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For those of you who think Dakari could not have helped his draft status

Jan 15, 2003
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by returning......IMHO you are dead wrong. Could have improved in all facets of his game just by the fact of playing more and being a year older as he is still very young. If Dakari had of had a good season this year his dire combine numbers would not hurt him nearly as bad. I personally and have always thought that Dakari needed one more year in college and made a mistake in leaving. With increased confidence I really believe that Dakari would have been a special player by the end of next season and maybe even a lottery pick if he had stayed for his senior year. Just one fans opinion......
 
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Folks who like to play the "he can't improve his stock" game show their ignorance by negating the realities of a weaker draft. If a kid moves up 5 spots in a weaker draft, he's essentially proved all the naysayers wrong, did he not? That said, I've never understood the contrarians who express their viewpoints in definitive statements. It's just ill-fated to write anything in stone like that, especially when the last 5 or 6 drafts are littered in cases of guys improving stock by returning.
 
His stock has done nothing but drop since he's been here. He's a late first rounder, a handful of spots is still late first round and that's assuming he doesn't just come back and confirm the limitations he is viewed to have. The money isn't worth spending another year in school. Unless you're one of those people who thinks you don't improve once you move on to the next level, there isn't much of a reason to come back.
 
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He looked better as a freshmen because he was playing alongside Randle who matched his game better. Essentially, he could just be a garbage man.
 
Has the draft already been held? I guess I was unaware that draft order was locked in at the combine.
 
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His stock has done nothing but drop since he's been here. He's a late first rounder, a handful of spots is still late first round and that's assuming he doesn't just come back and confirm the limitations he is viewed to have. The money isn't worth spending another year in school. Unless you're one of those people who thinks you don't improve once you move on to the next level, there isn't much of a reason to come back.[/QUOTE

Nm
 
He won't be more athletic next year, or 10 years from now for that matter. He is what he is. Every year he waits, he loses a year of earning money.

I really don't see how this is debatable.


I'm sorry but that doesn't mean that he cannot improve. Although I think he is a bit more athletic than most give him credit for on here, I do see your point about not being an elite type athlete but there are plenty of centers that have made an incredible career with a lot less than Dakari has to work with. Robert Parrish was about as athletic as a park bench but had an amazing career and there are countless others. It may not be debatable about his athleticism but that does not mean that he cannot improve every year that he plays.
 
Yes, he could have helped his draft status, but he could have also hurt it. Being a year older is not a good thing. Also, the more you play, the more you lose the "potential" that teams love so much. and let's not forget the injury potential. If a kid can get drafted in the first round, he should go, in my opinion.
 
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His stock has done nothing but drop since he's been here. He's a late first rounder, a handful of spots is still late first round and that's assuming he doesn't just come back and confirm the limitations he is viewed to have. The money isn't worth spending another year in school. Unless you're one of those people who thinks you don't improve once you move on to the next level, there isn't much of a reason to come back.

Johnson needed lots of playing time to improve his game which is exactly what he didn't get. The Platoon system was good for the team but it was awful for players like Johnson that desperately need playing time to improve his game. He didn't come back because he had no reason to think that his playing time would change that much if Cal had landed all the recruits he wanted.
 
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by returning......IMHO you are dead wrong. Could have improved in all facets of his game just by the fact of playing more and being a year older as he is still very young. If Dakari had of had a good season this year his dire combine numbers would not hurt him nearly as bad. I personally and have always thought that Dakari needed one more year in college and made a mistake in leaving. With increased confidence I really believe that Dakari would have been a special player by the end of next season and maybe even a lottery pick if he had stayed for his senior year. Just one fans opinion......


Being a year older would not help him. He definitely will not jump higher or run faster, the kid lost a ton of weight already. He might develop a better drop step or something, free throws continue to improve but the pro's can fix that stuff much faster.

That said, I wish they all would have stayed.
 
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Look at James Michael McAdoo, he went from potential lotto pick his freshman year, to late first/second round his sophomore year to being undrafted his junior year. The longer you stay, the less potential you are perceived to have especially if you don't improve a ton from one year to the next. I would also argue that JMM improved more this year than he did during his 3 years in college.
 
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He won't be more athletic next year, or 10 years from now for that matter. He is what he is. Every year he waits, he loses a year of earning money.

I really don't see how this is debatable.

