Do you go to Church?
- Thread starter Catfan in Tn.
- Start date
Being critical and argumentative are pretty much the foundations of science.
Yes, but I don't think its in concrete per se. I think we are given different opportunities in life and along the way we make decisions based on our circumstances which are sometimes good/bad or right/wrong and from there we have a path. I do not think he gives up on us and I think he continues to give us chance after chance no matter what.
Sometimes I think the things we go through in life are due to our good/bad decisions. Then he blesses us accordingly or we feel his wrath as he shakes out our life's when we are on the wrong path.
That's vague, as is most anything dealing with religion because you do have to have a large percentage of blind faith.
Man, that is why I can't understand that an all-loving creator would create something that would set us up for possible failure. Why not create mankind without sin if that is the end goal? Why put people up to temptation? To me that is a kinda dirty trap. I didn't asked to be put in the position to make the right choice. My two parents determined that for me. If I had choice that would save me from that crazy ass choice, then I would rather not be born at all. Heisman, that's my dilemma. Hedge my bet on some goatherders word (when god could apparently make his appearance then but can't in 2015) from 2000 years ago or go on enjoying a sinful life or having the choice to not even born at all to avoid the Christian death trap? Kinda wished I was toilet-dropped miscarriage.
So kids who are raped, tortured, and murdered before the age of 6 have a plan? Kids who are sold into sex slavery have a plan? Kids who are indoctrinated to be terrorists and criminals have a plan?
No that is people being victims of the Devils evil doings. There is evil everywhere and we live in a world that can easily turn good people/innocent people into victims and it sucks.
Now, some of those things, not the children stuff, but the sex slavery is people(yes sometimes kids) lured by the devil by hormones they have towards people that are evil and have nothing but evil planned. It's not to say God is punishing them but he has warned about downfalls of certain decisions. It's a poor excuse but let's use that girl that disappeared on spring break a few years back as an example. Something very bad happened there but she was lured by the devil and probably thought she was more of an adult than she was and the evil people she trusted took advantage. Awful awful thing that happened and Id personally like to see the people quilts of whatever happened dead, but they also know or were related to high political people that covered up their evil.
To me this is how God works, he was willing to forgive the guilty there and hopefully they change though I don't think they deserve it. However they committed more crimes recently I believe and they are now not so lucky and in prison, I think I saw or read something about that.
Now let me ask you, do you have children? Do you think you can stop them from doing everything they shouldn't? How will you handle that? Will you give up on them when they lie, cheat, steal, do drugs, make bad decisions, have sex before they are really ready to handle the consequences? You just going to give up on them or still love them and hope they learn and try to teach them there is a better way and why it's a better way?
Not relevant to my point. If I was all knowing, the nature of everything good and righteous, and I had the power to stop atrocities from happening, to prevent people from doing harm to innocent people then you can bet I would use it. If the devil is responsible, as you say, then why not do away with him? Better yet, why even allow him to have this power to begin with? There are so many holes in this plot.
It is relevant to believers, you choose not to believe and that's ok, no problem with that. I answered your question, but when asked a question you get defensive which is no big deal other than you just want to knock the belief because of the holes in it. Which I have said it takes a large percentage of blind faith and there is no absolute.
How do you know ones character if you take all that can be bad away? Sheltering souls is no way truly knowing the person. We are sinful by nature but we also can grow stronger to not fall victim to reckless acts because of learned lessons from what those sins bring.
How do you know ones character if you take all that can be bad away? Sheltering souls is no way truly knowing the person. We are sinful by nature but we also can grow stronger to not fall victim to reckless acts because of learned lessons from what those sins bring.
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Man has free will to choose good or evil. When evil is chosen, those around it suffer the consequences of the evil now and the future. If all evil causes harm where is the line drawn of what God allows and doesnt allow? Do lesser evils not lead to more severe evils? Remove evil acts by man and where does "free will to choose" go? It doesnt exist. Sure God had plans for chose children, but it was cut short by the evil that man does...not God. Its the evil heart of man that is granted free will to choose then blames God for allowing evil. And FWIW, God promises severe consequences for those who commit evil acts against the innocent children. See Mark 9 and make your own conclusion.
I think the parent/God analogy is a good one. If you accept that God created us in His image, God has emotions, shows love, wants us to love Him in return, shows righteous anger etc, not unlike us, and yet is still God.
I like this take on things by Phillip Yancey.
“In a nutshell, the Bible from Genesis 3 to Revelation 22 tells the story of a God reckless with desire to get his family back.”
I like this take on things by Phillip Yancey.
“In a nutshell, the Bible from Genesis 3 to Revelation 22 tells the story of a God reckless with desire to get his family back.”
Ok. Let's run with your free will argument. Let's go back to those indoctrinated kids. If you are recruited, taught and trained at a very young age to believe that another race, religion, or group of people is evil and that we must eliminate them in the name of whatever or whomever, then doesn't that take away your free will? It also brings into the argument the definition of good and evil. What is good? To the little kid that grows up to mass murder people in the name of allah, he is good. He believes that we are the evil ones.
Well that's why he isn't christian. That said God will forgive him if he repents for those sins. God/Jesus does not ask us to kill, it's one of Ten Commandments, so those trained to kill and oppress Christians can do so but if they are in the wrong it is gods wrath they will face. He will protect his people somehow some way, and that's part of the blind faith he teaches with David/Goliath and Noah etc.
Good is taught in the bible, and I assume your an adult, pretty sure "good" is something your knowledgable on.
Good is taught in the bible, and I assume your an adult, pretty sure "good" is something your knowledgable on.
