better down low, and Heaven knows we needed to be, and you have a killer guard line-up (which you needed) not to offend about the Harrison's. I'm a guest here.

It's all questions at this point isn't it?

Have Mason and Graham come as far as we think they have? Frank looked great in the Games, but a true test?

Is this a NEW Selden, or a Selden against weaker/sower foes?

How good will Graham be coming off injury? Greene? Same question.

Will Svi step up to expectations?

Will Hunter get real minutes or will Coach Self continue to play Jamari Traylor despite the clear evidence that he is just not good at basketball?

Will Murray turn out to be as good as the hype? (And man, on this board there has been a LOT of hype).

Can Ulis score? We all know he is stupid quick with good court vision, but can he add 8 a game to keep defenses honest.

Your bigs. Can Skal and Poy really carry the load inside with Lee and Willis backing them? I know KU has some challenges inside, but your down-low is kind of suspect and dependent upon Skal to be great as a freshman.

Don't get me wrong. Tons of talent, but a little thin and a Freshman.

This would be a good year to evaluate both of our coaches. I would not trade Coach Self for Cal and know you all feel the same way.

Good year for basketball. I wish we would play more often. Home and homes would be nice.

Good luck to you. (Except at Allen of course).


No way would we even consider trading Cal.
Recruiting ... Cal
Developing team for April ... Cal
Bench coach ... Toss up
Developing talent for the league ... Cal
 
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KU never really loses at home. It will be tough to beat them there...that is the one game this season I expect to lose going into the season.

The other games that make me go "Uh oh" are @Vandy, @A&M, and @Arkansas and @UCLA and of course Duke on the neutral court. 4/5 of those have nothing to do with the other team being better than UK...I just smell a rat with officiating in those games already. I'm not saying UK is going to lose those 4 road games...they will just be tough with @IU/@UNC level officiating going on. We all know what happens @Vandy all the time, and one of the last times (maybe the last time?) UK played at UCLA they got royally screwed in 94/95.
 
No way would we even consider trading Cal.
Recruiting ... Cal
Developing team for April ... Cal
Bench coach ... Toss up
Developing talent for the league ... Cal
I'm not sure we can really say that. In the 6 years that Cal has been at UK, Bill Self has lost to the following teams:
Northern Iowa (8 seed), VCU (11 seed), Stanford (10 Seed), Wichita State (7 seed).

Even in 2013 Kansas lost as a 1-seed to a 4-seed Michigan. Only in 2012 did Kansas lose to a team seeded or ranked higher than them. Only one time in the 6 year span did Bill Self manage to beat a team seeded higher.... that was in 2012 when his #2 seeded Kansas beat the #1 seeded UNC (who had lost Kendall Marshall to a broken hand). Not a good look for such a great bench coach.
 
KU never really loses at home. It will be tough to beat them there...that is the one game this season I expect to lose going into the season.

The other games that make me go "Uh oh" are @Vandy, @A&M, and @Arkansas and @UCLA and of course Duke on the neutral court. 4/5 of those have nothing to do with the other team being better than UK...I just smell a rat with officiating in those games already. I'm not saying UK is going to lose those 4 road games...they will just be tough with @IU/@UNC level officiating going on. We all know what happens @Vandy all the time, and one of the last times (maybe the last time?) UK played at UCLA they got royally screwed in 94/95.
Really? Those two?

I can understand anticipating a loss at Kansas. I actually think we might lose this one too. PAFH is a tough place to play. But Arkansas might be one of the worst teams in the (former) West next year. And UCLA's best player might be Bryce Alford.
 
Can Tyler Ulis give us 8-10 a game? Humm, he averaged 5.6 as a freshman when he wasn't asked to score. It's a safe bet that as a sophmore he'll put up a couple more baskets a game. Made 43% of his 3's and took 77, I'd say the kid will hit double digits if UK needs him to do so.
 
Really? Those two?

I can understand anticipating a loss at Kansas. I actually think we might lose this one too. PAFH is a tough place to play. But Arkansas might be one of the worst teams in the (former) West next year. And UCLA's best player might be Bryce Alford.

I am not predicting UK to lose EITHER game. I just expect those to be frustrating games that are closer than YOU think they will be due to the raping the officials will perform on UK. I agree, on paper they should be easy wins. That UCLA game is also UK's first road game.
 