The losing money every year debate- gotta love it. If he makes it in the NBA does it really matter if he goes at age 20 and retires at 30. Oh if only I had gone at 19 life would be so much different now. Conversely if he isn't going to make it he will be out of the league within 2-3 years so again why does it matter what age he is when he declares. Not to pick on your post but one of the often repeated things I see on here that makes absolutely zero sense.
 
The losing money every year debate- gotta love it. If he makes it in the NBA does it really matter if he goes at age 20 and retires at 30. Oh if only I had gone at 19 life would be so much different now. Conversely if he isn't going to make it he will be out of the league within 2-3 years so again why does it matter what age he is when he declares. Not to pick on your post but one of the often repeated things I see on here that makes absolutely zero sense.


Because age makes a big difference to the NBA. I get your point, but the truth is the longer you wait the more your value can drop because of age and more time to expose your deficiencies.
 
I'm sorry but that doesn't mean that he cannot improve. Although I think he is a bit more athletic than most give him credit for on here, I do see your point about not being an elite type athlete but there are plenty of centers that have made an incredible career with a lot less than Dakari has to work with. Robert Parrish was about as athletic as a park bench but had an amazing career and there are countless others. It may not be debatable about his athleticism but that does not mean that he cannot improve every year that he plays.

Mmm are you talking about THE Robert Parish who was something like a 7x nba all star? If your talking about that Robert Parrish you are sorely mistaken if you think Dakari and Mr Parish are par on their athletic ability. Unless your talking about when he was in his last season with the bills when he was like 45 yrs old then you may have an argument. Parish played at a Lousinana college and him and some other guy were ruled Ineligible to play but they played em anyway. Parish averaged close to 20/20 a game their and had em always ranked nationally.
Kevin McKale wasn't as athletic as Parrish was but was still more athletic than Dakari. Both guys were so much more skilled it's not even the same thing and unfair to Dakari to be compared to any of those guys back in the day. They had much more skilled guys back then.

I just thought of a guy that Dakari might be the equal too but he was a bigger guy, much bigger and he was a car mechanic. Lol his name was Mark Eaton.
 
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Because age makes a big difference to the NBA. I get your point, but the truth is the longer you wait the more your value can drop because of age and more time to expose your deficiencies.
Yep, age is a big part of scouting in the NBA. The longer you stay in college, the less potential you are perceived to have, and the more scouts expose your deficiencies. Also, I would argue that player development is better in the NBA/D League than in college. Last but not least, if you make it in the league to stay, getting to your second and third contract a year or two earlier can be nice.

To put in bluntly, NBA drafts on potential first and foremost, and the longer a player stays in college, the older that player is and therefore they are perceived to have less potential than the year before which essentially hurts their draft stock not to mention the longer you stay the more scouts pick out your deficiencies.
 
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The losing money every year debate- gotta love it. If he makes it in the NBA does it really matter if he goes at age 20 and retires at 30. Oh if only I had gone at 19 life would be so much different now. Conversely if he isn't going to make it he will be out of the league within 2-3 years so again why does it matter what age he is when he declares. Not to pick on your post but one of the often repeated things I see on here that makes absolutely zero sense.

In what career field would you voluntarily sacrifice a year of earning power?

A guy like Kendrick Perkins, who Dakari could have a similar career as, is making $10 million this year as a veteran big who doesn't even play much. You'd give up that year and $10 million to maybe go 8 spots higher and spend another year at Kentucky to make an extra few hundred thousand on the rookie deal?
 
I'm sorry but that doesn't mean that he cannot improve. Although I think he is a bit more athletic than most give him credit for on here, I do see your point about not being an elite type athlete but there are plenty of centers that have made an incredible career with a lot less than Dakari has to work with. Robert Parrish was about as athletic as a park bench but had an amazing career and there are countless others. It may not be debatable about his athleticism but that does not mean that he cannot improve every year that he plays.

Of course he can improve. But not enough to significantly improve his draft stock.

He's decently athletic. But he posted the worst vertical of anyone. And as another poster pointed out - you can't compare 45 year old Parrish to 20 year old Dakari.

Damaris weakness is lack of explosive athleticism. Another year or 5 won't fix that.
 