I believe we are not beholden to any belief simply because we are born into a specific culture or faith tradition. We are not obligated to live our lives blindly. God grants us the ability to reason and research in our free will. I doubt few will reject Christianity because they never heard of it.
There's only so much emotion a parent can exhibit before the cops come and remove the kids from the house.
What is the likelihood that you would ever even consider reading one single word of the koran, buddhavacana, vedas or even the book of mormon, much less think of converting to Islam, Judaism, Buddhism, Hinduism or any other major religion? I'd say 0%. And you know why? Because you were born in the US, into a Christian culture and, I'm guessing, Protestant tradition. Same goes for people born on various other continents. Geography.
Why should I convert if I have faith in Christianity?
So people on various other continents have never heard of Jesus Christ and Christianity? Theyve never had the free will to choose Christianity over a traditional or cultural belief? I guess there are no Christians in Africa or Asia? Geography isnt the obstacle you make it to be. Missionaries.
So you're saying these kids have the ability to change? I disagree. If you're recruited at the age of 5 and 6 and then indoctrinated to believe something, you're highly unlikely to deviate. Especially if the consequences are death.
Yep. There was a study that proved this. Called "Princess Alice Is Watching You"
Read the Abstract to this study. National Institute of Health.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21377689
I didn't say you should convert. But you said "God grants us the ability to reason and research in our free will." They've had the free will to choose Christianity, but don't because of their culture/geography. Just like you've had the free will to investigate Mohammed, Buddha, Ganesha, Shiva, Surya, etc., but haven't because of culture/geography.
If you put a stack of Bibles in mosques or temples around the world, no one would read them and they would quickly be destroyed. The same thing would happen in churches around the world to non-Christian religious texts.
I'm not criticizing your choices or beliefs. I just want you to admit that you didn't reach them by using reason and free will to research all other options; you were born into them.
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That's not completely true. We are a lot more diverse in country on religion as opposed to some of those places. I wasn't forced into ChriStianity, and to be honest some people I know say I'm no christian at all because I'm not completely black and white on every issue. Radicals are scary in every culture.
To answer the other question, no drowning a child is not love, quite the opposite to be honest.
To answer the other question, no drowning a child is not love, quite the opposite to be honest.
Do you really believe God would create nations of people with no chance of ever finding Christianity just to fill up hell? My free will to follow Christianity has nothing to do with culture/geography. Your assuming my life experience is limited.
All 3 main religions recognize the same Old Testament God. Did he really create nations of people with no chance of finding Islam or Judaism just to fill up hell? How many times have you read the koran? How many times have you met with a rabbi or ulama?
Check.
What about a parent who lets their fine upstanding child be sent to a concentration camp to be tortured solely because the child doesn't accept the parent as theirs? Is this an act of love?
Why does God allow all the bad stuff to happen?
God doesn't rule the natural world of mankind. The Devil or Satan is the prince of this natural world according to Jesus.
Christians are chosen out of it, but must continue to live in it. They are like sheep to the slaughter.
Considering these two statements it's clear why mankind is cruel to each other.
The parable about plucking out your eyes etc...
The body represents a church or the body of Christ.
The eyes represent the pastor and hands represent the deacons of a
Church. If they willingly commit offenses or trespasses they are to be removed from the church. Corinthians covers these offenses and the excluding of members who are out of order.
No one is above another in the church, all members should follow what's written as far as behavior.
The church is to judge its members with a righteous judgement. Those who are not members God judges not the church. The offenses and trespasses are tests to try the church to see if it follows God or man.
Just a few thoughts about some of the questions asked here.
God doesn't rule the natural world of mankind. The Devil or Satan is the prince of this natural world according to Jesus.
Christians are chosen out of it, but must continue to live in it. They are like sheep to the slaughter.
Considering these two statements it's clear why mankind is cruel to each other.
The parable about plucking out your eyes etc...
The body represents a church or the body of Christ.
The eyes represent the pastor and hands represent the deacons of a
Church. If they willingly commit offenses or trespasses they are to be removed from the church. Corinthians covers these offenses and the excluding of members who are out of order.
No one is above another in the church, all members should follow what's written as far as behavior.
The church is to judge its members with a righteous judgement. Those who are not members God judges not the church. The offenses and trespasses are tests to try the church to see if it follows God or man.
Just a few thoughts about some of the questions asked here.
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I guess I don't understand this one. Biologically speaking a child doesn't accept the parent as theirs? So the parent sends them off to a concentration camp? Or is the kid acting like an out of control jackass therefore forcing the parents in a situation to do that out of tough love in order to hopefully discipline the child like a military school would do?
Like I said I don't see some things so clear cut.
Like I said I don't see some things so clear cut.
Pretty sure Jews wont be filling up hell. I think the real question here being how many times have you read the Bible?
In my question, the child's only "fault" is to not accept his parent as being his parent. The child is a stellar person and fine contributing member to society. The parent lets the child be sent to a concentration camp to be tortured solely because the child "rejects" the idea that this is his parent. I'll also add that the parent has not ever made any contact with the child.
Is this an act of love by the parent?
John 14:6
Zachoriah 12:10
There is only one way to heaven, through Jesus Christ. Pretty simple really.
He is getting somewhere with his point, very slowly!
Ida, Why would a perfectly mannered and great member of society not claim his parents as his? Just seems weird.
Sounds like your getting to a point where maybe just maybe your going to compare this child sent off to Jesus christ........is that what your doing here?
Ida, Why would a perfectly mannered and great member of society not claim his parents as his? Just seems weird.
Sounds like your getting to a point where maybe just maybe your going to compare this child sent off to Jesus christ........is that what your doing here?