Gossie is throwing bombs. I came in here ready to start posting replies, but he's got it handled. Jesus, man. On a Monday, no less.
 
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I'm not sure we can really say that. In the 6 years that Cal has been at UK, Bill Self has lost to the following teams:
Northern Iowa (8 seed), VCU (11 seed), Stanford (10 Seed), Wichita State (7 seed).

Even in 2013 Kansas lost as a 1-seed to a 4-seed Michigan. Only in 2012 did Kansas lose to a team seeded or ranked higher than them. Only one time in the 6 year span did Bill Self manage to beat a team seeded higher.... that was in 2012 when his #2 seeded Kansas beat the #1 seeded UNC (who had lost Kendall Marshall to a broken hand). Not a good look for such a great bench coach.


I hear ya. Self would not be among my first picks for X's and O's especially when it counts.
 
Gossie is throwing bombs. I came in here ready to start posting replies, but he's got it handled. Jesus, man. On a Monday, no less.
I gotta stay sharp in the off-season. I don't even really dislike Bill Self. He's relatively harmless. I just get riled up when people try to argue he is a better X/O coach than Calipari. Sadly some of our own fans even buy into this garbage.
 
I am not predicting UK to lose EITHER game. I just expect those to be frustrating games that are closer than YOU think they will be due to the raping the officials will perform on UK. I agree, on paper they should be easy wins. That UCLA game is also UK's first road game.
That's fair. I misunderstood your original point.

If you would have told me last year that UK's two most difficult regular season games would be at home to Ole Miss and on the road at Texas A&M, I wouldn't have believed it. I still don't know if I see it with either team just based on the rosters, but I suppose we can't foreclose the possibility of difficult road games for this young team.
 
I think you'd be crazy to not trade Self for Coach Cal straight up. Cal gives you a chance to win it every year. KU has a chance once every 4 years.
 
I think you'd be crazy to not trade Self for Coach Cal straight up. Cal gives you a chance to win it every year. KU has a chance once every 4 years.

I don't think the Cal-Self comparison is close in terms of the time frame Cal has been at Kentucky . Self has only done better one year in the NCAA'S (2013), has not won a title and Cal has been beating him up, and you don't get any bigger than for a National Championship. (2012) Finishing first in the Big 12 every year (simply the pecking order of that league) isn't on the same level as four Final Four's in six seasons. (11,12,14,15)
 
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I don't think the Cal-Self comparison is close in terms of the time frame Cal has been at Kentucky . Self has only done better one year in the NCAA'S (2013), has not won a title and Cal has been beating him up, and you don't get any bigger than for a National Championship. (2012) Finishing first in the Big 12 every year (simply the pecking order of that league) isn't on the same level as four Final Four's in six seasons. (11,12,14,15)
Well said.
 
I simply meant similar in terms of having a nice mix of veterans and Freshmen. It was upon this belief that I stated it would be a good year to compare coaches.

Old debate, I know, but I believe Coach Self develops talent better than does Coach Cal. I know about Our two big misses (Selby and Alexander), but there have been way more successes. Withey, Morris twins, Thomas Robinson, Cole Aldrich to name a few.

And UK has had misses as well. The Harrisons for example.

Are KU success stories tearing up the League? No. Would any of them BE in the League if not developed by Self and staff? Probably not.

And I DO believe we have equal talent to UK.

Mason>Ulis
Brisco=Graham
Murray>Selden (from what I've seen so far. But Murray is a freshman, Selden a junior so may turn out closer to =. And we have Greene and Svi as back-up.
Ellis>Poy
Labissière>Diallo. Maybe. Different players, different strengths.

Bench: KU>>>UK. Greene, Svi, Vick, Mickelson, Lucus are just better than they guys Coach Cal has recruited over. Not a criticism, Self recruited over the last two on the list as well. Our's are just better IMO.

And if I had one criticism of the fans on this board, and I say this with respect, it would be the constant blaming of/complaining about officiating. We all think our teams get screwed guys, but this board almost has a tinfoil hat thing going. This thread, for example, has UK In tight games or losses because of the officiating BEFORE the season starts.

We can all agree Duke gets the whistle. They just do and I effing hate it.

But come on. It's actually pretty fair if not tilted in our (blue bloods) favor most nights.
 
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