You are correct witness that player development is better in the DL than in college. No doubt about that, main reason being Anderson going off about that spill about the development of guys that had everybody on this board in a Tizzy.
Our coaches in college today really do not teach a whole lot as most guys only stay 1 yr 2 at the most. It takes time and repitition and with the 20 hrs a week of practice and staff can only do so much.
Today it is really rare to have a guy come in that knows the game as they spend most of their time playing video games or thinking of a new dunk instead of learning how to position their feet, making drop steps to the basket, how to seal your man and post him up using nothing but your hip and pivot foot. Today it seems that absolutely no skill is being taught and it's a shame too. Thats why the college and pro game are deemed practically unwatchable these days.
 
He didnt lose too much weight since he weighed in at 264 at the combine. He was 260 throughout most of the year. Same weight he was last year. He just played worse this year. If he cant outmuscle colleve guys at 7 foot and 265 he definitely wont in the nba. Since he will never be athletic he might as well bulk to a powerful 285 and eat rebounds like it's going out of style and them learn to shoot a jumper.
 
In what career field would you voluntarily sacrifice a year of earning power?

A guy like Kendrick Perkins, who Dakari could have a similar career as, is making $10 million this year as a veteran big who doesn't even play much. You'd give up that year and $10 million to maybe go 8 spots higher and spend another year at Kentucky to make an extra few hundred thousand on the rookie deal?

Every college graduate sacrifices 4-8 years of earnings or more while mostly racking up an average of $40,000 debt along the way. So unless you are going to college to be a doctor, lawyer, CPA or the like that an actual degree is required basically you are doing nothing but wasting your time and costing yourself money with this logic. It is a stupid argument, period. With the money these guys are making it should not matter what age they are when they go or when they get their second contract etc. The league minimum is $507,000 which if managed correctly would go along way for life security even if they only had that for two seasons.

But since 60% of NBA players file for Bankruptcy within 5 years of playing their last game so does it really matter?
 
by returning......IMHO you are dead wrong. Could have improved in all facets of his game just by the fact of playing more and being a year older as he is still very young. If Dakari had of had a good season this year his dire combine numbers would not hurt him nearly as bad. I personally and have always thought that Dakari needed one more year in college and made a mistake in leaving. With increased confidence I really believe that Dakari would have been a special player by the end of next season and maybe even a lottery pick if he had stayed for his senior year......

Criminy, I thought we all knew by now that this is NOT how it works. Being "a year older" is considered a BAD thing in draft stock calculation, and "very young" a good thing, because the NBA drafts primarily based upon an assessment of future potential. The older you are the less untapped room for improvement you're deemed to have.

And whether Dakari's stock "could" have risen with another year is irrelevant, all sorts of shit in life theoretically "could" happen, but intelligent people make career decisions based upon what's most likely to happen. And there's NO reason for Dakari to think the "most likely" result of yet another UK year for him would be a dramatic improvement in his stock.

The kid's stock has done nothing but fall since he left high school as the No. 1 rated big man. The longer he's stayed at UK the worse his stock has gotten, so why should he believe yet another year would suddenly reverse that trend? He'd still be a backup (behind Skal), he'd still have those glaring athletic limitations, and he'd be yet another year older (which scouts dislike).

Combine that with the risk of devastating injury or knee/foot problems (hardly a rarity with heavy 7 footers) during an extra year destroying what remains of his stock and the kid absolutely made a logical and wise choice to leave now. Get your money while you still can, Dakari.
 
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Mmm are you talking about THE Robert Parish who was something like a 7x nba all star? If your talking about that Robert Parrish you are sorely mistaken if you think Dakari and Mr Parish are par on their athletic ability. Unless your talking about when he was in his last season with the bills when he was like 45 yrs old then you may have an argument. Parish played at a Lousinana college and him and some other guy were ruled Ineligible to play but they played em anyway. Parish averaged close to 20/20 a game their and had em always ranked nationally.
Kevin McKale wasn't as athletic as Parrish was but was still more athletic than Dakari. Both guys were so much more skilled it's not even the same thing and unfair to Dakari to be compared to any of those guys back in the day. They had much more skilled guys back then.

I just thought of a guy that Dakari might be the equal too but he was a bigger guy, much bigger and he was a car mechanic. Lol his name was Mark Eaton.



Come on now, I never compared Dakari's game to Parrish's game. Did not say anything that about their games' being similar. Do you really think i would compare Dakari to Parrish? I simply stated that Parrish was not the greatest athlete. Not that he will have a comparable career at all. Parrish was a great player but he wasn't a great athlete. Everyone acts like if you are not a great athlete then you are doomed in the NBA and its just not the case. You actually kinda made my point by listing his accolades.
 
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I don't think Randle matching his game had much to do with him looking better unless you are saying that Randle drew doubles in the paint, thus helping Dakari. That I would tend to agree more with but I still don't think it

It's simple. Last year, Dakari was a garbage man, feasting on putbacks. He excelled in that role. This year, he posted up a lot. He struggled in that department.
 
He would not have played much more so I doubt he would have improved that much in the limited minutes he would have earned.
 
Of course he can improve. But not enough to significantly improve his draft stock.

He's decently athletic. But he posted the worst vertical of anyone. And as another poster pointed out - you can't compare 45 year old Parrish to 20 year old Dakari.

Damaris weakness is lack of explosive athleticism. Another year or 5 won't fix that.

I wasn't comparing 45 yr old or 22 yr old Parrish to Dakari. Just saying its possible to have a good career when you are not an elite athlete. I'm not comparing their games or anything else, just Parrish as an example of players who are not great athletes who made food careers for them self. Chuck Hayes would be another that many said would not have a career, yet he has. I just get tired of everyone writing him off because he is not a great athlete. I am a believer that he could improve his draft stock by coming back. Agree or disagree is fine, that's just my opinion. Yes, I know his limitations but I still think he could significantly improve his stock with Cal and having more minutes like he would this year. I know its not popular on here but its how I feel. I'm not saying that it would definitely happen as its a sure risk but to say that it wouldn't happen for a fact is ridiculous. Like I said, I know the limitations of his athleticism but even knowing that, it is my opinion that he could improve his draft stock by coming back for another year. Hell, he has already improved his stock at the combine.
 
Dakari blew his future by jumping early...

Which would actually be the first time he jumped at all
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Ukcatsfreak I think what people are getting at is that Parrish and now even Chuck Hayes whom you mentioned are both pretty athletic guys. They do not have elite athleticsm where they have 45" verticles but they are really athletic guys. Dakari is not even on par with any of them athletically. He is much less athletic. Larry Bird was much less athletic than Parrish and Bird is light years ahead of Dakari.
Besides having no Verticle whatsoever he can't get down court and that's going to hurt him more than anything. Hayes Max Verticle in the nba combine was 33" so he is a decent athlete while having a really good skill set.
I understand what your trying to get across is that these guys have skill and have stayed in the league a long time with their skill and knew how to use it. Well the problem so far with Dakari is that he is not skilled like they are at all. Can the DL teach him skill? Can he even make it down court before the other team is on their way back? It's all just if's when's and but's right now with Dakari.

And yes to the poster above about Randle drawing double and triple teams did help out Dakari tremendously.
 
Every college graduate sacrifices 4-8 years of earnings or more while mostly racking up an average of $40,000 debt along the way. So unless you are going to college to be a doctor, lawyer, CPA or the like that an actual degree is required basically you are doing nothing but wasting your time and costing yourself money with this logic. It is a stupid argument, period. With the money these guys are making it should not matter what age they are when they go or when they get their second contract etc. The league minimum is $507,000 which if managed correctly would go along way for life security even if they only had that for two seasons.

But since 60% of NBA players file for Bankruptcy within 5 years of playing their last game so does it really matter?

Because you need a degree for those jobs. You don't to play basketball. There is nothing stupid about the argument that you shouldn't work for free or waste a year of earning power for no significant pay increase down the line.

If you want to rant and rave about players going broke, fine, but that has nothing to do with the discussion at hand except to further highlight the point that every year of salary is valuable.

The only person several hundred thousand or millions of dollars "doesn't matter" to is a person debating someone else's money.

If your only point is that they make a lot of money, and therefore they should stay in school because lots of money is lots of money, then I don't know what to tell you.
 
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Ukcatsfreak I think what people are getting at is that Parrish and now even Chuck Hayes whom you mentioned are both pretty athletic guys. They do not have elite athleticsm where they have 45" verticles but they are really athletic guys. Dakari is not even on par with any of them athletically. He is much less athletic. Larry Bird was much less athletic than Parrish and Bird is light years ahead of Dakari.
Besides having no Verticle whatsoever he can't get down court and that's going to hurt him more than anything. Hayes Max Verticle in the nba combine was 33" so he is a decent athlete while having a really good skill set.
I understand what your trying to get across is that these guys have skill and have stayed in the league a long time with their skill and knew how to use it. Well the problem so far with Dakari is that he is not skilled like they are at all. Can the DL teach him skill? Can he even make it down court before the other team is on their way back? It's all just if's when's and but's right now with Dakari.

And yes to the poster above about Randle drawing double and triple teams did help out Dakari tremendously.


I see your point. Although I disagree with you about Bird being less athletic than Parrish but that's irrelevant. I try not to put too much emphasis on verticle jump and while I agree that it is an indication of athleticism, its not the end all be all but I do see the point you are making.
You're exactly right about him not having the skill set of those players right now but I think another year at UK would really help him develope those skills. He did do a far better job at getting up the court this year compared to his freshman year and I would expect him to do even better next year.
Hey, it is what it is, I just disagree on this with most on here. Actually, I usually agree with a lot of posts of yours and others that feel the way you do. I greatly respect your opinion and you make some very valid and intelligent points. Disagreeing is bound to happen but I do find what your saying very informative and insightful. It simply that we disagree on this point, which is perfectly fine.
 
by returning......IMHO you are dead wrong. Could have improved in all facets of his game just by the fact of playing more and being a year older as he is still very young. If Dakari had of had a good season this year his dire combine numbers would not hurt him nearly as bad. I personally and have always thought that Dakari needed one more year in college and made a mistake in leaving. With increased confidence I really believe that Dakari would have been a special player by the end of next season and maybe even a lottery pick if he had stayed for his senior year. Just one fans opinion......
 
He had the "Lowest"24inches in the combine plus he was overweight! Huge mistake going pro! Mid to late second round! Then it is buy the " Rosette Tapes" to learn another language!
 
I see your point. Although I disagree with you about Bird being less athletic than Parrish but that's irrelevant. I try not to put too much emphasis on verticle jump and while I agree that it is an indication of athleticism, its not the end all be all but I do see the point you are making.
You're exactly right about him not having the skill set of those players right now but I think another year at UK would really help him develope those skills. He did do a far better job at getting up the court this year compared to his freshman year and I would expect him to do even better next year.
Hey, it is what it is, I just disagree on this with most on here. Actually, I usually agree with a lot of posts of yours and others that feel the way you do. I greatly respect your opinion and you make some very valid and intelligent points. Disagreeing is bound to happen but I do find what your saying very informative and insightful. It simply that we disagree on this point, which is perfectly fine.

I appreciate the positive comments. Everybody is entitled to their own opinion and you surely are as well and it leads to good discussions on this board in which I do enjoy partaking in. If everybody didn't have their own thoughts and opinions then it would be boring and nothing but cheerleaders instead of a discussion board.
One thing is for certain though and all cat fans agree with.. Dakari is an exceptional young man with a very warm heart and his mama raised him right. We all want him to succeed and live his dreams and make plenty of money while doing so. We are very fortunate to have such good kids come through our program and it is an honor to have those guys represent our program. :)
 
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In what career field would you voluntarily sacrifice a year of earning power?

A guy like Kendrick Perkins, who Dakari could have a similar career as, is making $10 million this year as a veteran big who doesn't even play much. You'd give up that year and $10 million to maybe go 8 spots higher and spend another year at Kentucky to make an extra few hundred thousand on the rookie deal?
Consider also the case of Montrezl Harrell. He was projected late lottery last year 12-15 range, and he came back to UofL with the stated goal of going top-8 in the draft. He came back and had his best statistical season, but dropped to a projected draft range of 23-30.

So not only did he waste a year (actually 2 years, he was a 1st rounder as a freshman) of earning capacity, but he will come in at a lower pay rate than he would have if he left earlier.

Frankly it amazes me how cavalier some posters are at gambling the careers and earnings of our players. Sure you can make an argument about why it *might* make sense to come back to college for a year. But if anyone was in their shoes, would they turn down a shot at a $4million/3 year contract? I wouldn't.
 
Consider also the case of Montrezl Harrell. He was projected late lottery last year 12-15 range, and he came back to UofL with the stated goal of going top-8 in the draft. He came back and had his best statistical season, but dropped to a projected draft range of 23-30.

So not only did he waste a year (actually 2 years, he was a 1st rounder as a freshman) of earning capacity, but he will come in at a lower pay rate than he would have if he left earlier.

Frankly it amazes me how cavalier some posters are at gambling the careers and earnings of our players. Sure you can make an argument about why it *might* make sense to come back to college for a year. But if anyone was in their shoes, would they turn down a shot at a $4million/3 year contract? I wouldn't.

I completely agree with what you wrote. Take the money while you can especially if you know about your own limitations and how coach tried his best to hide them. The longer you play the more of your game will be exposed.
It's not the kids fault its the NBA teams. I find it amazing that NBA teams will draft a kid that hasn't really shown or proven anything and pay him millions and then the kid sucks and is out of the league in 3 years. Why would teams do that? They must poo $100 bills or something in the toilets.
Back in the day in the draft their was like maybe 1 HS kid drafted every few years and very little underclassmen at all drafted. The NBA back then were much more careful at drafting players than now and the NBA was at its zenith in the 80's and started going out in the late 90's. At this time is when so many teams started drafting HS kids and unproven players from college.
 
He won't be more athletic next year, or 10 years from now for that matter. He is what he is. Every year he waits, he loses a year of earning money.

I really don't see how this is debatable.

Being more athletic isn't the point. You need to have some sort of basketball skill to make it in the NBA. Right now he doesn't have one. He had difficulty getting his shot off against 6'7" players. He won't last a practice in the NBA. Part of Dakari's problem is that right now he wouldn't play over Poythress or Skal either. Even though you can argue that his draft stock would fall some more if he didn't get play time next year as well I still don't think that not being about to get playing time in college is a good argument for going pro.

As for losing money, that would be a compelling case if he were projected as a top 10 pick. Dakari isn't. He may not get in the 1st round even. You only lose money if you are in the range where you are guaranteed to get paid in the first place. I don't see Dakari making an NBA roster next year. He might be able to make money playing in Europe or somewhere but now you are talking money that he can make up for by coming back. Getting drafted on potential is one thing if you are a top 15 pick. Being borderline to make the 1st round is another matter.
 
It's simple. Last year, Dakari was a garbage man, feasting on putbacks. He excelled in that role. This year, he posted up a lot. He struggled in that department.

This is correct.

In the 2014 season, over 40% of Dakari's shots at the rim came from putbacks while just 18% of his shots at the rim were of that variety last season. A combination of our roster and strategy pushed him into an outdated, mismatched role.
 
I completely agree with what you wrote. Take the money while you can especially if you know about your own limitations and how coach tried his best to hide them. The longer you play the more of your game will be exposed.
It's not the kids fault its the NBA teams. I find it amazing that NBA teams will draft a kid that hasn't really shown or proven anything and pay him millions and then the kid sucks and is out of the league in 3 years. Why would teams do that? They must poo $100 bills or something in the toilets.
Back in the day in the draft their was like maybe 1 HS kid drafted every few years and very little underclassmen at all drafted. The NBA back then were much more careful at drafting players than now and the NBA was at its zenith in the 80's and started going out in the late 90's. At this time is when so many teams started drafting HS kids and unproven players from college.
You lost me there at the end. The NBA currently has so many young and fun superstars. I would argue that this is a golden-age for the NBA. Lebron, Durant, Westbrook, Harden, Davis, Steph, Wall, Chris Paul, Blake Griffin...... Most of those players played 2 years or less in college. Steph had to play 3 whole seasons at Davidson.

NBA teams that are drafting at the end of the first round are simply looking for backups or rotation players. Very rarely does a team strike gold and draft a starter/all-star. So a team will either take a risk on a player they think could be a sleeper or simply look to fill a roster spot. Backup centers are a good risk. The last 3 picks in the 1st round over the past 5 years looks like this:

2010: Greivis Vasquez, Daniel Orton, and Lazar Hayward.
2011: Norris Cole, Cory Joseph, and Jimmy Butler
2012: Arnett Moultrie, Perry Jones, and Marguis Teague
2013: Rudy Gobert, Livio Jean-Charles, and Archie Goodwin
2014: Bogdan Bogdanovic, CJ Wilcox, and Josh Huestis

So basically you have a bunch of guys who produced next to nothing this year..... then Jimmy Butler and Rudy Gobert.
 
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